Not sure dh is being fair with divorce financials

[JayJayy]

Posted briefly a while back, managed to get a free half hour which wasn’t brilliant, but now I have some figures and I feel he’s perhaps not being too fair here…
Sorry it’s long but I wanted to be detailed.

29 year marriage. I’ve always stayed home with part time work (his request) and raised children. Both now independent adults so don’t factor into this now. He would like to stay in the house, bed currently living there alone, I’m renting a room because living with him is impossible. I have meagre savings and a job that brings me in around £1100 a month currently. I am seeing a solicitor tomorrow but at £180 an hour it will be a one off imagine.

His offer at the moment. He wants to keep the house, all the appliances, furniture etc and give me £109k, half the equity. Failing that he can ‘possibly stretch to’ £140k if I don’t go after his pensions. He’s a high earner, and his base salary isn’t reflecting bonuses which can push him to around £100k. If I take either offer I can afford at best a small flat whilst he remains in the four bed nice detached

House has been valued at £350k, £360k and £375k. I’m happy to take the middle figure he wants to go with £350k

outstanding mortgage £130,500

his salary £81k (plus bonuses he currently won’t go into)

my salary £12k ish

pension 1 £198,500
pension 2 £10,000 (estimate)
pension 3 £103,500

i gained a degree in 2011, he was deeply unimpressed with my return to education and using it to work full time would not have gone down well. I’m now 51. I feel stupid that I threw over 30 years away supporting someone who clearly never gave a fucking about me outside of being a maid and a nanny.
i also put around £90k of my own inheritance into the house in 2018. Something I know I’ll never get back.

he’s cut me off I have no access to money or financial advisors like he has and I feel he’s trying his best to make me go away with as little as possible.

I’d appreciate any input. Thanks.

It doesn't need to go to court to have all revealed. This is much earlier down the line but I hope @JayJayy that he has got an official CETV from his work. He needs to share this with you.

Not in my world, where women don’t sleepwalk into submission and dependence.

I don’t think you quite understand the meaning of the term “professional.”

Oh do bore off. Hiring a "professional" cleaner or nanny doesn't mean that they will do the job better than you could if you felt like doing it or had the time to, rather than paying someone else.

Let’s all just ignore TheHerboriste going forwards. He is clearly a troll just here to wind up women for his own entertainment. Don’t give him the satisfaction. Probably never cleaned a house or looked after a child in his life.

Ok……now back to supporting the lovely OP going through a difficult time.

But what a housewife does to earn her keep is not on par with what a professional cleaner, chef, nanny etc does in the marketplace where there are objective standards of competence and performance. They are not remotely comparable in terms of value.

Second this. He’s bullying you! That’s your home, go back and then you have more leverage. Investment in solicitors def worth it here I’d guess.

I mean they are literally the same, but you keep being goady

"To earn her keep"😆The 1950s called, and wondered how you got here.

They are literally not the same. Professionals have credentials and training, they perform to objective standards, they are subject to performance evaluation and client feedback, they may be subject to government regulations and oversight, they render their services for pay and they compete for business in the open marketplace.

Housewives do none of the above. Claiming that their value to the breadwinner remotely translates to the wage that competitive professionals charge is ridiculous.

Their financial value is in enabling the career of the other parent, while theirs halts. That’s what is recognised in financial settlements, rightly so.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/relationships/5136910-blindsided-by-h?page=1

The OP in this thread is a wonderful inspiration to anyone going through separation and/or divorce. Her circumstances may be different but her clarity of writing really captures all the ups and downs involved. Ultimately, how to grey rock yet fight like hell underneath the surface. Working through the grief process of losing a marriage and discovering herself again. All the savvy advice and tips shared to get the upper hand…. Just many little nuggets of wisdom with humour added. There’s another thread after as well.
Sorry, I’m tired so my sentences are brief!

Sorry you’re going through all this but it’ll be worth it in the end. Wishing you every strength, success and happiness x

Please stop quoting him and stop responding to him. It doesn't help.

Just for those who may think spousal maintenance “isn’t a thing”. I earned £140k a year when ex and I separated. Ex earned multiples of that. I got spousal
maintenance for 18 months based on the fact bag I had gone part time following the birth of our child to facilitate ex’s metoeric career progression during the first 4 years of our child’s life. The spousal maintenance reflected the high cost of where we live and the fact I’d need a bit of time to start earning more. It is a thing.

The starting point is always 50/50, that includes all marital assets, so things like equity in the house, pensions and savings. Just a Quick Look at what you’ve mentioned, if you split the equity and pensions you’d be looking at least £250k which is enough to buy you a house. Don’t let him try to bully you into anything, also don’t take anything he says as gospel. Some solicitors will take their fee out of the settlement so it’s worth pushing back hard. No doubt he’s probably got savings stashed away (as it sounds like he’s financially abusive) so maybe he’ll agree to half the equity and have the value of his pensions.

