Has enough been done to tackle incitement to genocide?

[Scirocco]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cze5w2wd4x0o

I'm not sure what you mean. The US, UK & EU are heavily involved in diplomatic efforts to get Hamas to release the hostages & agree to a workable ceasefire. Im unclear exactly ME countries are doing just now - perhaps you have more information. They need to be working on what replaces Hamas, right? NGOs are very vocal. The international community is putting lots of pressure on Israel around conduct of the war which is being pretty heavily scrutinised. And most importantly Israelis are actively involved in trying to push their government to a ceasefire deal. There is no magic wand, which, frankly, seems to be the solution that some people are grasping for.

Yet innocent people are being killed every day, no independent press or independent observers are allowed in. You've listed a lot there that actually amounts to very little if 11 months on the killing, bombing, displacement, war crimes continue.

The international community is putting lots of pressure on Israel around conduct of the war which is being pretty heavily scrutinised.
Pressure? it needs more than that.

There is no magic wand, which, frankly, seems to be the solution that some people are grasping for.
People aren't naive enough to think there's a magic wand people just want Israel to keep within the international laws they have signed up to

Do you think Israel would be under greater pressure to halt its actions if Hamas and its allies were to release the hostages they abducted?

Do you think a ceasefire would be more likely if that were to happen?

If so, why do you suppose there isn’t a huge international outcry for the abducted hostages to be released?

Netanyahu has made it quite clear that releasing the hostages will not stop the "war". He has demonstrated that he cares very little about the hostages whose families have said as such.
Pressure does not work on him and his government. Sanctions need to be applied, then maybe this slaughter might stop.
It is also unfair and inaccurate to say that there hasn't been outcry about the hostages.

If so, why do you suppose there isn’t a huge international outcry for the abducted hostages to be released?

Calls for a ceasefire include releasing the hostages. So yes there is an international outcry for it. Do you genuinely think that people would not want hostages released?

"Calls for a ceasefire include releasing the hostages". In theory you’re right, of course - yet how many placards saying "Release the hostages now!" or similar do you ever see in marches or posts online calling for a ceasefire? Judging by the placards, flags etc. nearly all those demanding a "ceasefire" actually just mean Israel should lay down its arms.

Yes, there is a long history of dispute before last October and no, I don’t defend Israeli actions or policy in the West Bank, and yes, @Auvergne63 , I agree that Netanyahu is vile. But surely you can’t deny that the October massacre, rapes and abductions were the factors that precipitated this dreadful war (clearly just as Hamas planned, in their keenness to make martyrs of the Palestinian civilians whether they wanted to be martyrs or not). To pretend that there is currently much international pressure for the unconditional release of the hostages is just ridiculous.

Negotiating with kidnappers and rewarding them for their crimes simply leads to more kidnaps, as we have seen. If the hostages were released unconditionally it would be very hard for Netanyahu to have any support at all internationally for continuing the war. Don’t you think it’s worth a try?

Negotiating with kidnappers and rewarding them for their crimes simply leads to more kidnaps, as we have seen. If the hostages were released unconditionally it would be very hard for Netanyahu to have any support at all internationally for continuing the war. Don’t you think it’s worth a try?

I'm not sure what is worth a try?

All of this. It is simply untrue and dishonesf for anyone to imply that the release of the hostages has been on any way front and centre of the calls for 'ceasefire now'. They never have been. The posters are not there, the chants & speeches are not there. Combined with the fact that variations of 'resistence is justified' ARE always present on those marches and in these discussions.
We all criticise Netanyahu. But that does not detract ftom the need to release the hostages (or the reality if Hamas's strategy of embedding among civilians being responsible for many civilian deaths) and would help to isolate any parts of his strategy that are unjustified - we have agreed previously that Israel was fully justified in attacking Hamas for the 7 October attack and it is Hamas's responsibility if they use human shields.

Exactly.

The unconditional release of the hostages.

Dulra why do you always insist people explain things over & over again. Its there in the sentence - release the hostages unconditionally. There can be no justification for not relessing the hostages. What possible justification is there, while we are talking about abiding by international law?

Dulra why do you always insist people explain things over & over again.

Why do you constantly have to patronise and insult people? You have done it a few times to me now. Not pleasant

Human shields.. again. OMG seriously.

@dulra ok, apologies if you feel patronised. Why is Hamas releasing the hostages not worth a try?

Yet you have no opinion on whether Hamas ought to release the abducted hostages unconditionally?

Of course they should they should not have taken them in the first place. They won't though

So since you think they should, are you saying it’s not worth trying to build international pressure for them to do so because "they won’t"?

This conversation is quite one sided. Demands for the hostages to be released unconditionally, yet ignoring the Palestinians imprisoned without charge or trial. Ignoring that crimes including those who murder Palestinians walk away scot free.
FWIW I do believe that the hostages should be released unconditionally. As should all those innocent Palestinians who are in inhumane conditions in Israeli dungeons. Or maybe it's better to ignore that Israel has an apartheid prison policy which allows them to even do this.

Didn't say that no idea why you got that from what I said

OK. So you do think it’s a good idea to try to build international pressure for unconditional release of the hostages? Correct me if I’m wrong but you seem to be trying to avoid saying that.

But surely you can’t deny that the October massacre, rapes and abductions were the factors that precipitated this dreadful war (clearly just as Hamas planned, in their keenness to make martyrs of the Palestinian civilians whether they wanted to be martyrs or not). To pretend that there is currently much international pressure for the unconditional release of the hostages is just ridiculous.
Of course it precipitated the "war", why would I deny this? But Hamas did not dictate the level of response from the Israeli government to the horrors of 07/10.
The fact that Hamas is keen to make martyrs of the Palestinians does not absolve the Israeli government of their responsibilities towards conducting their operations within the international rules of law. After all, they signed up to uphold them, haven't they?
Finally, I don't know where you get your news from but to say that there isn't international pressure to release the hostages from different world governments is indeed ridiculous.

I know.

So you do think it’s a good idea to try to build international pressure for unconditional release of the hostages?
Anything that will work to release the hostages and bring an end to the conflict in Gaza is a good idea. Or does releasing the hostages unconditionally mean Israel continue their assault in Gaza?

And, more to the point avoiding admitting that calling for unconditional hostage releae has absolutely NOT been at the forefront of demands for a ceasefire. And others pretending they dont understand that embedding on civilian areas is against international law and is partly why civilian casualtirs are so high. There is no point in trying to have a rational conversation at all.

She covered that in the phrase 'worth a try' and the tationale in her post & my post. Obviously we have no direct control over netanyahu but it would absolitely change the dynamic. Obviously. Now Im out because if you are going to play this game of pretending not to understand its pointless