Over 210 massacred at Nuseirat refugee camp by IDF

[ConnieCounter]

https://www.thejournal.ie/israel-bombs-refugee-camp-200-dead-hamas-gaza-6402337-Jun2024/

The footage coming out of this this absolutely sickening. So many precious children killed. I've never seen anything like it. Poor innocent babies.

It's great that they managed to rescue 4 hostages (though it seems they killed others) but the human cost of that for Palestinians (and potentially other hostages) is absolutely obscene and not acceptable.

Saying "Hamas started it" ignores years and years of history and pretends that October 7th came out of nowhere

As for hostages, it's very convenient to ignore the thousands of Palestinians held in Israeli prisons for offences such as "raising the Palestinian flag"

Or this:

A 2023 report by Save the Children found widespread use of physical, emotional, and sexual abuse against Palestinian children in Israeli military detention. The report found that among detained children, 86% were beaten, 69% were strip searched, 60% spent time in solitary confinement, 68% were denied any healthcare, and 58% were denied visits or communication with family

And given, therefore, that the IDF have been holding thousands of Palestinian children captive, beating them and sexually abusing them, then all the arguments put forward that justify Israels current attacks on Gaza, also justify October 7th.

Now I don't personally believe it does justify October 7th. But I also dont believe Israel are justified in their actions. But if its okay to kill 1000s of Palestinians because Hamas started it, then maybe consider what it's okay to do when Israel is taking your children prisoner and abusing them? what would you do?

I certainly hope I have made my point, PearlKoala. The loss of life is tragic and of children, especially so. I can’t forget that the two little Bibas children are still in captivity.

I’d suggest you read more about the proposed ceasefires. The last one I believe from last week. As what you’re saying is not the case

I certainly hope I have made my point,

You have over and over that Israel are justified in their response. I can't understand how anyone can think it is ever justified to kill so many children to the point you are added to a black list for children killers but if that's how you think so be it but take your justifications elsewhere

It’s pretty sick to come to the thread about the people, many of them children, that the israelis have just murdered in cold blood - just to ”but Hamas…”.

CITMI is mostly pro-israel, multiple threads where you can dehumanize Palestinians, you really have to come and gloat to this one.

Back to the topic.
It’s so horrible, honestly I ran out of the words to say months ago.
New horrors committed by israel every day.

I understand Hamas have said they will release them if all Palestinian prisoners are released.

I also understand that recently Hamas offered to release the remains of 33 hostages.

@Scirocco yes of course a bilateral deal would be the best outcome along with the moves forward you mention. I certainly agree with you there. And surely that is the outcome nearly all the countries in the region also wish for.

https://x.com/FranceskAlbs/status/1799503174933372999?t=448gjSq5mCpO0LY-cZCW0w&s=19

"Relieved that four hostages have been released. It should not have come at the expense of at least 200 Palestinians, including children, killed and over 400 injured by Israel and allegedly foreign soldiers, while perfidiously hiding in an aid truck.
This is "humanitarian camouflage" at another level.

Israel has used hostages to legitimise killing, injuring, maiming, starving and traumatising Palestinians in Gaza. And while intensifying violence against Palestinians in the rest of the occupied territory and Israel.

Israel could have freed all hostages, alive and intact, 8 months ago when the first ceasfire and hostage exchange was put on the table. Yet, Israel refused in order to continue to destroy Gaza and the Palestinians as a people.

This is genocidal intent turned into action. Crystal clear."

I'm glad you agree. I think we all have people in this conflict that we can't forget, for me it will be little Hind Rajab who was killed by the IDF after begging for help for hours and Ahmad Al-Najar the little 18 old month boy who was decapitated by Israel. Just because we remember some more than others it doesn't make any of the 15,000+ child deaths in this conflict less important than others. They were all cherished by someone.

Or the ~700 Palestinian children held in Israeli prison being beaten and sexually abused, reporting broken bones etc and being denied medical treatment

Some as young as 12, being sentenced for years for crimes such as "throwing stones" and not allowed their parents present in court or visiting them in prison

I assume you can't forget about them in captivity being starved, beaten and raped either?

Imagine if some robbers took hostages in a bank heist and police decided to bomb the entire shopping precinct killing and injuring hundreds of innocent shoppers in order to release 4 hostages. Appropriate?

I don’t think the IDF care about winning any propaganda war.

Hamas should release all the hostages immediately. It’s not like Netanyahu is going to engage in any ceasefire agreement to secure their safe release. How many hostages were killed in this act of violence?

If those last couple of posts were aimed at me, I don’t gloat over the deaths of anyone, certainly not children and I deny that I have done so on this thread.

I will ‘but Hamas’, as you put it, all day long, as, sadly, some people still need to be reminded.

Every human life lost is a tragedy, if getting really angry and insulting other posters makes you feel like you are a more compassionate person, it’s no skin off my nose quite honestly.

No one needs to be reminded. The assumption that people mourning the deaths of civilian Palestinians, many of them children, need to be reminded of Hamas is just bizarre.

Yeah because all the innocent men, women and those poor babies are to blame for the hostages.

This over and over again. People wanna brush over the fact that Israeli settlers stole land, houses took their livelihood apart. It didn't just start and I'm sure everyone knows that but still wanna just mentioned October 7th as if its there's no important dates before or after that. Only because it doesn't suit your narrative you won't mention it.

You seriously need to read up about Netanyahu’s reluctance to accept a ceasefire - including the most recent U.S. backed one. It’s not all ‘Hamas’ now when comes to safe release of hostages.

You must have read about Israeli hostages’ families also being upset about their governments lack of actions in securing release of their loved ones?

I will ‘but Hamas’, as you put it, all day long,

And I will also point out that the Israeli government and the IDf are 100% responsible for the children and civilians they have killed. No amount of "but" anything can absolve them of those murders.

Yes, I have and I agree that the Israeli government could do more. What I have read about the latest hostage deal is that the US said it was extraordinarily generous on the Israel side. I think I am right in saying that there was hope that an agreement would be reached but that Israel believed hostages would be released in the first phase of a ceasefire but in fact Hamas were offering the remains of hostages in the first phase. None of it is very edifying.

I'll probably get flamed for this. But the hostages looking well not a scratch on them. Then you look at the prisoners the IDF hold children, men and women raped, foreign objects inserted, bruises made by various forms of abuse. Yet people will keep screaming the deaths of the civilians is justified for the release of the 4 hostages. I'm glad their out but let's not paint it as if they've been beaten the videos clearly show they've come back well and looking healthy. Just look at the pictures from the attack today, the innocent people who were caught in this.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/videos/c72236x20z8o

I avoid these threads and to my shame I sometimes avoid the news, and when I do read it’s a sanitised version because that’s all most of us can cope with. But today I read and needed to express my sadness.
I can’t understand how there is any civilised compassionate view other than this should not be happening. No matter what your view on the settlement discussion how can what is being perpetrated be viewed with anything other than horror.
How many of the Palestinian children’s name will never be known and spoken about. And what of the women and men lost. And what of the parents left behind with the unimaginable grief. There’s simply no explanation in my mind other than some lives do not matter.

Can you stop derailing the thread now please.

@Dulra sorry you’ve missed my posts! Do you police everyone who posts on MN, or just some of us?

Not policing anyone where has any of my posts suggested that? It has become obvious that there has been a lot of name changing going on and as you're not a regular poster here I wondered were you one? Simple no would have done

Edifying is your adjective of choice?
Please can I ask if you have seen the images coming out of this area of Gaza? If you haven’t, perhaps that’s why you can’t understand the deep horror at the thought that some people think that what has happened is acceptable.