Please or to access all these features

Product tests

Here's where users test and review products and give their feedback. If you'd like to run a product test please email [email protected].

Pampers Baby-Dry Pants Feedback Thread - £200 John Lewis voucher to be won NOW CLOSED

385 replies

AngelieMumsnet · 23/09/2015 10:33

This thread is for the MNers who've been trying out Pampers Baby-Dry Pants with their child.

Here’s what Pampers say, “Thank you so much for signing up to try our new Baby-Dry Pants – you’re some of the first people in the UK to try them and we can’t wait to hear what you thought of them. We really hope you and your little one found them easy to use, as well as providing the reliable dryness you’d expect from a normal taped nappy.”

Below are some questions to get you started but please feel free to add other comments too.

Please state the age of your child and the size of Baby-Dry Pants nappies you were trying in your response.

  • Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants?
  • How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time?
  • How would you rate the dryness of the pants?
  • Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not?
  • Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not?
  • If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit?

Everyone who comments on this thread and completes the survey we sent via email will be entered in to a prize draw where one MNer will receive a £200 John Lewis voucher.

Thanks and good luck!
MNHQ

OP posts:
Luckystar1 · 23/09/2015 16:04

We have been testing these for roughly a week now. My DS is 11 months, crawling and standing and walking when assisted. I should point out after seeing comments on the other thread that I have not got him in shoes (and he's still in shorts and mostly just vests in the house) so I can't comment on difficulty of changing proper walking babies when out and about!

we trialled size 4, and although DS has moved up to size 5 in normal nappies I was completely happy with 4 for the pull ups as they have the lovely elasticated waist.

Q. Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants?

A. Very, very, very. They were an absolute dream compared to normal nappies as I could change DS without any of the usual lying down drama. No singing old MacDonald while pulling faces, just off and on. DS is teething molars and so is pooing very frequently and o have to say, I didn't grown half as much at nappy changes as I do usually! They were a complete godsend!

My only reservation was the smell. Very strong chemical which had me constantly checking for poo. I don't have this with any other nappy including normal baby dry which we use every day.

Q. How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time?

A. Brilliantly. Exactly the same great performance I have come to expect from baby dry. No leaks of any nature.

Q. How would you rate the dryness of the pants?

A. 10 out of 10, perfectly dry. DS was very comfortable in them. Even when moving around. They still stayed on safely and securely.

Q. Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not?

A. Definitely. DS is an absolute nightmare to change. Especially after his bath and it really creates a lot of tension just prior to bed time. It was nice to end the days on a high!

Q. Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not?

A. Yes. Although I didn't really consider them to be just for potty training, I was just delighted to find that the brand and type of nappy that we trust to see us through the day (and particularly the nights!!) have created a nappy that can fit in with our changing lives and make everything that bit easier!

Q.If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit?

A. I already have done! And I bring it up in conversation, they are that good!

halloweensquish · 23/09/2015 16:05

Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants?
very good

  • How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time? - They kept my baby secure and dry.
  • How would you rate the dryness of the pants? Very good
  • Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not?
Yes
  • Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not?
Yes they did the job of my normal night nappy
  • If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit?
Yes i would.
BBQsAreSooooOverrated · 23/09/2015 16:06

Weve been trying size 5 nappies with my 2yr old dd...

Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants? Very satisfied.

How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time? We had no issues with leakage at all wee or poo wise even when worn for 12hrs.

How would you rate the dryness of the pants? After 12hrs the nappy still absorbed wee and kept my daughter's skin dry, no rashes or soreness.

Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not?
We'd definitely buy these nappies if they weren't too much more than the usual pampers Baby Dry. They absorbed just as well as the normal baby dry, fitted really well around the waist and didn't look as bulky underneath leggings as the usual baby dry nappies.

Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not? I think they're convenient for wriggly babies/toddlers even of they're not potty training.

