I have to have the vaccine or I loose my job

[wingingmumlife]

I am absolutely prepared to get flamed for this but I am really worrying.

I am 22 year years old, healthy and unvaccinated (by choice).

I am not anti-vax, I have had every single vaccine from being a child to now and my daughter is up to date with all of hers too.

I work in dentistry and myself and 4 other colleagues have been told we have to be fully vaccinated by April 2022 otherwise, we lose our jobs.

I just can't believe it has come to this. I feel like my human rights have been taken away. I'm not a conspiracy theorist and I am a big believer in science but as a genuine question ... Can someone please tell me why this vaccine is being pushed so much to the point where soon we probably won't be able to even go into a restaurant without having this vaccine?

I have to wear AGP PPE every single day for every single patient but this still isn't enough?

I test myself every single day, but this still isn't enough?

Can someone please help it make sense to me? That is a genuine question.

Im not looking for an argument and I'm not wanting anyone to tell me "how stupid I am" I just want this to make sense.

For anyone wondering why I haven't had the vaccine - the main reason being, I have severe health anxiety, ironic I know since most would think I'd jump for the vaccine, but at the moment I'm more scared of this vaccine then I am of catching Covid itself.

I just feel sick to my stomach at the thought of not having a job unless I have this vaccine, it really doesn't sit well with me but everyone on here seems to be supporting it?

Finknottlesnewt

That’s quite an outburst at a poster who didn’t say the vaccine doesn’t readied transmission, they said it didn’t stop it which is correct, reduction is not elimination.

I don't believe people can get double vaccinated and then be so supportive of other people who don't want to get vaccinated.

There seems to be an awful lot of them on Mumsnet.

It is a human right to refuse medical treatment and some of us still believe in basic freedoms.

@ChardonnaysPetDragon

I find it strange that you suffer health anxiety about the vaccine but not about COVID.

That is probably the case for of most people who have not had the jab

I was happy to social distance, rather regret that was taken away as I quite liked not having people queuing within cms of me in supermarkets.

It wouldn't bother me if a dentist or their assistant wasn't vaccinated. They wear masks/ PPE, that's enough for me.

I heard recently of someone who died with Covid. Spouse of someone I used to work with. Fully vaccinated, under 50. Didn't work so limited socialising with others although did have school age children. If anything this made me less inclined to get the vaccine than I was already. If your time's up, it's up.

@Grenlei

I was happy to social distance, rather regret that was taken away as I quite liked not having people queuing within cms of me in supermarkets.

It wouldn't bother me if a dentist or their assistant wasn't vaccinated. They wear masks/ PPE, that's enough for me.

I heard recently of someone who died with Covid. Spouse of someone I used to work with. Fully vaccinated, under 50. Didn't work so limited socialising with others although did have school age children. If anything this made me less inclined to get the vaccine than I was already. If your time's up, it's up.

But it isn't about you personally. I'm also not bothered if someone increases my risk of exposure because they happen to not be vaccinated.

It's the population level consequences of coronavirus being un-mititgated that is problematic. Measures such as this are a way of reducing chains of transmission.

@Lightisnotwhite as of 11 November, ANYONE entering a care home has to have had both vaccines, including family members and repairmen/women.

I am CEV and have had the both vaccines and the booster. I spoke to both my consultants beforehand, and went from there.

@BungleandGeorge

It is a totally new precedent and those suggesting otherwise are incorrect. This is the first time a vaccine has been required by law.

www.bbc.com/future/article/20211029-why-mandatory-vaccination-is-nothing-new

@FuckingFucksicles

For people saying facepalm healthy people can pass it on to people who can get very ill... they are all vaccinated now and the ones who cant well, sorry but what can we do even if we all were vaccinated IT DOESNT STOP transmission even the adverts say this! Healthy people should be left to decide what they do! If I have a heavy cold I stay away from people and Id do the same with covid! We cant keep doing this. We arnt bad people for not getting vaccinated! I have a great immune system and I dont want some jab making me feel like shit thanks!

You know why you're free to make that choice when you have a cold? It's because A) you know when you have a cold because you have obvious symptoms very early and B) the consequences for you accidentally passing it on to a vulnerable person aren't "and then they died".

MauraandLaura

Great post!

[quote howdiditcometothis666]@CJsGoldfish 4 people in Scotland have died from the vaccine (up to August) so yes there are downsides to it.
So I can totally understand why someone might find it difficult to take themselves to a vaccine centre and physically have a vaccine that might kill them. No matter how small the risk. I do not think it is my right or the Govt's right to demand that they do it.[/quote]
It is not certain that they "died from the vaccine". The professor of public health at the University of Edinburgh told BBC Scotland that "We have been aware of the rare blood clots that we think are linked to the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine... but it's not always possible to say the vaccine caused it. There may be other contributory factors."

So, the vaccine may have triggered something in the immune systems of those four people - or it may have been something else.

and the ones who cant well, sorry but what can we do even if we all were vaccinated IT DOESNT STOP transmission even the adverts say this!

The point is to reduce rates of transmission in health care settings because

1). Close contact makes transmission more likely.
2). Obviously the nature of a health care setting means that it must accommodate people who are very vulnerable. At the moment that means they have to accept some level of isolation. They can’t avoid going to hospital.

It's because A) you know when you have a cold because you have obvious symptoms very early and B) the consequences for you accidentally passing it on to a vulnerable person aren't "and then they died".

And also C) the chances of you taking up an ICU place with a cold are zero. Which is not true of covid no matter how young and healthy you are.

