US - Iran Peace agreement Part 2

[JadeHare]

Doesn’t really look like anyone believes that Donald is going to come out of his stupid war with any kind of better deal.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/us/news/2026/05/26/trump-us-iran-capitulation/

Who to believe here ?

Iran strikes vessel, pausing UN efforts to evacuate ships from Hormuz | CNN

I’ve corrected you once before on the breaches of the ceasefire between Lebanon and Israel.

I repeat:

On 17 October 2025, the UN rights office (OHCHR), states that despite the ceasefire, Israel continues to conduct almost daily attacks on Lebanese territory. These assaults have caused a rise in civilian deaths and injuries, as well as significant damage to infrastructure, homes, the environment, and vital agricultural areas that support civilian livelihoods.[78] Since the truce started, Israel's Defense Forces have confirmed over 500 airstrikes targeting what they identify as Hezbollah positions. The Armed Conflict Location and Event Data (ACLED), a conflict monitoring organization, documented 330 airstrikes and artillery attacks by Israel between November 27 and January 10, along with 260 incidents of property destruction.[79] Since the attacks on Lebanon began in October 2023, Israeli strikes have killed more than 4,000 people, injured nearly 17,000, and displaced over 92,000 individuals due to ongoing violence.[80] The United Nations has confirmed 127 civilian casualties in Lebanon, including 71 men, 21 women, and 16 children. Furthermore, there have been at least 19 cases of civilians abducted by Israeli soldiers in southern Lebanon, which could lead to enforced disappearances.[81]

The current war going on between Israel and Lebanon is due to the fact that Hezbollah attacked Israel again after the death of the Ayatollah. Let’s get the facts straight.

If you're talking to me, both sides have breached the ceasefire between Lebanon and Israel - both Hezbollah and the IDF.

Though I wasn't talking about ceasefire breaches but about the fact that Hezbollah started the current conflict in Lebanon by attacking Israel.

As you say, the current war going on between Israel and Lebanon is due to the fact that Hezbollah attacked Israel again after the death of the Ayatollah. Israel didn't attack Lebanon first.

They never stopped. Despite the “ceasefire”.

The Pentagon covered up the massive damage Iran inflicted on the US Navy Base in Bahrain, including the Fifth Fleet headquarters, the WSJ reports.

Satellite imagery revealed the extent of the destruction which could cost $400 million to repair. Total cost for US base damage is now $2 billion.

https://www.wsj.com/world/middle-east/iran-us-naval-base-bahrain-e87bbca3?mod=hp_lead_pos7

(sorry for the paywalled link)

https://www.timesofisrael.com/us-considering-moving-gulf-bases-hit-by-iran-westward-including-to-israel-report/

No neither Hezbollah not the IDF stopped, we can agree on that.

Both sides of course blame the other.

Hence @Ihatetomatoes is correct in saying they both need to stop.

Is that supposed to be a good thing, that the IRGC inflicted damage on the US navy?

Thanks for the link.

That is why I said "who to believe" re the link I posted above about a ship being hit.

We can go back to Trump saying "tis but a scratch" about the US airbase being hit. Then we saw the real and verified photo of the burned out US surveillance plane.

I strongly disagree.

"The IDF have been invading Lebanon to fight Hezbollah, Gaza to fight Hamas."
I'm sure it's part of it. I don't doubt there is genuine fear, especially civilians. Another large part is that these fights provided convenient excuses for Netanyahu which would help keep him elected. Israel want the Gaza strip as they want Westbank. They believe it's their right to have and they'll fear safer if those areas are under Israeli control. They don't want the Palestinian citizens. Ministers like Ben Gavir have been clear in saying that they don't want Gazans to continue existing on the land. This has been longstanding. The last few years have provided their first opportunity to go in with International support and destroy the livelihoods and opportunities for growth and genuine existence from the Palestinian people.

"Israel did not attack Gaza or Lebanon out of the blue. They were attacked first by Hamas and then by Hezbollah."
Things didn't begin in the October 7th attack. The apartheid in the Westbank has been running for years and years. Gazan citizens have had no rights for just as long. Israel have been squeezing these civilians out of existence for a long time. The attacks from Hamas and Hezbollah didn't 'come out of the blue' either. They've all been locked in a cycle of attacks and hatred for a long time. Israel aren't the 'right' side in this because there is no right side.

"Israel are committed 100% to protecting their civilians. So much so that their response to those civilians being attacked is often disproportionate.
Israel have no regard for civilians who are not their own. We have multiple UN reports saying exactly this. We know that they've targeted children, doctors, reports, scientists. The IDF don't want Gaza or the Westbank to proposer, targeting children achieves this. Your statement that they are 100% committed to protecting civilians is utterly at odds with all the evidence.

By the way, Iran are also dedicated to killing civilians.

"We know this yet Hamas and Hezbollah attacked anyway, putting their hate for Israel above the safety of their civilians."
This is a line that's said a lot by Israel supporters and settlers. The idea that Palestine hates Israel more than they love their children was actually said in the Louis Theroux documentary by Israeli settlers. That line was actually much sadder as settlers who were stealing the land of Palestinians were happy to think that the Palestinians just needed to accept it and not fight back or they didn't love their children enough. The utterly backwards logic was detected by them.

