Support thread for those in Emotionally Abusive Relationships - thread 29

[CharlotteCollins]

Am I being abused?

Verbal Abuse A wonderfully non-hysterical summary. If you're unsure, read the whole page and see if you're on it.
Emotional abuse from the same site as above
Emotional abuse a more heartfelt description
A check list Use this site for some concise diagnostic lists and support
Signs of Abuse & Control Useful check list
Why financial abuse is domestic violence Are you a free ride for a cocklodger, or supposed to act grateful for every penny you get for running the home?
Women's Aid: "What is Domestic Violence?" This is also, broadly, the Police definition.
Warning signs you’re dating a loser Exactly what it says on the tin

Books :

"Why Does He Do That?" by Lundy Bancroft - The eye-opener. Read this if you read nothing else.
"The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans He wants power OVER you and gets angry when you prove not to be the dream woman who lives only in his head.
"The Verbally Abusive Man, Can He Change?" by Patricia Evans Answer: Perhaps - ONLY IF he recognises HIS issues, and if you can be arsed to work through it. She gives explicit guidelines.
"Men who hate women and the women who love them" by Susan Forward. The author is a psychotherapist who realised her own marriage was abusive, so she's invested in helping you understand yourself just as much as helping you understand your abusive partner.
"The Emotionally Abusive Relationship: How to Stop Being Abused and How to Stop Abusing" by Beverley Engels The principle is sound, if your partner isn't basically an arse, or disordered.
"Codependent No More : How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself" by Melody Beattie If you’re a rescuer, you're a co-dependent. It's a form of addiction! This book will help you.
But whatever you do, don't blame yourself for being co-dependent!

Websites :

So, you're in love with a narcissist - Snarky, witty, angry, but also highly intelligent: very good for catharsis
Dr Irene's verbal abuse site - motherly advice to readers' write-ins from a caring psychotherapist; can be a pain to navigate but very validating stuff
Out of the fog - and now for the science bit! Clinical, dispassionate, and very informative website on the various forms of personality disorders and how they impact on family and intimate relationships.
Get your angries out - You may not realise it yet, but you ARE angry. Find out in what unhealthy ways your anger is expressing itself. It has probably led you to staying in an unhealthy relationship.
Melanie Tonia Evans is a woman who turned her recovery from abuse into a business. A little bit "woo" and product placement-tastic, but does contain a lot of useful articles.
Love fraud - another site by one woman burned by an abusive marriage
You are not crazy - one woman's experience. She actually has recordings of her and her abusive partner having an argument, so you can hear what verbal abuse sounds like. A pain to navigate, but well worth it.
Baggage reclaim - Part advice column, part blog on the many forms of shitty relationships.
Heart to heart - a wealth of information and personal experiences drawn together in one place

What couples therapy does for abusers

If you find that he really wants to change
Should I Stay or Should I Go bonus materials This is a site containing material for men who want to change - please don’t give him the link - print out the content for him to work through.

The Bill of Rights
What you should expect as a starting point for your treatment in a relationship, as you will of course be treating others!!

Yep. He's already raised that flag too, mentioning a possible "disruption" in the child maintenance payments, as he doesn't have a job. That would be because he QUIT his job and moved. FW. Now he'll play the "I don't have a job and me and the OW are supporting her 3 kids, so I don't have the extra money." In theory, his OW should be getting maintenance from the fathers of her children, not using it as a means to avoid paying maintenance. But he will.

It shouldn't surprise me. It shouldn't even bother me, but for a man who wittered on and on about how "the men in our family would never abandon their families" and how "oh, being with OW now will not interfere with my relationship with my DCs, as we've already discussed it." Prat. So he hasn't seen them or spoken to them at all in 6 weeks. And no plans to see them in the near future.

Predictions:

• he will stop paying child maintenance for above reasons
• he won't ring or visit the DCs until their birthdays in the summer
• he will complain when I don't send him anything from them on Father's Day in June.

And it'll be All. My. Fault. (of course)

I don't actually want to see him anyway, nor do I want him around the DCs. He's aggressive and abusive, with a dreadful history of treating them badly. But it's just the idea that he can just pretend they don't exist from day to day, and then whinge to everyone that will listen that he's a wonderful father but his bitch of an ex won't let him see the DCs (because in his alternate reality he thinks I'm jealous of the OW). It doesn't seem to connect that I actually don't want him to see them because he's abusive. Because he doesn't think he is.

