**tamoxifen the 13th**

[MaryAnnSingleton]

here we are- anticipating halloween

Gah, pass me the someone. Had a good meeting with consultant re radio and herceptin etc but it's been a long day and I've just had a big row with DS

Iamseeingstars, I haven't done any counselling for this, no. Some find it helpful, others don't. It's a very personal thing, I think. I've met people with breast cancer, but we tend to meet socially to have a giggle and try to find some enjoyment in life through all of this. Or meet online to moan/cheer/whatever else.

Each person/family will find a different thing helpful, I guess.

for amber. I'm glad the meeting went well, sorry about the row though

Stars - I had some one to one counselling early in my DX, - about 3 sessions IIRC. I did find it helpful, although part of the stuff we talked about was not specifically about the cancer, but working through my fear of hospitals which was making the whole thing more traumatic.

So I would say it helped me. The first session the counsellor asked me just to talk about who I was, and what I liked etc., which I found helpful because I felt as if I'd lost my identity and become 'a cancer patient'.

But as amber says, it is very personal, people are different, and they react to DX differently, some want to talk, some go into themselves and become introspective. And these feeling can change throughout the process.

I would suggest if you are undecided, give it a try, (also see if you can have one to one) you might find it works for you. And yes, if my partner was refusing to go, and I wanted to, I would go on my own. You have to do what works for you.

Thanks Amber. THe main problem for me is I dont know anyone socially who is going through cancer personally. There are lots of people who has a friend of a friend etc. I meet people on the day ward but that is about it.

My own friends are getting bored now. I cant function so I dont get invited to anything anymore - because they feel it will be too much for me, but it would still be nice to get the choice.

I sort of feel it would be nice to meet people locally, but I went to an exercise group a while back and everyone was really old, and I want to meet people my own age rather than my mums age.

I know when I saw this councellor woman a while back and asked specific questions about my cancer, she couldnt answer anything, piled me with hundreds of leaflets and told me to ring the helpline.

I cant make my mind up but have to make a decision soon.

Thanks KK

stars - Macmillan offer counselling , either group or one to one . If your DH isn't too keen on the group thing , then they will be able to offer him one to one if he would prefer . They put me on the waiting list when I was first diagnosed in May , but I still haven't heard anything . So maybe don't hold your breath !

amber - glad it was a productive meeting , when does the next course of treatment kick off ?

- oh they are so pretty aren't they ? Nice one MN .

DS is going back to school tomorrow , whether he likes it or not . I think there was a certain amount of wool being pulled over my eyes today .

I am feeling a bit low today , not quite sure why . Just a bit fed up of everything being cack I suppose . Would just like something to be normal and easy .

Shaddup topsy and cheer up , Doc Martin is on at 9pm . That always makes me smile .

stars - I know what you mean . At my treatment center it always looks like I am the only person under the age of 60 there !
There is a group run over here (Northern Ireland) , the Ulster Cancer Foundation run it . Think it is called The Lavender Group , or something like that . They specialise in support for younger Breast Cancer sufferers , under 40s . But seeing as I turn 42 next week , I am too old for that now !

That's why I love this board , I can spout all my rubbish and you all understand . Things I would never dream of saying to my family .

And I totally understand about the friends thing too . All my friends ask me all the time "how are you" . And I always reply "fine thanks" . I think they don't need to hear I have had the trotts for 3 months now

So come here , offload all you want !

I'm going to watch Doc Martin later. Will have to get up for it - been flu-y today. Maybe did too much at weekend. Cakes i learnt to swim at TG with the Bham post and mail learn to swim campaign. smee was there for brownie galas too but think came last... I like the new pool big enough that it has lessons going on at same time as public swim rather than closing to public like my local. they have lost the high diviing board but have seperate diving and baby pools similar to before.

sorry can't help with thoughts on counselling havent done anything like that still early days for me only dx in August ... Bought dd some green doc martin boots today she is 17 and i had to stop myself from asking if she could wear them home!

figgy- all is well with friend,after a good deal of poking and x raying and ultrasounding- phew ! for asking !
stars I have had Cruse counselling which was brilliant,not specifically for bc,but the whole reason for having the counselling was to deal with unresolved grief and this in a way was connected with it all,if that makes sense. I also developed a great trust in my bcn -she has been brilliant to talk to. I would feel uncomfortable in any group counselling though- much prefer talking to individuals -I met up with someone locally through the BCC forums and we share the same team at hospital so that has been a bond for us - she talks about her stuff and I say what's on my mind and it's been great.
Sorry-my mind is spinning as I'm putting lots of new stuff online in my Etsy shop and I am trying to multi task !

You said I could sound if I I wanted to get something off my chest.

I have made the mistake of mentioning my cancer to someone I talk to regularly. Instead of getting the usual, what a shame, how sad, tragic etc., I got a long lecture of how I could change my diet and this will get rid of the cancer, that I should be eating more vegies and detox and all will be well and I wont need a transplant.

