96 dead today...

[Homeontherangeuk]

But Boris knows what he's doing...

Too many assumptions

Everything is assumption.

The waves have fallen due to LD's, countries without them i.e Brazil just keep on infecting more people.

That’s not actually true, go look up some data

We’re just going round in circles now, I don’t think we’re getting anywhere.

@TheKeatingFive

Too many assumptions

Everything is assumption.

The waves have fallen due to LD's, countries without them i.e Brazil just keep on infecting more people.

That’s not actually true, go look up some data

We’re just going round in circles now, I don’t think we’re getting anywhere.

I did, Brazil has just kept going up, no mitigation CV rises, its not rocket science and i'm surprised after 16mths you don't get this but there we are.

@Praguemum

Need to put a woman in charge, not a manchild with the intellect of a meringue. I live in NZ. I rest my case.

Yeah yeah yeah NZ is perfect etc

A brief google shows clear waves in Brazil.

Not an ever climbing line.

[quote pam290358]@SEMPA1234567 That’s somewhat oversimplifying the situation. Your own ‘relatively small chance’ of dying isn’t the point and nobody is suggesting you lock yourself away, but to just abandon caution and ‘live life as normal’ isn’t the answer either. If we all just throw away the trappings of lockdown overnight, what was the point of the last 15 months ?[/quote]
@ pam290358 I don’t think I’m over simplifying it at all!. We are NEVER going to get rid of covid. It will always be with us just like the 1000’s of other diseases you could get ill/die from. I agree if our only concern was just simply to get rid of/keep covid cases low we would lock down and have minimal contact with the outside world as that’s how you can stop it spreading. However this is not the only thing we have to think of, children missing education, kids being at home in abusive/unstable environments, people being locked in doors with violent partners, people loosing their businesses, family’s unable to pay the bills/feed their kids/keep the electricity on, the debt our children will be paying off for the rest of their lives, old people being kept prisoners in care homes, not being able to be with your loved ones when they are dying, people living in complete depressive isolation, increased suicide rates, people dying from cancer as they aren’t being treated in time, I could go on and on, the list is infinite! I just don’t believe that the HUGE list of downsides is worth it to stop a relatively small amount of people dying of covid. You might disagree and therefore can continue to isolate but I want to be given the option to get on with my life. I agreed in the main, with keeping precautions in place until we had a vaccine but now we’ve got a vaccine this is as good as it’s going to get. Yes rates will rise but what’s the alternative, living for years/decades in a state of lockdown? To me that is complete madness! The constant reporting of this disease is causing people to fixate on it! There’s a lot more things to be worried about!

@Egghead68 I understand it just fine thank you. I'm not sure you do. It has changed because there is more money to be made the more people who get jabbed. More transmissible doesn't mean more deadly, cases are high but deaths are not, be that due to the vaccine or the virus getting weaker is something of a moot point. Generally speaking viruses get less deadly the longer they are in circulation.

@SEMPA1234567 here here, couldn't have put it better myself

The viruses getting less deadly is a myth. It was invented in the 1800’s by some random doctor and has been debunked by modern scientists

[quote CosmicHeat]@SEMPA1234567 here here, couldn't have put it better myself[/quote]
ditto to this!

@SEMPA1234567

Other countries have managed to keep f2f education going, suicides aren't going up and visits to CH's can take place, it was a policy decision not to allow them, after the disasterous CH death rates.

Plus we have vaccines that in a healthy pop. prevent serious illness/death.

So we can proceed cautiously, people can do the things you have said (for some reason) you believe we cannot do.

No one is saying return to a MArch '20 LD.

But just pretending Cv has gone away is madness and will lead to more, far more problems than, in the short term, it solves.

@TheKeatingFive As i read the Brazil graph, yes they had waves but their troughs were still v high, so not really what has happened in europe, though i don't know how widespread testing is in Brazil.
www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/brazil/

[quote CosmicHeat]@SEMPA1234567 here here, couldn't have put it better myself[/quote]
Me too. 100% agree. The attention case number are given needs to stop! Let PHE deal with it. The country needs to get back on track. Far too many down sides.

@ArseInTheCoOpWindow

The viruses getting less deadly is a myth. It was invented in the 1800’s by some random doctor and has been debunked by modern scientists

That must be why the common cold still kills millions

Did the common cold ever kill millions?

So things like "RSV" which are generally called the common cold is deadlier in children than covid, once you've had it though, re-infection tends to be light until you're old enough to need something to finish you off.

Covid is likely to be similar, although as said covid is less deadly than RSV in young kids on current data.