Ah, I'm curious to see if my crystal ball is right. Time will tell.

honey yes, I hear you on that. FW had a mobile bill of almost £300 this month, almost certainly from porn, and apparently bought his "fiancé" an engagement ring. But he isn't sure he can pay his child maintenance. Priorities.

please don't torture yourself any more Alice about what a FW the FW is.

I think they all pretty much shout as loud as they can about what a bitch the ex is, how mad, how abusive, which in itself is a pretty abusive way to be going on and sadly many don't see that, and there's nothing we can do about that apart from staying out of earshot as much as possible.

... and yes, of course, its definitely all our fault, always.

I was told the FW had left work, he hadn't, so I contacted CSA, and in the end they contacted his work as he put the phone down on them and refused to answer any further calls. The csa, as was, takes a 15% deduction to make allowances for any DC that he lives with. Its a little horrific that he's already living with another woman and her DC! but also par for the course for a FW. Constantly trying to line up the next one to continue FWittery upon.

She sadly has all this to come, I would love to be able to visit a website containing a FW Gallery so i could check-out any future ventures, don't feel able to check that out for myself.

Fi oh I know. I wanted to get it in writing. I'll revisit it in a few months time to see if I'm right. I bet I am.

It's ridiculous that he gets a 15% deduction for children he lives with. They're not HIS children, and presumably she is getting maintenance from the fathers for them, so why should MY children be the ones out money?? It makes no sense whatsoever. You can tell MEN made these laws.

Don't worry. I've vented somewhere. I feel a bit better.

yes, I have spoken to CSA very helpful ladies about this too, as yes the mother is getting full maintenance for them, so she has two father's supporting, one theirs and one someone else's. The man at CSA that I spoke to about this, however took a very dim view of me, accusing me of money grabbing, hmm... a FW me thinks speaking like this to women scared of being without any financial support to keep roof over heads!

i think it might be 20% for 3 children! that is taken off first, then whats left is calculated for the father's real DC. Its shocking when you consider that so many 'D'Fs are not paying for their own DC and yet other's DCs are put above their own??? very queer indeed, especially ,as you say that the actual DF is already paying. Its a subversive tax on single mums it would seem.

Stbxh hasn't given me a penny since we separated. Maintenance services were supposed to call me and didn't. I contacted them and was told because he's on jsa I'd get next to nothing from him, like it wasn't worth the paperwork on their part. So I dropped it.

Amazing how he's able to afford at least two nights out a week but often doesn't have bus fare to visit our DC. Putting his social life above our DC isn't a new thing so it doesn't surprise me.

On an entirely different note, a male friend I've had for a while has started showing more interest of late and has asked me out a few times. I've tried to make it clear that I'm not in the best place emotionally, and that I want to concentrate on myself and my babies. He's fine with just chatting then gets persistent again. I like having a natter with him but I'm not emotionally equiped to deal with someone like this right now and I'm finding it difficult to stand my ground and say thanks but no thanks as just when I think I've successfully explained my position to him, he asks me out again! Sad to think I'll probably have to cut him loose as a friend but I'm all walls up and in protective mode right now. Or am I being a wimp?

No CurtWild if you're not ready, you're not ready. It's entirely up to you. If he isn't giving you the space you need, isn't that a bit of a red flag?

alice this is what I'm trying to convey to him. It's very early in my separation, I'm not even sure I'll ever fully trust my judgement with regard to men again! I thought I'd made it clear in as kind a way as possible that I'm happy to be his friend but that's all I can offer. It is a red flag, that he backs off then a couple of days later it's like he's dismissed what I said. It doesn't matter how breezy and uninvolved I keep my texts, he always manages to turn it towards 'getting back on the horse' or 'not letting yourself go to waste' which I thought was a bit bleurgh.

I haven't made excuses not to see him, I've been as upfront as possible without bearing my soul. It's one more complication I can live without.

Eeewwww... it sounds like one of those that chats up recent divorcees to get easy sex. I'd be tempted to just tell him to walk on and then go no contact with him. He's being pushy and doesn't have your best interests at heart. Big. Red. Flag.

