OMFG is anyone watching Newsnight.

[carernotasaint]

Its about FGM. How can they fucking to this to girls and women. One girl was only three when it happened. MY GOD.

nailak - what are the consequences of smear tests?

ffs what is this host country bullshit, this is my fuckin country, i am not a fuckin visitor

them Somali girls in the video, and on newsnight, they are not visitors either, this is their country which is why they feel able to talk about issues and influence law making.

That dont mean they still dont have connections and options elsewhere in the world.

and tbh the Somalis did not really immigrate because of jobs, they are mostly asylum seekers who fled being massacred.

I think that the proposal you said sounds ok, it is no different to someone who commits any other crime being deported.

My issues is where does it end, My DH is 42 and has been here since he was 6 years old, if his DM performs fgm on someone does this mean by that principle he would be deported? and what about my kids? Would Him and his brothers and sisters, some who have no contact with my DHs mum be deported? and what about their children? if not their children, then what about the niece I have that has always lived with her DGM? and what about my nieces kids?

I meant that grown adults avoid smear tests and put it off when they know the consequences of putting it off could mean that they could have cervical cancer and it wont be detected until it is too late.

Plenty of people already send their kids back home for various reasons, my best friend sent her 4 year old son to Kenya to be educated their for a year as there was no school place for him here.

Also sending your child back home from 5-11 doesnt mean you dont see them all that time there are things called extended holidays! you know, the mother spends 4 or 5 months here, then comes back and after a few months the dd comes to uk for a few months etc

I dont get it, is it because I am a different race or culture, or I have a different opinion that I dont get to have an opinion on laws etc, that is I differ in my view from the majority, all of a sudden I am a "visitor" in a "Host" country, and seperate from society.

The minister on Newsnight said she wouldnt like this done to her daughter as well, to be routinely checked intimately, does she "need to understand and accept the ethos behind the laws and institutions." when ffs she is part of them?

Do ethnically British people not choose what they like or dont like? Some like the ethos of public school government, some dont, some like the Olympics some dont, Some choose to homeschool, some to free school etc,

and in fact I can tell you ethnically British Muslims that wouldnt like this as well, so how do you react the to that? and relate that to the "Host" country ethos, by having a different opinion have they betrayed their race or something? I also know French Musilms who have moved to this country who are ethnically French. (I know French is not an ethnicity but you get the gist).

nobody send their daughters to school expecting their vaginas to be checked. That is a mad idea. Also, on a practical level, how could it be done? Would all girls be checked, of all nationalities? Or would the school 'pick'which nationality to check? so you see, this is seriously dodgy ground.
Besides parents with something to hide would just remove their daughter from school, as nailak said. SO the girl would possibly remain uneducated.
Schools are for education not intimate body checks, social work, and forced vaccinations.
I am not belittling the horror of FGM.

I don't like the idea of an intrusive medical examination for anyone or anyone's daughters.

I just like it less than I like mutilation and child abuse.

I'm not saying it's an easily workable solution that won't upset people and have problems. I'm not even saying we should immediately do it in this country. I am saying that in France, where such examinations occur, and where people are thereby detected if/when practicing FGM, and prosecuted for abusing and mutilating little girls, there are fewer little girls being mutilated and abused.

So to those who say: this is a mad idea, it will never work, etc: What do you propose should be done to prevent little British girls being mutilated and abused?

not sure, currants, perhaps a prevention and checking program through the GP?

I already told you, read the thread.

I guess another way to approach it would be to encourage these girls to sue their parents...

If a young girl has thrush etc the doctor examines her genitals.It's no big deaL

Well the French manage it somehow. Perhaps we could learn from them? Their system doesn't seem to prevent people of many nationalities moving there.

I would assume any checks would be done at a GP's surgery rather than at school. Otherwise it would be difficult to have parents present and that would surely have to be mandatory?

I beg your pardon, nailak - I have read the thread but didn't see your proposed solutions. Could you, if you have the time, expand on them a little so someone who's missed them once doesn't miss them again?

Incidentally, I'm not being even a tiny bit hostile here. I was shocked at the 'host country' talk and such does not respect my beliefs. However I have a highly energetic 2 year old climbing up my leg and am unlikely to get back to the start of the thread in the next 24 hours, so if you have a moment, I'd be glad to learn more.

nailak - ok so you mean the consequences of not having a smear, rather then the consequences of having one. That makes much more sense.