I am dumbstruck to say the least. If this was true then no one would ever need to go through chemo and other treatment ever again, just eat vegetables.

I just feel really angry and upset now. How dare she. I have been told my condition is life threatening, that I dont have much time unless I get a donor quickly, and this woman is telling me if I eat veggies my cancer will miraculously disappear and that I can prove the doctors wrong.

Anyone else been through this.

Stars - I can understand why you feel angry, I would too (and have in the past because I've come across these type of people).

People react in all sorts of ways, from sympathetic and helpful, to avoiding you in case your cancer is catching, to suggesting alternative treatments, (such as herbs or veg. )

I think some people simply have no clue what cancer is, and how the various treatments work. I never know what to say to these people because I'm usually dumbfounded like you. I try hard to avoid them (There's only one persistent one in my general circle).

Honestly does she think if vegetables worked the NHS wouldn't have cottoned onto that? - they'd be a hell of a lot cheaper than chemo drugs!

Actually I suspect that some people try to attach a sort of 'blame' to cancer, suggesting that if you get it its something to do with your lifestyle., rather than just a random piece of shitty luck. If they can convince themselves that eating lots of veg. will keep them safe then they will, because the reality that it can strike anyone out of the blue anytime is too scary for them to contemplate.

Anyway, I hope some of that made sense - my brain slows down a bit at this time of night I think you have to try to find some way of laughing at the loons you will come across. Otherwise they make you feel upset, it's not worth it, and not what you need right now.

xx

Thanks KurriKurri. Rang my councellor about it, it has upset me so much and she has said that I will be taught how to deal with these sorts of people if I attend the group session, that it is something they cover.
The woman concerned is a true greeny person and she was implying that my lifestyle must be unhealthy. I should have just kept my mouth shut

stars so sorry this woman has upset you- KK's comments are spot on- I think people want to help and don't really understand and wish to attach some kind of blame - as if you can avoid these things,or 'fight' cancer simply by living a pure and healthy life- it's just hideous bad luck in my opinion. Eating healthily does no harm,but it isn't a cure,neither is quack medicine (we are often infiltrated by charlatans on this thread !) Try and let it flow over you and vent away.

stars - stupid woman ! (not you , your ignorant "friend") One of my friends has MS and a neighbour of hers actually had the audacity to tell her that she had obviously lived a bad life because God wouldn't give such a terrible illness to someone who was good .

It's very hard to deal with , but unfortunately there are a lot of ignorant people in this world .
One thing about this bastard cancer is that it certainly sorts the wheat from the chaff . You soon find out who your real friends are , and I for one appreciate them even more for that .

I am so sorry this woman has upset you , and you did just the right thing talking to your counsellor and us .

Topsy, how are you feeling this morning?

My next treatments don't have to happen until November now, so I really do have a few weeks off (yippeee)

all round I think?

Stars, if I were a violent person I'd rush round and give them a good handbagging, but I'm not, so they will have to consider themselves Stared At in a Cross Way instead. There is no proven link between healthy eating and a cure for cancer. They've looked, researched, etc. Yes, people can extend their life generally by eating healthily of course, but the support boards are awash with people who have eaten healthily, are slim, fit, well adjusted - and have cancer. Cancer is a kind of living organism - a sort of throwback to primeval life. That's why it can think for itself about how to thrive despite various chemicals etc - it's actually a bit clever. What defeats it is out-thinking it by giving it too many attacks for it to cope with, of different sorts, it seems. That's why they make chemo so complicated. Eating well can help the body cope, but it doesn't by itself defeat a semi-intelligent ancient-style organism living in us. Some are more intelligent than others, which is why they can outwit the efforts better. I think I had a particularly thick sort. Luck of the draw, really.

mas..must have given your friend a real scare,glad to hear shes ok.

figgy...good luck for your first rads session today,i start mine soon so very interested to hear how you get on.

stars...i have had no councelling myself but might consider it at the end of my treatment mainly because i always wonder how people cope with the fear it might come back.

i have also come across the suggestion that if people ate more healthily,kept slim etc they wouldnt get ill with cancer.i have to say i was seething how bloody ignorant clearly cancer has never effected their life in any way.of course eating healthily is a good thing but to suggest it prevents/cures is so insulting to those of us like me that have always ate a healthy diet.honestly avoid friends like that you have enough to deal with,i have learnt that over powering people like that take your strength.

hey amber enjoy your break be so nice for you to get back to normal for a bit.

excellent that you have a break amber - hooray !
Good luck today figgy !

We have ....I would like to take this opportunity to give you all ....so [thanks[ .......

Also , and for later......

Sorry have been awol again. Dh was poorly with a bad head cold aks dying of man flu over the weekend so I couldn't get near computer. Then computer in with pc world having afree upgrade after I threatened them with trading standards and watchdog.... but back home now.

