How do autism bashing threads make you feel?

[BarrowInFurnessRailwayStation]

Haven't had one in a while, but there's a pretty representative one going on in AIBU atm.

How do these make you feel?

I feel angry and go kind of hot and cold inside. I know it's not worth arguing on them anymore, but they're referring to me and my ds when they're saying the terrible things they're saying. Autism is who I am as a person, ergo I'm a terrible person who doesn't deserve to exist. I deserved to be abused and drugged when I was a kid. I deserved to be bullied throughout school and in adulthood. I'm a nuisance, a waste of space, a burden, someone who shouldn't be treading the earth. People hate me because of what I am.

Sure, people should have a space to talk about how their kid's difficulties affect them, but should they be allowed to generalise about the condition?

Autistic people who can express themselves, like us, are truly despised and dismissed. We're the lowest of the low by not following the narrative of autism is awful.

I feel bad for ds because this is how people feel about autistics

It's my birthday today. A reminder that I shouldn't have ever been born.

They’re absolutely DETERMINED to undermine us. They are unable to reflect/acknowledge their own prejudice. That’s the problem.

And yet they fall over themselves to be seen to be right on in other areas and to other minority people. Just shows how despised we are that they feel comfortable being so offensive about this one group. Adhd seems to be copping it as well lately.

I've been here a long time and it's been going on for a long time

I’ve been on here a long time as well - deregistered and have had to re-register.

I don’t see much difference in the language- there were always problems with ableism, it’s why the special needs children topic was kept off of the main feed and was opt in rather than automatic.

But I still think you are really making a huge logical leap to “ASD bashing” when some do find parenting children with Autism difficult. And I use second person for ASD because the people in my life prefer not to be referred to as Autistic and don’t identify with Autism in the way that you do.

And yet they fall over themselves to be seen to be right on in other areas and to other minority people. Just shows how despised we are that they feel comfortable being so offensive about this one group. Adhd seems to be copping it as well lately.

Yes exactly - the audacity with which they feel they can insult us demonstrates the prejudice nicely. Agree re adhd too.

They are completely enabled by MN - they are allowed to hide in plain sight.

They are completely enabled by MN - they are allowed to hide in plain sight.

Why stay if you believe that you are seeing such extreme levels of prejudice? I left (quietly) once as the ableism got to me. If someone genuinely believes that they are part of a group that allows them to be marginalised to the point of implying that they should not be born, why would you stay?

I just now reported an ableist post and was deleted straight away. I assume you all report ableism and prejudiced posts?

@FirstGenerationMortificado

Please stop trying to derail from the point of this thread - autistic people discussing how the autism-bashing impacts them. I totally respect that parents of autistic children can have an incredibly hard life. I am in no position to comment on their lives and at no point have tried to tell them how to feel (eg I absolutely despise the “autism is a gift” crap and can see why that must feel so insulting). But equally, non-autistic people - which includes parents of these children - are in no position to comment on the hardships and ableism we constantly face as autistic adults without learning difficulties ie what was formerly diagnosed as Asperger syndrome (as I was). . Please respect that.

I've just been down a 5 hour rabbit hole about autism and neanderthals 🤣
Thanks Barrow, I've not hyperfocused in a good while.

Why stay if you believe that you are seeing such extreme levels of prejudice?

I can’t believe you’ve actually posted that. That’s a disgraceful comment.

@cheeseismydownfall

DD's best friend has an autism. They adore each other, are utterly on the same wavelength, and have never once fallen out in the many years of their friendship. I don't know if DD even knows about her friend's diagnosis. It is irrelevant. Personally I am so thankful that DD has such a great friend, and if her autism is part of what makes her such a fantastic mate then great.

On the other hand, I have another friend whose mental health and marriage have been utterly devastated caring for a child with very profound learning difficulties as a result of autism. He will need round the clock care for the rest of his life.

I cannot see how you could possibly compare the two situations, and that if your experience of being ND is closer to the first example, how you could possibly take offense to someone discussing the challenges associated with raising a child with needs like my friend's. The word 'autism' is pretty much the only thing in common between them.

Correct me if I’m wrong but does one have “autism” and one have “autism + learning difficulties” ?

I’m listening to a lot of autism talks at the moment and this seems to be the difference between those that can appear to function easily and those that appear to have more difficulty. (Within these there are of course so many variations of behaviour).

These are what I’m listening to:

youtube.com/c/NASSouthHampshire

(My family are turning out to be ND)

@Scautish

Why stay if you believe that you are seeing such extreme levels of prejudice?

I can’t believe you’ve actually posted that. That’s a disgraceful comment.

Only because I left MN after trying to ignore and/or report the ableism towards Autism and it became too much so I left. I wasn’t making a rhetorical question, I was being genuine. MN wasn’t changing and the ableism was too much for me to cope with so I left. There were numerous threads with MNHQ trying to address the ableism to no avail. So why stay.

But as some feel that I am de-railing the thread (and I think I might be) then I will bow out. I don’t want to cause more stress anyway.

I can’t believe you’ve actually posted that. That’s a disgraceful comment.

I agree.