I don't have a DD, but I would be very happy for my DSs to have a medical examination shortly after they started school to ensure that they were in good health and to help to prevent something as awful as genital mutilation.

I really feel that any parent that would have a problem with their young children being checked in this manner has got their priorities wrong.

Abitwobbly - sorry can you clarify? A non-white British woman tells you that this is her country as well, and that girls of Somali ancestry are British too and your response is
"dont kid yourself for a single fucking instant.".

Just want to make sure that I understood that correctly.

Catskin miss right - on I have a degree in history/economic history. Bring it on. You will be shocked at what I can clarify.

Before you all have the complete vapours of what I am saying, (and most of you are state educated and therefore uneducated - FACT - Britain has 1,000 years of vicious and I mean VICIOUS civil war (do you think all those heads rolling at the scaffold are just CUTE?) behind WHY our institutions are the most important in the world.

Why are English institutions behind the most important constitution in the world the USA?
Why did the masters-educated lawyer Nelson Mandela INSIST on a written constitution for the NEW SOUTH AFRICA?

Do you stupid state-educated (not your fault you were inflicted with lefty twats] teachers) uneducated people, fail to understand WHY Magna Carta is so important? If you don't understand the importance of Magna Carta, you are uneducated and should therefore shut the F up.

This is F-ING IMPORTANT. It is actually, relevant to FGM. It is NOT as relativistic as the hand-wringing liberal leftie twats - and Nailak's hurt feelings - would leave you to believe.

PS If any of you replying don't understand the importance of habeas corpus (google it) - don't bother to reply.

In your reply, give the definition of habeas corpus to show that you understand a VITAL issue about the institutionalised abuse of power.Which is the country poor little Nailak's whom-we-must-feel-so-caring-about forebears come from.

If you don't, shut up and go away, you are state-uneducated, dont' value the history of Great Britian and therefore stupid and ignorant.

Abit, are you feeling alright? The question cats asked you to clarify was about why you think women born in this country who.call.themselves British are kidding themselves. That is part I am interested in knowing more about, too.

Erm. Before you dismiss my question, I have three degrees and a pretty good grasp of history, including habeus corpus, the restoration, the glorious revolution of 1688, and the fact that the UK doesn't have a written constitution.

1. you have no idea what country my forebearers come from lol, what 50% of Arabs do has nothing really to do with me!

2. you dont know why my parents/ grandparents moved here and you are making big assumptions. you dont even know if the country they moved from was their "country o f origin" lol its called globalisation, is the only reason for globalisation the failure of nation states?

3. what about ethnically british Muslims? do they not exist in your world? should they f off as well? to where?

4. my grandfather fought in the war

blackcurrants sorry for being short, i was rather annoyed at that point. My point earlier was that we should show people that FGM is haram, using their own belief system.

the way I understand it is in France they have some sort of compulsory health visitor system before 6 which the checks are done as part of. After 6 the checks are done in school.

I will ask a French sister and get back to you.

btw the minister on newsnight also said she wouldnt support compulsory checks, is it only ethnically British people that are allowed to have this view, and the rest of us should just be grateful and shut up?

btw I watched the guardian video today, and I think I am changing my mind about compulsory checks,

I wonder if I can be British now?

shut up and go away, you are state-uneducated, dont' value the history of Great Britian and therefore stupid and ignorant.

Aah, well I do believe you can be British if you're not white. Happy to plead guilty to being 'right-on' a 'state-uneducated' "twat' in that case.

Do you stupid state-educated (not your fault you were inflicted with lefty twats] teachers) uneducated people, fail to understand WHY Magna Carta is so important? If you don't understand the importance of Magna Carta, you are uneducated and should therefore shut the F up.

Poor Magna Carta. Did she died in vain?

Abit, No on this thread disagrees about FGM being a medieval, barbaric act which needs to be put an end to.
Its the means to achieve this end that people have different opinions, as they have a right to. Isn't that what civil liberty and democracy about which the British champion and are rightly proud of? We discuss, we decide we start campaigns and help put this abhorrent torture in the back.
I am not muslim, but am confident in saying most muslim women would support us ending this abomination.

Disclaimer

• Private education and a Fellowship on top of two degrees from one of the countries premier institutions. ** Non white British....and British to the very core.