My Grandad died from what started as a common cold and then progressed to pnemonia

And I suspect yes when it was first found as a novel virus it could have done

@jasjas1973 I’m not sure the point you are trying to make? You don’t want a lock down but you do want some restrictions? If so which ones? Face masks? There’s still no clear evidence that these are effective in the general population it just depends on which study you look at. While I agree PPE used properly by professionals works, a piece of cloth (not medical grade) kept in your pocket, pulled out with unwashed hands doesn’t seem healthy to me!…..social distancing? In most social settings people naturally keep their distance from strangers, do we really need government regulations on this? Where social distancing has been enforced on businesses, many have struggled with reduced capacity and have either built up huge debt or shut down completely. Can we keep asking small business owners to trade like this?….reduced numbers at gatherings? The stress and heartbreak this has caused for people holding weddings and funerals can not continue. Plus the nonsense of kids being unable to meet up with friends for play dates etc when they’ve spent all week in school with them is crazy!….I completely respect your choice to continue to do what ever makes you feel safer, I’m just shocked that others feel they should tell we what I should do!…please tell me what restrictions you want to keep on fully vaccinated people and for how long? We have to eventually stop all restrictions don’t we? And whenever that happens theirs going to be a fall out, deal with it now rather than in the winter when things will be worse.

Some people just refuse to engage with the continuing impact lower tier restrictions have on certain sectors. Or consider if they’re even making much of a difference.

I wonder, re masks, if focusing on vulnerable people wearing medical grade masks might be a more effective strategy than everyone wearing cloth masks badly?

@SEMPA1234567 please stop talking such sense

@TheKeatingFive

Some people just refuse to engage with the continuing impact lower tier restrictions have on certain sectors. Or consider if they’re even making much of a difference.

I wonder, re masks, if focusing on vulnerable people wearing medical grade masks might be a more effective strategy than everyone wearing cloth masks badly?

Yes, we need to focus on protecting the vulnerable/ECV who want to be protected. Whether that's providing better quality face masks, providing more physical support, i.e. more shopping deliveries, more household practical help, more GP/nurse visits in person to the home or phone calls etc.

We really, really can't keep everyone else locked down and only doing "essential" things.

It would be cheaper to provide each ECV person with a personal assistant that paying the hundreds of billions in furlough, covid grants, bounce back loans, and ultimately higher unemployed, business bankruptcies etc.

We need to look at things in a different way now.

It would be cheaper to provide each ECV person with a personal assistant that paying the hundreds of billions in furlough, covid grants, bounce back loans, and ultimately higher unemployed, business bankruptcies etc.

Absolutely

Agree

Yes there are so many other things that could be done rather than defaulting to lockdown which is supposed to be an emergency, one time only option! You merely delay the inevitable.

I would like to see shit hot infection controls in hospitals, since something like 40% of cases are picked up there..Often in people that are already ill will something else.

I’m so tired of lockdown being treated as a long term strategy. It’s not!

We have to eventually stop all restrictions don’t we? And whenever that happens theirs going to be a fall out, deal with it now rather than in the winter when things will be worse

Again you are making an assumption that by everyone having CV now, we then go into winter with low infections?
Where is your evidence for that? even if other people to die to achieve HI.

Its huge gamble, one that other countries aren't doing.

You can relax some restrictions, such as on weddings and funerals, keep others like no night clubs and table service in pubs, something most of europe has done since time began, avoiding the scrum for the bar, where people do not SD.Or is there some weird thing that stops uk hospitality from turning a profit with table service?

On night clubs, if a vax passport is needed in Sept, why isn't it now?

Keep SD and mask wearing as a matter of law and once we have far more db vaccinated, relax further.

But of course, this is one thing i truly hope you are right on and i'm a 100% wrong, that would be great if that happened.

@Backofbeyond50

These people who want to keep lockdowns and restrictions must have very comfortable lives with very comfortable incomes and have all the time in the world to home school their children. Most people don't. What about those people and industries who have been wiped out financially and in terms of mental health by these lockdowns? Now furlough has finished we have to open up.

I agree we now need to open up but I don't buy the whole Lockdown Lover check your privledge nonsense.

I accepted that Lockdown was necessary but did I enjoy it? Fuck no? First few months DH was shielding and having kids at home was OK. Kids loved it. I found it stressful at times though with neurodiverse dds
My work ended and as SE whose work had increased very recently the support was an insult. 3 months support was less than half a months income.

Lockdown 3 was by far the worse though. The school ramped up the pressure and dd3 especially just couldn't do it.

Yet I knew it was what the Country needed at the time.

I am not calling anyone a lockdown lover, I very much doubt many people enjoyed it BUT I do think those people calling for the restrictions to continue are probably those who have very comfortable lives, where lockdown has minimal impact on their lives and incomes anyway. They didn't like lockdown but could manage mentally and financially. Nothing massive changed in their lives in that respect. I would love to see some figures on this.

Not lockdown to continue but sensible precautions. Strewth. It is not either /or.