Child maintenance System has no regard for the fathers family

[Lsimms97]

I’m absolutely in shock at how many posts I am reading from women slating their children’s fathers who are refusing to pay maintenance through CMS. I am a woman and if I ever break up with my husband, I would never ever put in a CMS claim because I respect him. I understand that sometimes there are deadbeat fathers and CMS is the only option, but for loving fathers who actually see their children, please do not use CMS! My husband’s ex, who has a drug problem, is unemployed and takes up drug habits whilst my stepchild is at school all day, has decided that after years of a family based arrangement, that she would like to put in a CMS claim, in which she has lied about the existence of my children and the amount of nights we looks after my step child for. CMS are being extremely difficult about this and forcing us to go through tribunal courts to resolve the incorrect information whilst at the same time they are taking incorrect payments from us which is everything we have after paying rent. The result is that we are now left struggling to feed and clothe two toddlers. I love my stepchild and would never see them go without, we are a huge part in their life and have never refused to pay for school uniforms, lunch money, top ups, holidays etc, clothes, haircuts...anything which is needed! But the reality is my stepchild is walking around in a pair of £200 trainers, has all of the latest gadgets etc and we have nothing left for our children. His ex has even sent us a picture of a takeaway and said ‘cheers’ because she is getting so much money and it does not take that much money to raise one child. Do you not also think that as mothers, you should also contribute to the child’s upbringing? CMS payments mean that fathers pay for everything even though it takes two to tango. My poor husband has Had his life ruined by this woman constantly using the child as a weapon and now she’s found a new way to get to him. The sad reality is he is going to have to quit his job or we lose our home. I also work part time by the way, but we cannot cover the unrealistic payments and still support our children. CMS do not care about this, I have cried down the phone to them and they literally couldn’t care less.so please women, if you have any respect for your ex, please seek a family based arrangement. So many men have committed suicide over this, and been left in poverty. It isn’t fair. The CMS are awful!

I’ve literally never met any RP who expects their ex to fund them

Out of curiosity can you say how many of the millions of RP's in the UK you have actually met?

MissedTheBoatAgain over the years of schools, nurseries and friends, a fair few.

Your agenda is blatant as fuck, it’s clear what position you take.

It[s very hard to generalise on what children costs as it depends on famly income. Many people would look in horror at the £8 a time bit of steak my teenager was buying every week in university holidays as that could feed you for a few days if you bought other foods, ditto when we go on holiday or that I pay their university costs. It's all just relative which is why higher earners tend to have a more complex divorce financial order like we had which included clauses about school fees and university costs.

I am not the only resident parent who earns too much to get child benefit but am probably rare to be in that position with an ex who pays nothing.

I do think non resident parents have no idea what the day to day cost is of having teenagers though whether it's lunch money or needing a folder for school or shoes. It is a constant drip drip drip of cost which if you dont' live with them you don't see and may not even understand.

on the person helpf husband's step daughters just one minor point sometimes step children if they live with you in England become children of the family and then a legal obligation does arise. I knew one man who kindly paid for his second wife's two children to go to Millfield costing him about £60k a year out of his taxed income. After their divorce he had to carry on paying that as they had become in reality a child of the family.

That was me Xenia, we’re in Scotland and that doesn’t apply here. He lived with them for 3 years, has lived here for 7, but we still make sure they have everything they need because it’s only fair. I get that that’s an unusual set up, but I (we) don’t see why they should go without just because DP and their Mum aren’t together .

over the years of schools, nurseries and friends, a fair few

According to ONS (Office National Statistics) 42% of Marriages in UK end in Divorce. For the year 2017 there were over 100,000 divorces.

So of the 100,000 RP's appearing every year how many have you spoken to?

Here are some quotes from Judge Mostyn's ruling SS v NS (Spousal Maintenance) [2014] EWHC 4183 (Fam)

Having heard the case I would not describe that claim as complex. Rather, I would describe it as speculative, experimental and unfeasible. I consider it to be a product of the great bitterness that the wife feels towards the husband. Her section 25 statement is a most unhappy document and seems to have been written with a pen dipped in vitriol

So even one of the Top Judges acknowledged that wife's claim was based on bitterness.

In this field of litigation budgets prepared by the parties often have a high degree of unreality - usually the applicant wife's budget is much inflated

So one of the Top Judges who has dealt with hundreds of cases acknowledges that it is usually the wives that have inflated expectations for maintenance.

Missed, but that's not surprising as most wives earn less. So in our case my husband was being asked what he spent on his hair and wanted £100k extra to take the children on continuing expensive holidays (not that he ever took them on holiday again after divorce) but if most of the couples have the income differential the other way round then not surprisingly the judges are going to be seeing more wives' budgets over inflated than the other way about.

Also plenty of judges are sexist and have housewives at home and are mail so I would certainly not take their pronouncements on who is "bitter" with much more than a pinch of salt. Bitter always seems to be applied to women mostly. I have never liked that word. It always seems a very sexist and unfair word.

YeTalk, indeed and most parents of either sex want their children and step children to be okay. We might write on these threads about divorce litigation, but most couples instead reach agreements on what is best for the children, try to keep them in their home and to be as undisrupted as possible and plenty pay more than they need under the law just as plenty of parents who aren't divorced go above and beyond the minimum in terms of helping their children. It never does you too much harm in life just to give without thought of reward and because it can be the right thing to do.

MissedTheBoatAgain you’re not even trying to hide your misogyny are you?

God knows what’s made you so angry, but it must be quite something for you to be so bitter about it.