Hamaz and Hezbollah probably do hate Israel more than they care for their citizens. Unfortunately that's often the realty of terrorist groups driven by extremist ideology. Netanyahu and the IDF don't have to be concerned that their actions will cost Israeli citizens lives because they're well supported by the US with the best weapons but the actions of Israel have made it very clear how much they hate the citizens of Palestine. Netanyahu is just as much of a religious extremist. Listen to the settlers, their hate is very clear.

"Terrorists don't care about protecting their civilians - see for example, Hamas, Hezbollah and the IRGC."
Not you're right, they don't. Israel clearly care for their own citizens.

Don't you think it is a bad thing that the US is covering up evidence?

Same with the school they hit.

Lebanon have been invaded with 1 million citizens displaced. Of course they're going to shoot at the invading IDF. We would if our country was invaded! There is no equivalent between the IDF being told not to invade and Hezbollah shooting at the actively advancing invaders.

Goodness me. I was thinking we had settled this disclaimer thing, but it keeps being brought up again and again.

If you answer the question I asked first then I will answer yours.

Nothing to do with the fucking disclaimer - move on from that if you can.

I repeat that I wasn't talking about ceasefire breaches but about the fact that Hezbollah started the current conflict in Lebanon by attacking Israel.

You can't tell a country "not to invade" when their civilians are being attacked. Well you can but there's no reason why they would listen.

Again, now we are where we are, the only solution is for both sides to stop the attacks.

Iran bombing sites is bad

There you go

You're right, shooting missiles was blatantly stupid of Hezbollah. The response from the IDF was inevitable and the civilians were always the ones who would pay the price.

But I also repeat, things didn't begin in the October 7th attack. The apartheid in the Westbank has been running for years and years. Gazan citizens have had no rights for just as long. Israel have been squeezing these civilians out of existence for a long time. The attacks from Hamas and Hezbollah didn't 'come out of the blue' either. They've all been locked in a cycle of attacks and hatred for a long time. Israel aren't the 'right' side in this because there is no right side.

Yes, they both need to stop. You can't tell Hezbollah to not shoot at actively advancing invaders. They're going to defend their country. The only party that can stop this right now is Israel who must withdraw. After they've withdrawn then Hezbollah need to stop. Then the IDF need to withdraw from every neighbouring country that they've invaded. The Westbank needs to be returned to the Palestinian people and the settlers need to be removed as quickly as possible. Then international allys need to help ensure Israel's protection from within their own borders and a two state solution needs to implemented. We can dream...

A lot to unpick here.

We agree there will be genuine fear amongst Israeli civilians. The recent wars in Gaza and Lebanon weren't started by Netanyahu so I don't agree they provided "excuses" for him to stay in power. Plus the wars aren't necessarily popular with Israeli people so they may harm rather than help him when it comes to the elections in Israel. Either way, he didn't start them apart from the war in Iran.

Ben Gvir is an extremist who wants to take land and this appeals to other extremists within Israel government and society. The war has helped them with this goal. Again, Netanyahu didn't start the recent wars so it seems a massive own goal on the part of Hamas. I don't condone the taking of land or the Settlers.

We all know the war didn't start on 7/10/23. Nevertheless, Hamas actions that day triggered the Gaza war and all the awful repercussions. Hezbollah could have learnt from that not to follow Hamas into certain war for the sake of their civilians but they didn't.

You quoted me saying "Israel are committed 100% to protecting their civilians. So much so that their response to those civilians being attacked is often disproportionate". Then countered with: Israel have no regard for civilians who are not their own.

My reply to that is no country at war can protect the civilians of the country they are at war with, it is up to each country to put resources into defence. Plus I never claimed that Israel did care about civilians who are not their own; neither does any other country at war and they shouldn't be held to higher standards than other countries in this regard.

You seem critical of my belief that Hamas and Hezbollah put their hatred for Israel above the safety of their civilians, calling it "a line". Yet you also agree that "Hamaz and Hezbollah probably do hate Israel more than they care for their citizens" so maybe it's "a line" often used because it's an obvious truth?

We agree on the Settlers - their hate is very clear and I don't support their actions now or in the past.

The question I asked you was Is that supposed to be a good thing, that the IRGC inflicted damage on the US navy? Perhaps you could answer that specific question if you want me to answer your specific question.

I know things didn't begin with the October 7th attack.

I agree that there is no completely "right side" historically because they have both done bad things having been as you say, locked in a cycle of attacks and hatred for a long time.

We all seem to have taken a side in the recent though, and that is what we are debating on this board.

Personally, I blame the ones more who started the wars in Gaza and Lebanon more than the ones who responded in an admittedly disproportionate manner.

You point out that you can't tell Hezbollah to not shoot at actively advancing invaders. They're going to defend their country. If you see that as logical then you should also see that it is logical for Israel too that they are always going to defend their country from those that attack it.

Noted you have found a way to not answer the question. That's ok but stop shooting questions at me if you're not prepared to answer mine.

This does cover it. You don't need specific posts per bombing.

Unless you are trying to set some kind of purity test to undermine the poster in which case yes, you are back to disclaimers on every post.

I didn't shout, I just didn't think your question was in good faith.

The article I shared was about the US not publicy acknowdleging the damage that was caused to their naval base, the estimated cost to the US and the consequences of that attack,

Nothing to do with the IRGC being bad or good