If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit? I'd definitely recommend the baby dry pants to other parents they were brilliant.

icclemunchy · 23/09/2015 16:15

We used size 6 on our 4yo girls who's not dry at night

  • Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants?
I really liked these, we don't use pull ups because they're expensive and tend to leak so had been using size 6 nappies. Poor DD hated wearing a nappy but she just can't last the night yet even with being got up so these provided the perfect solution. Nappy level dryness but the pant style means DD feels more like a big girl
  • How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time?

We only used at night but they contained 4yo sees with no problems

  • How would you rate the dryness of the pants?

DD didn't complain about feeling wet at all

  • Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not?

Yes

  • Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not?

Having tried them I'd say they'd be good for active toddlers who don't want to lay still long enough for a nappy change but I think they'd be awkward for a child who can't step into them

  • If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit?

Yes defiantly, I've already suggested them to a friend who's child has accidents to night seizures

thebluefoxategreensocks · 23/09/2015 16:20

Thanks for picking us to test these! I used them for my son who recently turned 3 and we had size 6. He's currently potty training, so ideal time for these!

  • Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants?
Very satisifed and impressed. I've tried a few different brands of pull up pants and found they were all pretty awful, either leaks or fit. But this gets full marks from me on all counts! :-)
  • How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time?
Great performance day and night!
  • How would you rate the dryness of the pants?
Very good.
  • Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not?
Yes, I would love to be able to buy these!
  • Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not?
I think they could be useful for wiggly little ones who aren't yet at potty training age. But the cost would have to be the same as for nappies, or not really enough value for money.
  • If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit?
Yes, totally!
Clarabell33 · 23/09/2015 16:21

DS is 5.5mo and we were trialling size 4.

  • Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants?

Quite satisfied.

  • How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time?

Fine, no leaks even overnight.

  • How would you rate the dryness of the pants?

As good as normal nappies in terms of dryness.

  • Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not?

I would buy these when DS is older, but they're not really suitable for us at the moment.

  • Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not?

The pants were fine in terms of performance but more fiddly to get on and off, especially when very dirty! Needed both hands which isn't always possible when you're trying to pin down a wriggly baby. Practice probably helps but I don't think these add anything special to nappy changing for a baby who isn't near potty training.

  • If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit?

I would definitely recommend them to parents of older babies, who are getting ready for potty training. I would also recommend them for comfort of fit around the tummy, especially overnight.

YerTiz · 23/09/2015 16:21

DS is 18 months old and we tested size 5 nappies.

  • Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants?

Very! They're soft, seem very comfy.

  • How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time?
They kept him dry day and night - wasn't sure they would as they're quite thin at the sides, but they did the job just fine.
  • How would you rate the dryness of the pants?
Very good, no issues.
  • Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not?
Yes depending on price.
  • Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not?
Yes I guess so - although I only used pull ups with DS1 at night so would prob aim to do the same with DS2. But I think these pampers nappies are an excellent introduction to 'big boy' pants - DS likes putting them on standing up and I guess over time he'll be able to do this himself. And its easier for me!
  • If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit? Yes.
YerTiz · 23/09/2015 16:23

Oh also wanted to add - I'm not sure the tab to wrap the used nappy up is necessary as I tend to use nappy sacks to reduce bin 'pongy-ness'.

ISeeIt · 23/09/2015 16:24

Please state the age of your child and the size of Baby-Dry Pants nappies you were trying in your response.
10 months - size 4

  • Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants?
Pretty happy overall
  • How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time?
They were fine in the daytime, we had one leak over the course of the week in the night
  • How would you rate the dryness of the pants?
7/10
  • Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not?
Perhaps when my baby is older, not for a wriggly crawler
  • Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not?
I liked that they arrived just in time for the won't-lie-down-flat-for-a-nappy-change phase! They were definitely less hassle to get on then conventional nappies. Having said that, my baby is still so wriggly st night that the pants seemed more liable to wedgie him, resulting in a nighttime leak
  • If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit?
Yes, for toddlers
BabyLinthwaite · 23/09/2015 16:27

Enjoyed taking part. Thank you.

DD is 14 months. Size 5

Easy to used. Great design.