Xenia I agree, most parents do. Many don’t, my XH included. The fact that any parent can absolve themselves of responsibilities to their children without comeback in this country is (and should be) a source of great shame.

Missed, but that's not surprising as most wives earn less

Suggest you actually read the case. The Ex wife wanted £60K per year for 27 years index linked!

Judge awarded £30K per year for 11 years index linked.

One case? You belittle me for not knowing every RP in the country and then take a dog with a bone attitude to the one case which proves your point? Haha, that’s funny.

One case

Mostyn has made 100's of rulings. So his comments, which might initially seem like generalizations, are in fact based on his previous experience.

Bet he has dealt with a lot more RP's than you have.

A man sees women as bitter quelle surprise

But no comment as to why she is bitter - perhaps years of putting her life on hold to raise a family is suddenly abandoned

My best friends ex has now quit his 6 figure job to go freelance so he doesnt have to pay maintenance because he is bitter she left him

Bet he has dealt with a lot more RP's than you have.

Bet he’s dealt with a lot more shitty NRPs than you care to admit exist. And bitter second wives too

but that's a conversation and you can explain to them why you are changing direction, happy to take a reduction and understand that you won't get ex pat rates in a UK based role

Applied that logic at my most recent UK Job interview which was 2012! Employer did not buy it and Job was given to someone who lived locally. In anticipation of your question "how do you know that?". Reply is "recruiter told me"

Aw, well it really sounds like you tried your very best to do the right thing by your kid if you applied for one job six years ago and a recruiter told you it wouldn't be possible (this is clearly not true anyway, why would an employer even interview you if they already felt you weren't being truthful about the salary they might offer? Employers are not in the business of wasting their own time).

This is despite the fact that earlier you lied and said the problem was 'application forms'.

You sound like a stand-up kind of guy who goes all out for the vulnerable people in his life.

Not.

To VanGogh

Applied for 100s of jobs on sites like CV Library, Indeed and registered with many recruiting agents.

Outcome of my efforts was that last interview was in 2012. No salary or day rate was advertised. Recruiting agent thought I had a good chance as I put on their application form £550 per day for London. Story is that guy who was interviewed after me was told what I had said and so undercut me by £50 per day. Not that the recruiter was bothered as they got their commission anyway

Bet he’s dealt with a lot more shitty NRPs than you care to admit exist. And bitter second wives too

Case I quoted the Ex wife received two thirds of the liquid assets to reflect she was the weaker earner. In my case ex received about 75%.

Mistake she made was that she wanted huge lifetime pension too. If judge had agreed she would have had more income than myself even though she works 16 hours per week compared to my average 50 hours.

How can any RP (male or female) think that it is correct they get everything and the NRP has to be left with nothing?

In my case ex received about 75%

All becomes clear.

No idea why you’re so angry with me, I got and get fuck all from the waste of space I divorced.

He could win the lottery tomorrow and I wouldn’t accept a penny.

How come you received nothing? No children and no assets involved? Or has he vanished?

Because he’s found every loophole going to dodge paying any maintenance ever, and because I never asked for anything for me.

Because this country allows NRPs to do that, without consequence or punishment.

And because he’s a deadbeat. He’s the walking definition of a deadbeat parent.

Maybe you have short changed yourself? CMS and the courts have various mechanisms to ensure NRP pays what they should. Can be a long drawn out process. NRP being Self Employed or works via a Ltd Company or is a job and address hopper and CMS will struggle. If they work overseas may be impossible?

CMS and the courts have various mechanisms to ensure NRP pays what they should

Do they? Because they never bothered when I tried. I’ll be fucked if I’ll go cap in hand to that prick for anything, I’ve managed for 11 years without him contributing anything towards parenting (financially, emotionally, practically, in every sense) while simultaneously being metaphorically bashed over the head about his fucking rights the entire time.

I haven’t short changed myself, what a neat deflection of responsibility that is. HE has short changed his son, in every respect.

I have made sure DS1 has never gone without. He has done hee haw buckshee.

And the law allows it.

Applied for 100s of jobs on sites like CV Library, Indeed and registered with many recruiting agents.

Six years ago.

I do contract work and have to apply for hundreds of jobs every six months. That's life. I have never yet failed to get one in the end and, of course, there are loads of reasons others get the job than me. I've just finished a contract and have one day off before my next one starts Monday. I have no idea how many jobs I applied for but it would have been over 100.

But, you're just making stuff up, one minute it's this reason, when that is countered you come up with another reason, when that is questioned you make up something else..

You just wanted to stay abroad with your nice lifestyle, not having to do the daily childcare and want to complain about your ex and make out everything is her fault when in fact there are many things you could have done if you really wanted to be in your child's life.

You just wanted to stay abroad with your nice lifestyle, not having to do the daily childcare and want to complain about your ex and make out everything is her fault when in fact there are many things you could have done if you really wanted to be in your child's life

That’s my conclusion too. Quite the agenda.

The OP has already stated they have the child 50% of the time so there actually shouldn't be a claim!!!!!

Mother has lied and said OP has her 1 night a week and failed to mention dad has responsibility for another two children.....

Perfectly clear to me and they should win the appeal but will Ops DH get the money back.....not a chance!!!

@YeTalkShiteHen that's also my conclusion. Very transparent.

Child's grandparents offered to escort him to where I currently Work in Asia as 14 hours flying in total. However, ex would not provide letter of approval and child's passport.

So that is another gone by since the Divorce and child has not had a holiday outside the UK. However, his mother can find time twice this year for a holiday by herself!

Only huffed as she can't afford the same exotic locations.