Funnily enough that's exactly what I've been thinking alice, we were fb friends because he used to work with stbxh and we'd been introduced at a work do. We chatted occasionally on there and he commented quite a bit on my pics.
I messaged a couple of people on fb to say I was deactivating and gave them my number, but not him. Apparently he then messaged a mutual friend asking where my account had gone and they saw fit to pass my number on to him .
Actually reading that back it sounds a bit stalkery! After normal chatty texts for a while, he then ramps it up. I think you're right, he reckons I'm newly separated single mum and probably gagging for it . Oh dear. I think it's blocking time.

I blocked his number from calling me. If I text him to say back off can I then block him from texting if he won't go away?

Just block him. no explanation needed. You don;t owe him and you don't want him. Give him no head space or any of your precious time.

You've told him No. No other explanation is needed. No is a complete sentence. You don't need to tell him why or explain any further. Just NO. So just block him completely and put it out of your head.

This "need to explain" thing is a symptom of having been with a FW. I found myself constantly trying to explain things when he got irritated, like it would help or something. it never did.

Normal people can take a knock back when asking someone out without needing an explanation.

I always had to explain myself to stbxh and I've found myself doing it again. I also think I've given this guy the label 'friend' far too easily. A friend would understand when I said it's far too soon for me to be dating. They wouldn't pressure me. And I wouldn't have to keep reminding them I can't just drop everything when I feel like it because I have 3 babies!!
I just won't respond to him. I'm getting used to ignoring texts from stbxh and I've already blocked the guy from calling. You're right, I don't need to explain, I don't owe him anything, the attention was nice but unwanted. I'm sure he's a very nice guy but it's the last thing I need right now.

I'm looking at getting a new mobile, and am going to get a new phone number as well. Everyone will get it except STBXH. He'll be the only one with the old number so I can limit the contact accordingly.

Alice -- thanks for asking.

I need to get another job before I can do anything about it. Present job doesn't pay enough.

There are settled times amongst the bad and I have some coping strategies, which sometimes means I have to go along with what he wants. Testing how far I can resist and trying to find happiness in small things and with other people in my life.

parapet and if you resist too far once? Just worried that you're walking a very fine line there. I won't ask "are you safe" because in my experience, most women think they are, even when they're not. So I will say "please make sure you stay safe."

Alice - so true :(

Alice, I think I am safe but I hear what you say. I think having DS here helps. Partly because there is someone else here for us both to focus on, and partly because I don't think H would go too far with DS here. In the "settled" times I am ok. Thanks for your concern.

I identify with your feeling that you had to explain things. Sometimes I have had to do that too.

What do you think is appropriate lead in time for contact visits? STBXH has left a message for me basically saying I'm in town next I want to see the kids I will let you know what days." Excuse me!??!!

It's term break - I've planned activities for all next week - we're not even going to be home that much! I am not about to cancel the activities I've planned just because he's dropped in unannounced.

Surely it's appropriate to set up REGULAR contact visits, or give at least 2-3 weeks notice of when he is going to be in the area and it can be at my convenience.

Oh, and it's not going to be at my house either. Public place only.

sorry, typo.... in town next week.

Don't change your plans alice. He doesn't get to have you drop everything just because he'll be in town. He chose to move away.

I managed to (finally) communicate this to stbxh and after a bit of foot stomping and a few tantrums, he seemed to realise I meant business. If he can't make wednesday then he doesn't get to expect me to shuffle my week to suit him. If he asks if we can make it another day in good time, then I accomodate him as best I can. This was after he told me he wouldn't see DC unless I contacted him. I waited it out and he finally got in touch.
'Persistent guy' wanted to know why I wasn't responding to his texts. I told him I thought it was best if we didn't chat anymore as he obviously doesn't know what 'NO' means. He text that he thought he'd been more than patient and how long was it going to take to get over x ..blah blah blah pleading his case for the next hour while I ignored him. He ended up calling me a stupid bitch. He most certainly didn't have my best interests at heart and it's just served to put me off further!

I'm not going to change our plans, but he's sure to kick off again. This is just ridiculous. I haven't bothered to answer the message, as he hasn't even stated what days, and I'm curious to see how long he waits before he tells me his "intended" day of contact. He usually waits until a day or so before, and that's just not acceptable. I have a life and we have plans, and I am not just dropping everything because he cannot arrange regular contact.

CurtWild he thought that he'd been more than patient?? What a prat!!! There's his true colours, isn't it?