Very satusfied with them. We've have no problems. Baba stayed completely dry.

No gel crystals or leaks

Easy to move in them

Good thing is my DH could easily change her where as normal nappies he always does them to tight or too loose and they leak all over the place. I would defiantly buy for days out or holidays so DH can do his bit without me worrying or having to constantly check.

Theverybestofheather · 23/09/2015 16:32

Thanks for letting us take part! My little girl is 11months old and we had size 4 pants
Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants?
I'm impressed, I think they are a great idea but they do have their downside.

  • How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time?
When the nappies were just wet they were fantastic and worked really well for changing without having to lay my little one down but if the nappy was dirty, she still had to lie down for changing as otherwise bits could go everywhere and it would get very messy.
  • How would you rate the dryness of the pants?
Dryness was fantastic and way above any other brand I've tried.
  • Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not?
I don't think I would buy the pants again because of the poo issue. I'd stick to baby dry nappies instead.
  • Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not?
I can see the benefits to having them normally but they just make things trickier when the nappy is dirty.
  • If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit?
Yes I think so, I think others should give them a go.
Dollyemi · 23/09/2015 16:38

I tested these on my daughter who is 2 years 8 months old and wears size 6 nappies

  • Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants? very, Great quality with stretchy sides that were easy enough for her to grab and pull up herself.
  • How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time? surprisingly well, I was very sceptical that they would be as absorbent as baby dry but we had no leaks at all, day or night and there were no issues with the pants moving about (as long as my dd had pulled them up correctly in the first place!)
  • How would you rate the dryness of the pants? really good
  • Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not? yes, have already bought another pack
  • Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not? my dd isn't quite ready for potty training, but isn't far off and I found they were perfect for her. I agree with a pp who said that they're not ideal for very dirty nappies as normal nappies can fold in to contain the poo, whereas these pants only have a sticky tab to fasten the top and bottom of the pants together. Therefore I wouldn't use them on my younger baby, who had more explosive nappies!
  • If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit? absolutely, have done already, a good step towards potty training
SilverHoney · 23/09/2015 16:42
  • Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants?
Very satisfied. Kept baby dry overnight.
  • How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time?
Happy with both. Baby is in her nappy for longer over night time and they did just fine.
  • How would you rate the dryness of the pants?
Kept her dry for as long as I would leave her in one nappy.
  • Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not?
Yes if the price was comparable to my normal brand.
  • Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not?
Yes it showed me they can. Good for older babies and when you've not got a proper change mat set up.
  • If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit?
Yes I would.
Reubymum · 23/09/2015 16:49

Hi

Thank you so much for letting is help test these nappies. We tested these on my huge 5 1/2 month old with size 4. The fit did seem a little bigger than the normal nappies. This would be good for my toddler who has more chunky thighs and can find some pull up types uncomfortable.

Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants?
I liked these nappies, they are quick to use at changing times. My son never stays still long enough for a nappy change now. These do make it easier. They were lovely and soft unlike some others I have used with my toddler. I did wonder if taking them off would be an issue but no issues occurred.

  • How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time?

Oddly they were better at night than I expected. I was worried after the first day we had a leak. If this would happen at night this would be a no goer. However that leak was a one off when he was in the sling. Maybe not on enough? They do hold a fair amount and did last 12 hours.

  • How would you rate the dryness of the pants?

We did have one leak but nothing after that. There were no signs of a rash or uncomfortable baby.

  • Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not?

Yes if the price was right, they don't rub, they make nappy changing my 5 month old crawler a lot quicker.

  • Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not?

Yes, but had tried similar types for my older son and they worked on him until he could take them off himself.

  • If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit?

Yes I have done so already at baby club when I had to chance him around to change him!!

Thank you for letting us take part.

Xxx

asuwere · 23/09/2015 16:53

Tested on my 13 month old Ds, size 4.

  • Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants?
To be honest, not very! I found them awkward and baggy when wet.
  • How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time?
Night time were fine, day time, I was aware of changing them more often than usual as they looked quite baggy when wet.
  • How would you rate the dryness of the pants?
They did keep Ds dry.
  • Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not?
No, not at all. I had a few issues. The idea is that pants would be more convenient but they took much longer to change. Taking it off was fine as I could rip the sides but to pit on another I had to remove his shoes, trousers and tights which was a nuisance. Also very awkward to put cream on when needed. And it meant poking my hand down to make sure he was pointing down! Nappy is much quicker to change as just need to pull trousers/tights down a little. Also, although the sticky tape to seal the used nappy is a good idea, it was sticky in outside too which was annoying.
  • Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not?
No, as above points. And I don't think nappy pants are good for potty training either-normal pants are good for that.
  • If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit?
No, although he was kept dry, they are not convenient at all so not worth it. In fact, I didn't even finish the packet, I disliked them so much.
livinginthefastlane · 23/09/2015 16:54

Was very happy to receive a pack of size 5 baby dry pants to try on my currently toilet learning 25 month old.

  • Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants? Very satisfied, they were easy to pull up and down and kept her dry through the night.
  • How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time? Very well, we managed to go for several hours through the day amidst the toilet visits and she was very happy to pull them up on her own. They lasted all through the night (11 hours or so) and she didn't feel wet at all in the morning.
  • How would you rate the dryness of the pants? Very good!
  • Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not? I'm not sure as we usually use cloth reusable nappies
  • Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not? not really as we are currently at the toilet learning stage, and they felt quite relevant to use for this time but I'm not sure if I would use them in general for younger babies
  • If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit? maybe, if they asked for advice about disposable products

Thanks so much again for choosing us to test the pants! SmileStar

EllaMenoPea · 23/09/2015 16:59
  • Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants?
Very satisfied.
  • How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time?
Very well, no leaks throughout either day or night. DD gets nappy rash with every brand other than pampers and these were no different, they looked so comfy as well with the big waistband.
  • How would you rate the dryness of the pants?
As above. No leaks throughout a 10hour sleep.
  • Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not?
Would buy again, as I said we can only really use Pampers and these held really well and seemed to be really comfortable for her.
  • Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not?
Yes but we did trial in the hope to begin potty training and she couldn't get them up and down herself, but I think that's more development than nappy! I'm not sure I would use them all the time with a younger child due to having to take their trousers off fully every nappy change.
  • If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit?
Yes!

Thank you for choosing us to take part.

bonzo77 · 23/09/2015 17:05

DS2 is 2y 9m
Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants? completely.
How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time? absolutely fine, just as well as what we normally use, which is Boots own.
How would you rate the dryness of the pants? 9/10 no leaks, though skin was damp in the morning (after 12 hours).
Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not? yes. We buy Boots own as we get a staff discount. However I round consider these if we didn't get the discount or had to get them elsewhere.
Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not? tbh pull ups are a pain. If they need changing then you have to take the child's trousers off to put a new one on. And if you are serious about potty training you are better off with proper underwear. We use pull ups at night time for DS1 (5) so he can take himself to the loo in theory, actually he never does. DS2 wears them for nursery 9-12 M-F as they prefer it.

If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit? yes, though no more so than other brands. They're definitely softer and a more ergonomic fit than the Boots ones, but I'm not sure how much difference that makes, and whether I'd be prepared to pay for that.

bonzo77 · 23/09/2015 17:08

Sorry, forgot to say we tried the size 6 on the 2.9 YO. My 5 YO also wears size 6 at night but didn't try these.

ladypiano · 23/09/2015 17:08

My son is 18 months and was testing a size 4.

  • Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants?

Fairly satisfied. They work exactly as they are supposed to, but they just didn't feel secure enough for me. I think my son would be able to get these off much easier than a standard tab nappy.

  • How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time?

They were great for nighttime but I found them a bit cumbersome for daytime and quick changes. I have mastered the art of changing a tab nappy without removing my son's trousers (ninja nappy change mum!) but with these I had to remove trousers and shoes in order to put them on, so changing took a lot longer.