But the consequences of passing on a cold or flu can be that someone dies - that's always been the case. When I was at university a healthy fellow student died of complications from flu. A child at my DC's school developed sepsis from a cold and died.

Transmission is still possible even if you're vaccinated. Reduced yes, but there is nothing that will prevent transmission entirely.

@Grenlei

I was happy to social distance, rather regret that was taken away as I quite liked not having people queuing within cms of me in supermarkets.

It wouldn't bother me if a dentist or their assistant wasn't vaccinated. They wear masks/ PPE, that's enough for me.

I heard recently of someone who died with Covid. Spouse of someone I used to work with. Fully vaccinated, under 50. Didn't work so limited socialising with others although did have school age children. If anything this made me less inclined to get the vaccine than I was already. If your time's up, it's up.

gosh, when are we going to stop looking at only our small backgarden??? it is not only the 90//100 people we know. It is the 68 million in the UK. It is a matter of public health. Whe do people starting realising what life would be if we hadnt arrived to these vaccines? I cannot imagine how life would be. All our kids would not have grandparents and uncles and aunties, many of us would be dead, if not from covid from other illnesses like undiagnosed cancer because our hospitals would be struggling without doctors, nurses, staff, we would have rotten teeth as our dentist would be with covid, or dead or isolating, same for police, supermarket, train drivers, and all the innocent children who are clinically vulnerable and they just rely on us to protect them!!

This pandemic has showed so much selfishness!

Whilst I believe you have the right to a choice, your employer also has a duty of care to its patients, plenty of whom will be clinically vulnerable (sometimes also because of mouth jnfections/inflammation). You can't avoid getting very close to them due to the very nature of your job so either pick something where you can keep your distance more from others, or have the vaccine.

The choice is yours.

So to respond to your "I feel my human rights are being taken away from me": Many vulnerable people will feel like that too. Yet they have no say in the matter.

I would also like to add that immunocompromised child is relying on other people having had the vaccine to protect her. You wouldn't know looking at her, but the virus could kill her. Same for hundreds of thousands of people with disabilities, cancer survivors, the like. You never know who you might give a death sentence.

@Finknottlesnewt You missed my point I am not anti vax, I just do not feel I have a right to demand others get vaccinated.

Plus I am afraid your figures for household! transmission of vaccinated versus unvaccinated are wildly incorrect. There have been repeated warnings from scientists that there is little difference and it equals out after just 3 mths www.theguardian.com/world/2021/oct/28/covid-vaccinated-likely-unjabbed-infect-cohabiters-study-suggests

You know when the 2020 death rate is standardised for age and population size it is less than 2008 and all the years before. The vast majority of my life I have lived with a worse death rate than 2020 and I have lost loved ones to all sorts of things some due to other people's selfishness. Maybe that is why I don't feel the same as you appear to ie demanding someone else gets vaccinated. Not my decision.

@wingingmumlife Health anxiety aside, why don’t you want the vaccine?
If you aren’t anti-vax and are up to date with all other vaccines, I imagine it’s because it is a new vaccine and you are worried about long term affects?
I work with the Scientists that developed the vaccine and I feel 100% assured that it is safe. In the same way that I would trust my surgical colleagues to operate on me, I trust the academics developing vaccines to only release to the public a safe and effective vaccine.

Not read all the responses but I'm in the same boat with losing my job. I'm not even clinical and was not asked about my vaccination status at all when I started my job. I've had all the normal ones but was never asked, yet I'm now being told I must take a vaccine I don't want or be sacked.

I guess they'll have to sack me. Quite frankly my job is stressful enough now (as well as being poorly paid), I can only imagine how much worse it will be in April once we're even shorter staffed, so maybe it's the best thing for me.

OP you are talking yourself down a pointless rabbit hole justifying your not having the vaccine. It is your anxiety talking. The point is that amongst the general public most people think it is right for health care workers of all types to be vaccinated in order to protect the vulnerable to the best of their ability.if you take it to those who work in the fields of health and science almost everyone is convinced that health care workers and others who work up close and personal with the vulnerable should have it. On a population basis it is obviously better for as many people as possible to be fully vaccinated. In your case where anxiety is stopping you taking this step for your career, your health and those who attend your place of work I would strongly suggest that you tackle the anxiety. It is about to make you take a serious step that I am sure you would rather it didn't. See if you can get some help over the next couple of months. I feel for you.

@questionsneverstop gosh, patronise much?!

I cannot bear this rhetoric some have on MN, the stench of sanctimony is just unbearable.

I don't believe that without a vaccine society would now have collapsed and millions would be dead. We'd have worked out a way to live with it just as mankind has with every disease for generations.

Probably an unpopular view, but I think it’s a reasonable choice. You have a choice. Lose your job or have the vaccine like millions of others

I don't believe that without a vaccine society would now have collapsed and millions would be dead. We'd have worked out a way to live with it

How would you propose?

I can't believe how many people on here are relying on the vaccination to stop transmission in close contact situations. It doesn't www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-59077036

[quote Grenlei]@questionsneverstop gosh, patronise much?!

I cannot bear this rhetoric some have on MN, the stench of sanctimony is just unbearable.

I don't believe that without a vaccine society would now have collapsed and millions would be dead. We'd have worked out a way to live with it just as mankind has with every disease for generations.[/quote]
Are you aware of how the last 'flu pandemic ended?

It wasn't so much a "working out a way to live with it" as it was a complete and utter devastation