Stars - can just say that greeny person is, whilst I am sure meaning to be well intentioned, an absolute pratt, and if I too were prone to violence, I would be accompanying amber with a very big, full and heavy handbag to deliver the good slap she deserves. Being a greeny is no excuse either, cos I am that, being a bit potty about the environment and doing my bit, and growing our food....but really !

Some of you will remember my ds earlier this year refused to take part in the whole school ash weds service, as he said "I don't believe in God, I am a good boy, if there was a god he wouldn't have done this to me" paraphased as I do not remember the actual words. Even since then I have to say to him that bad things happen to good people, and I would fight tooth and nail against anyone who pronounced otherwise.

A bad day for ds, he woke with severe pain in both shoulders, max pain meds but not shifted, and by the time we got to school he had severe hip pain too.....left him with lovely TA and a hot water bottle...so here's hoping

I am glad to hear that I am not over reacting. Am still steaming about it many hours on. I just cant believe she went on like she did. I accept the healthy eating is good for you, but to imply that my cancer would disappear if I only eat vegetables was really insulting. I was so shocked I didnt say anything but I certainly wont be having anything more to do with her. I actually believe my cancer was caused by other people's smoke because when I was younger I had to tolerate everyone around me smoking all day at work. So this wouldnt have made any difference to how well I ate in my younger days.

Some people just dont think.

Another "friend" also keeps lecturing me and I really dont find it helpful. I must come across as just a weakling that all these people feel they can give their unhelpful advice.

Hope tomorrow is a better day.

Stars, have you got a real friend, who knows the other two, who could have a quiet word on your behalf and shut them up......it is really not helpful for you, you have enough to deal with! and no.....sooooo not over reacting.

Stars, - I think if your counsellor thinks she can help with that sort of thing, then it would be very useful, I'm glad you had a talk with her and hope you feel less upset today

As MAS says the 'drink the morning dew and you can forget chemo' bunch pop up all over the place. If they turn up here, we give them short shrift and report their posts

topsy your story reminds me of when I was in secondary school, - my brother was severely disabled (with cerebral palsy), and the RE teacher told me my parents must have done something wicked to be 'cursed' with a disabled child. I walked out of the lesson and I never went back to any of that teacher's lessons. (despite constant rows from my form teacher )

Some folk are from a different planet, they really are. (And I'm not suggesting its anything to do with religious views, - I got loads of fabulous friends who have religious beliefs and they don't subscribe to any of that 'wickedness' nonsense.)

Hooray for treatment break amber, - definitely a day for and

topsy, - sorry you had a low day yesterday, lots of hugs, and a bunch of for you

Sparkle, your DS is wise beyond his years, and has a lot to deal with for a little guy. Sorry he's sore today , I hope he feels better soon.

Good luck Figgy - hope everything goes well today

MAS, - do you hear from RWU, on facebook? - I wondered how she was doing, I often think of her

Actually, just thinking about RWU, - she never held back with the eat more veg. brigade did she? - feisty girl!

oh yes, she was very stern with them Think she is fine- enjoying job and life it seems -hooray- haven't heard from her for ages,but she occasionally posts - if you're lurking RWU hello !
sparkle- your ds is adorably wise. Am shocked @ teacher KK ! I think I'd deck anyone who implied that bc was a result of being 'bad' in some way- grrrrr.

stars..having cancer can be a real eye opener about peoples characters and who your real friends are.

i have also had some funny experiences with close friends one for example who about 3 years ago got leukemia and was ill for quite a while i was always there for her,cry and laugh with her when she was miserable we use to make plans for when she was better etc when i found out i had BC i turned to her because i was terrified all she said was "shit" and have never seen her since nor has she contacted me yet this was a friend i saw all the time.

another old friend who i have known forever who i always considered to be my best friend when i was first diagnosed and convinced my time was up,i found i didnt want to tell her why well it just hit me she would gossip and it dawned on me i actually didnt trust her.that was a real eye opener.

another friend though promised to keep it quiet (couldnt face sympathy or questions at the time because i was a wreck)told a number of people yet denied it they also made it all about them wanting sympathy and praise from others for supporting me.

another friend kept upsetting me when i first lost my hair and had just started wearing my wig and felt very self conscious by going on and on about websites,scalfs,hats,what her friend wore when she had BC and no matter how many times i told her i was not going to be a hat/scalf person she wouldnt shutup about it even changed tactics by saying you will never cope with your wig in the summer you will get to hot.then bugger me went and got my bloods done and the flipping nurse started saying the same.yes i did go home and cry.

yet theres been a couple of people who have really surprised me by being there for me who i didnt expect.of course my mum,sister and kids have been wonderful its reminded me how lucky i am to have them but its also left me with that feeling i need to make new friends.