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Trump (Part 4)

1000 replies

claig · 04/12/2016 19:37

Continuing discussion of the Trumpquake and populist rebellions

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Missswatch · 04/12/2016 19:40

The Green Party just dropped its recount suit in Pennsylvania and is losing votes in Wisconsin recount. Just a Stein scam to raise money!

Trump on Twitter

claig · 04/12/2016 19:44

Great news, Missswatch

Looks like they have failed to stop Trump.

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Missswatch · 04/12/2016 19:46

Time to bottle some liberal tears

claig · 04/12/2016 20:13

"Matteo Renzi's future in the balance amid high turnout in Italy referendum
...
Early voter turnout results in Italy showed a high level of interest in Sunday’s referendum on constitutional reforms, with one top official in Matteo Renzi’s campaign predicting the results would be close.
Italy heads to the polls: 'We are playing for the next 20 years' – Renzi
Read more

The figures indicated that, in a contest that is seen as a bitter fight between the centre-left Renzi government and rising anti-establishment, Eurosceptic, and anti-immigrant parties, Italians turned out in high numbers despite earlier indications that up to a quarter of Italian voters had been undecided. "

www.theguardian.com/world/2016/dec/04/matteo-renzis-future-in-the-balance-amid-high-turnout-in-italy-referendum

Polls close at 23.00 and votes should be counted 4 or 5 hours later.

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WouldHave · 04/12/2016 20:22

From the previous thread:

I think I can spot when he is lying (which is quite rare) and when he is telling it like it is.

Claig, in the run-up to the elections, on every one of the countless occasions when Trump was caught out in a falsehood or inconsistency, you said that was fine, he lied, you had no problem with that. You can't now claim that it's rare, because otherwise you will have to accept that he is a fantasist who says the first thing that enters his head.

UncontrolledImmigrant · 04/12/2016 20:25

Continuing from my post on the previous thread, I find this quotation from Sartre's Antisemite and Jew (1944) appropriate:

Trump (Part 4)
UncontrolledImmigrant · 04/12/2016 20:28

As to challenging them online, I wouldn't bother. I would organise, forge links with others who are also anti fascist, and generally be ready to put myself on the line when required

I am never going to convince or argue anyone out of their bad faith awfulness, it us a waste of energy to try when I could be productively fighting their ideology elsewhere.

claig · 04/12/2016 20:31

Uncontrolled, control yourself. Donald J Trump is not an antisemite, he is the next President of the United States. Have some respect for the American people and have a day off.

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claig · 04/12/2016 20:33

'Claig, in the run-up to the elections, on every one of the countless occasions when Trump was caught out in a falsehood or inconsistency, you said that was fine, he lied, you had no problem with that. '

Because they were nearly all jokes, not serious. They were exaggerations rather than attempts to mislead. Trump likes having a laugh. That is his style.

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WouldHave · 04/12/2016 20:36

A falsehood is a falsehood, claig. Trump only claimed they were jokes when he was caught out, it was so transparent.

SwedishEdith · 04/12/2016 20:42
claig · 04/12/2016 20:42

Trump said that global warming is a hoax cooked up by the Chinese to damage American industry.

The mainstream media, eager to pounce on any Trump statement to do a "gotcha" and display to the public why Trump was "unfit" as all the Establishment puppet politicians had been primed to say, duly pounced on this statement and tried to frighten their readers with it.

Everyone with an ounce of common sense, i.e. every not employed by the Guardian, knew it was a joke and that although global warming was indeed a hoax, it had nothing to do with the Chinese and they themselves had been hoodwinked to believe in it.

The hysterical cries of the media and the Guardian's Environmental Department, and their inability to understand what every common sense person understood, only ended up ruining the credibility of the Establishment in the eyes of common sense voters, thus leading to Hillary Clinton's downfall.

The media never learn which is why Trump, in an attempt to be polite, called them "a room full of liars" rather than what he could have called them.