Neither do you if you think paid for cleaners are professional.

@JayJayy. As a small example. When I went back to college to gain my A levels before my degree, I had two small children and as an only child I was nursing my dad at home through terminal cancer. I didnt have time to think most days but the escape to college was very much needed.
every morning exh would get my car out of the garage for me. A little touch I thought was very sweet of him, until the morning he exploded at me in front of both kids. The reason he was doing this wasn’t to be nice, but because he was tracking how many miles I had driven in my car, and the previous day I’d dropped a birthday gift off to DDs friend. Adding 5 miles I don’t usually do.
I should have left then. Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but I carried on. He assured me he’d changed. Again with hindsight I don’t think he did, he just got better at hiding it

this was my ex re the mileage. He would heat my car up for me, but I found out it was so he could write down my mileage. A few years after Inleft, I suddenly remembered all the awful things he did. I hit councilling and realise he was emotionally, financially and sexually abusing me. Took me a while to accept this.

but here I am 20 odd years down the line and I see our relationship as a blessing, it’s made me who I am today and has ensured that I will never put myself in that position again. He taught me what wasn’t acceptable in a relationship.

That’s your world. In the real world when there are children involved, one caring parent will often put their security first.

Hello @JayJayy I’m sorry you’re in this situation, but with the help of the MN Vipers 😁😁😁 we’ll get you through.

Im through a similar situation and long marriage with an abusive ExH so can completely relate. I’m involved with a local DA charity so I know a little bit about how and where you can find help.

Get in touch with Women’s Aid. Drop them an email, and ask them who supports DA survivors in your area…then you can give your local DA charity a call.

They are an utter mine of local information, what your rights are, what you’re owed, what benefits you might be entitled to… and more. They can write letters of support, get you food vouchers…

Ask BOTH Women’s Aid and your local DA about legal help in finding a solicitor. My local one has a lady who’s qualified as a family lawyer and is a volunteer too.

YOU NEED LEGAL FINANCIAL ADVICE. Your STB ex will not be playing a fair game. Guaranteed.

(BTW, I had to move out and rent and my SHL made him pay my rent… just saying…)

You can’t cash pensions in and use them to buy a house. There is about 230k of liquid capital so extremely modest assets available for rehousing.
Yes he might be hiding something but you could spend 10k trying to prove that and realise he isn’t and that he just frittered money away (or it seems, gave it to the kids for their properties). Financial disclosure can only be compelled if you issue court proceedings. Always bear in mind a cost benefit analysis- if you spend 10k and find he has a secret savings account of 5k then it’s not worth it.
Overall about 50/50 would be fair but OP should push for more of the capital in return for less of the pension to be able to buy a property. Some form of maintenance until the DH retires would also be fair given that there’s so little capital.

Kids are both married late 20s and early 30s. Both have bought over the last 5 years.
Yet you continued to work FT. MN love to encourage solicitors. Seeking advice from a solicitor is always recommended in divorce proceedings but there are other avenues to come to an agreement. The higher % of assets you fight for, the more you'll need help from your solicitor, the higher the fees, the more the extra money you are fighter for is likely to go to their pockets rather than yours The stress and the delay is yours though.

Ultimately, your ex is likely to debate that you chose to work PT because you wanted to and could rather than because he forced you, especially after the kids finish school. The just will look at both your incomes AND your potential income to reach their decision.

Spousal maintenance totally depends on the judge you get. Some regions are more favourable to it than others. Ultimately though, clean breaks are nowadays the favoured judgements. You are without a doubt until to 50%. Maybe more, maybe not. If you can afford to house yourself(one bed), with half the equity and moving to FT work, you might not get more than 50% of the equity. Judges do have to consider the principles of keeping a similar lifestyle as much as is possible, but how much they do so again very much depends on the judge.

You can cash in a % of some pensions if old enough. But yes op you need the pension income to live on

@vivainsomnia
Yes, the “I sacrificed my career” gambit isn’t very persuasive when the OP chose to continue working PT despite the “kids” being adults for the past 10-15 years. She could have been back in the workforce fulltime, cultivating a career and independence, and/or retraining, since her mid-30s at the latest.

Where your theory isn’t quite fair @TheHerboriste, is that you’re commenting with the benefit of hindsight.
whereas ops decisions were made for what was best in the moment given her then present circumstances (not even including the obvious coercion that went on here)
no one sets off making a family assuming that they will divorce, but the opposite, so decisions are made on that basis.
being able to ‘have’ a sahp is beneficial for the WHOLE family- obviously the children, and the sahp who will absolutely get a nice life, but also the WOHP benefits massively. If a family can afford it, it’s a wonderful privilege for everyone in it.

OP went back to get a levels and further studies. These will be considered evidence of an interest in a career. It would also support the ex claimed that he never stopped her to do so.

Without police reports of cohesion or violence, why would a judge just take it from OPs mouth that her ex prevented her from working FT?