@FirstGenerationMortificado

I have left, deregistered etc but came back as though it’s hurtful and horrible, I found myself unable to stand by and came back. I have always fought for causes/the underdog. I just can’t stand back on this matter. But most of all, my sons are autistic and I do not want them to face the prejudice seen here. They are kind, caring and sensitive boys and they will be destroyed if they end up with one of the types on the support threads and elsewhere here.

I suspect things are not going to change for a while but I hope that one day, some of the moderators at MNHQ look back with shame at what they patronisingly explained to me as “not ableist”, at the time they told me to “hide the thread if it’s upsetting you - we can show you how” and how they have told me several times that they are discussing the issue and then do nothing and ignore me when I ask for an update.

I hope that one day they realise they are up there with the racists, the misogynists, the anti-semites etc. Because they are enabling a hatred that does and will continue to impact thousands of children in the future and that is incredible when it claims to be a place of support for parents.

I hope that one day they realise they are up there with the racists, the misogynists, the anti-semites etc. Because they are enabling a hatred that does and will continue to impact thousands of children in the future and that is incredible when it claims to be a place of support for parents.

Hear, hear 👏

WTAF was all that pile-on about? there are some seriously unpleasant M'netters about out there, and they are not very well educated on a subject they seem awfully opinionated on.

I wasn't about yesterday as work and tiredness got the best of me, I'm sorry about that. I don't normally cope well with confrontation, but why are these people posting here?

Anyway @BarrowInFurnessRailwayStation, I'm sorry I missed your birthday, I think you are bloody brilliant, I am so glad I have met you on here, you have done so much work on this board and are most knowledgeable - it is a welcome respite to me from a crazy world and and the first time for years I have felt accepted anywhere.

The. Ableism. Is. Awful.

As an autistic adult I want to make it stop for the young uns. It's really hard though. People just see it as totally normal and I too for years had/have, as I call it, internalised ableism.

I want to discipline my kids in a way that makes sense for their developmental path but there is no baseline for them other than by comparison to NT kids. So how can I avoid passing on the internalised ablism, while enforcing boundaries/expectations, when the children's service workers care very much that my kids learn things in the order NT kids do and do not care at all if they do some things far before an NT would?
Why do people feel its OK to say these things and even defend them with the worst arguments? Eg." my my autistic kids don't identify as autistic"? Internalised ablism, imagine someone saying "my black kids don't identify as black" How sad to know you are so disapproved of.
It's proven that the autistic brain develops differently from the very first few cells. Your autistic child is not an NT with a broken bit. Read about the double empathy problem and allism if you are still having problems seeing your prejudice.

@LilyRed you are so kind 🌻

I don't know what to say when people are kind, I'm not used to it on MN, but thank you. I think all our efforts are definitely paying off as the board is doing brilliantly 😃

kids.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/frym.2021.554875

Double empathy problem summary. I'd never heard of this before. It certainly explains why the NTs form such a negative view of autistic people. I wonder how this plays out in parenting.

@BarrowInFurnessRailwayStation

kids.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/frym.2021.554875

Double empathy problem summary. I'd never heard of this before. It certainly explains why the NTs form such a negative view of autistic people. I wonder how this plays out in parenting.

Wow, that is fascinating! I've always been TERRIBLE at friendships but now I'm wondering if it's because I don't actually know any other autistic people other than my family members? I need to try and find out I think. And yes, parenting wise it's very interesting. My eldest wasn't diagnosed till 13 because to me he seemed "normal". You do see posts on here from NT parents saying their ND child embarrasses them etc. Very interesting indeed.

You do see posts on here from NT parents saying their ND child embarrasses them etc. Very interesting indeed.

Ew, uptight 😬

It's the job of the parent to embarrass the child otherwise you're not doing it right and not having fun 😁

I used to embarrass my parents and still do with DP as I am rather direct and say what I think - frankly it would be dishonest not to...

I forget one must use social graces! My children never embarrassed me. As Barrow says, it was the other way around

Thing is, despite being pegged as an awful person by many at school they would never give any sort of reason why that made any sort of sense. I suspect it is more collective fear that having a different opinion of someone would make them ostracised.

In terms of terrible things I did, I like learning and science and wasn't interested in boys and make-up. I was rather socially blind and had no idea about hierachies only I suspect I was wanted to be seen as being at the bottom but didn't behave like someone on the bottom of the totem pole. And most of the boys hated me - they would be unpleasent yet shocked that I would mirror them.
So those are my crimes - send me to The Hague!

What about yours?

On the rare occasions when people actually interacted with me civilly though, they seemed surprised about how 'nice' and 'normal' I was - not that it changed anything.

I can't be arsed with NTs and try to avoid them at all costs

The irony here is unreal.

The irony here is unreal.

Not really. I don't have NT privilege.

This thread isn't for having to explain ourselves either.

I don't recognise hierarchy and won't defer to them. I won't tolerate being talked down to and I find doctors do this almost as a matter of course.

Dd had massive problems in her final year of college (a 3 year course so she had just turned 19) due to and I quote “ a rude, aggressive inappropriate” emailed complaint she sent as you “don’t address senior Managment * in that way.

Dh and I saw nothing wrong with it. It was entirely factual and annihilated their policy on a matter (she took every point individually and demonstrated how each was not being followed).

She was threatened with serious disciplinary action unless she retracted it. I intervened, but they still made her life hell and destroyed her mental health.