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InformalRoman · 04/12/2016 20:44

Of course Trump isn't a liar - he's just living in a parallel reality where his facts are different to everyone else's facts.

That's got to be the explanation, right? Why else would someone so shamelessly lie and lie and lie about things that are so easily shown to be counter to reality?

Unless they just don't care and have no respect for the truth ...

claig · 04/12/2016 20:49

Have you got a single example of one of what the mainstream media calls his "lies"?

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Roussette · 04/12/2016 20:51

Swedish Thank you so much for that link. There are some sane people left.

SwedishEdith · 04/12/2016 20:52

Uncontrolled - read that Sartre extract and then read an Arron Banks tweet.

Arron Banks
‏@Arron_banks Arron Banks Retweeted Sebastian Payne
You can't always get it right - I suppose they haven't suffered enough rape and murder yet.

Sebastian Payne @SebastianEPayne
Mystic Farage's prediction on Austria hasn't stood the test of time well

UncontrolledImmigrant · 04/12/2016 20:59

Be sure not to control yourself, claig

Make sure you are being just as vocal in your everyday life, it will make you that much more easily identified, and challenged robustly, when the time comes

InformalRoman · 04/12/2016 21:00

Yes claig:

“We should have never gone into Iraq. I’ve said it loud and clear. I was visited by people from the White House asking me to sort of, could I be silenced because I seem to get a disproportionate amount of publicity. I mean, I was very strong, though: ‘You’re going to destabilize the Middle East.’”
— Businessman Donald Trump, interview on Fox News, Oct. 6, 2015

Howard Stern asks Trump directly if he was for invading Iraq:
“Yeah, I guess so,” Trump responded. “I wish the first time it was done correctly.”
— Businessman Donald Trump, interview with Howard Stern, Sept 11, 2002

claig · 04/12/2016 21:03

'Make sure you are being just as vocal in your everyday life, it will make you that much more easily identified, and challenged robustly, when the time comes'

Do you mean the time the Blairites take over and lock up anyone who takes the piss out of Antonio Bliar? Trump said "not gonna happen any more". Trump is on our side, he is with the people. Trump will never let the Blairites take our free speech.

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claig · 04/12/2016 21:08

InformalRoman, that is not a lie. Trump hummed and hawed about it in 2002 on the Howard Stern show, he hadn't given it deep thought, but he is notoriously inconsistent on lots of issues which is why every world bleeder and member of the Establishment is employing a team of 200 trying to fathom what Trump will do, and they are still all clueless.

At other times, Trump said he was against it, that is why what he said in 2015 was not a lie, because he had changed his position.

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UncontrolledImmigrant · 04/12/2016 21:11

Keep your free speech, it makes you nice and obvious

fascists and their supporters always get theirs in the end

There may be a lamppost with your name on it

claig · 04/12/2016 21:12

Have you seen the Blairites' tweets about Donald J Trump, 45th President of the United States? The Blairites are "aghast" at nearly everything Trump tweets. That is why we the people love Trump, he refuses to "let the buggers grind him down".

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claig · 04/12/2016 21:19

'There may be a lamppost with your name on it'

I may well have written some graffiti on a lampost when I was young that said "claig woz here", so what? who hasn't when they were young?

Surely, even a Blairite won't "make me get mine in the end" for that. I was young, I didn't know no better, I didn't know you had to vote for Blair, I swear, guv, on my life, please have mercy Judge Antonio Bliar. I only wanted to be free, I thought it was England, land of the free, the Magnum Carter, not a Stasi socialist Blairite DNA database, biometric Blairite Big Brother state. I didn't know that if you wrote your name on a lamppost that a Blairite boot would stamp on your face forever.

I read Orwell, I know he was called Blair, but I didn't realise he was writing about Blair.

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InformalRoman · 04/12/2016 21:20

Yeah right claig. Trump was called on it. He lied.

Kaija · 04/12/2016 21:20

"InformalRoman, that is not a lie"

It is. A completely incontrovertibly black-is-white lie. Obviously.

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