  • How would you rate the dryness of the pants?

10/10 excellent

  • Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not?

Yes, but only in a potty training situation.

  • Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not?

No, because I think my son would be able to wriggle out of these far easier than a standard nappy. I wouldn't use them until he was old enough to understand why he was using pants.

  • If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit?

Yes.

My husband hated these nappies, he said that it felt like our son wasn't wearing anything, but I disagree. Apart from the security worries I had, I thought these were very dry and looked comfortable. In fact, when my son first had them on we had guests in the house and he ran to show them his new nappies!

Anusia86 · 23/09/2015 17:11

Thank you for having me and my little girl. She is 3 years old and we tried size 4. She is toilet trained but we still using nappies during the night.

  • Overall, how satisfied were you with Pampers Baby-Dry Pants?
I am very satisfied with new Pampers Baby-Dry Pants. Bought them before but they weren't very comfy and were leaking couple times, so went back to nappies. But now was really impressed.
  • How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night time?
Never had any accident, not even once and we use them during the night so there is plenty hours and plenty wee-wee :)
  • How would you rate the dryness of the pants?
Excellent
  • Would you consider buying them in the future? If so, why? If not, why not?
Yes, of course. I am really satisfied with results and improvements that Pampers has done to their pants.
  • Did the trial convince you that pants are not just for potty training or not? If so, why? If not, why not?
Yes, they are really helpful and definitely can be used instead of nappies.
  • If it came up in conversation, would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other parents for dryness and fit?
Yes, definitely. They fit perfect and are dry all night - what else you need.
ladypiano · 23/09/2015 17:13

Oh yes, I forgot to add,

When my son needed nappy cream these weren't great, as the cream ended up getting smeared everywhere. So, another reason why changes took a lot longer!

Nightfall1983 · 23/09/2015 17:13

Oh Pants (pun) I forgot to say that DS is 3yrs and we tried the size 6 pants...

topology444 · 23/09/2015 17:14

I tested pampers size 4 pants with my one year old son. I was completely satisfied with the pants. In fact I prefer them to all the nappies I used so far. They were easy to use. I had no problems during daytime and one leak during night but that was more due to the amount of liquid my son was consuming than the fault of the nappy. Generally the quality and the dryness were as excellent as one would expect from Pampers. I would definitely buy them if the price was acceptable. I don't think I would pay more than for conventional nappies. I did not need convincing that pants were a good nappy substitute as I had been wondering for a while why there were no "nappy-pants". I would recommend them to friends but I would mention that size 4 pants have a smaller range than the nappies. In fact I have already told one friend that I like the pants and that they are really well engineered.

arianah2014 · 23/09/2015 17:31

ThankYou for giving me the Opportunity to test these pampers Baby-Dry New Pants .
Size 6 For Testing On my 20mth old dd.
Actually I found The packaging EyeCatching .Colourful nd my daughter found the toddler pic amusing like a playmate kissing her &chatting to her when my other kidz are at school.
How satisfied were you with the Pampers Baby-Dry Pants?
100% satisfaction guaranteed to be a successful product.You have Huggies Pull ups but these pants have a softer material look/feel comfy.
How did Pampers Baby-Dry Pants perform through the day and at night times?
Although my dd drinks alot of water during the day,even when wet the pants did'nt leak during the day and at night,She was happy nd comfortable roaming around with the pants on.
How would you rate the dryness of the pants?
10/10
Would you consider buying them in the future?
Definitely. When they are available in shops on offer I'm gonna stock up.
Did the trial convince you that these pants are not for just potty training or not?If so why?
Yes absolutely I was convinced they look underwear to me but just bulkier, a comfort fit.
If it came in conversation,would you recommend Pampers Baby-Dry Pants to other Parents for Dryness & Fit?
I would recommend to other parents,but nowadays a lot of my friends use store brand nappies,more cheaper for their budgets.Ive always used pampers for all my five children,nd ive never looked back at other brands.