Israel supporting counter marches in London - about time

[mids2019]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13304895/Met-Police-arrest-Palestine-Israel-march-London-protest-Gaza.html

I think in a democracy this is absolutely necessary. Obviously policing will be important but it is good to see that in terms of street protest this is not a come sided issue.

I wonder how many are going to be arrested losing their rag seeing Israeli flags an masse after getting themselves riled up calling for a ceasefire.....

But it is on a much smaller scale and you said, you work with Sudanese people and often these protests will be really only attended by people with links to a particular country. I bet if you asked the average undergraduate British kid on a pro Palestinian march, they wouldn't even know where Darfur was.

Whatever. If you’re happy twisting my words I won’t be the one stopping you. Have a good day

Surely it's a given. No one thinks children dying is ok.

I think if the UK government said they stood by the government in Dafur and supported the war crimes committed there, there may have been some protests? Who knows though. I think a lot of this might specifically be about the UK government’s stand.

Posts denying genocide, refusing to condemn children being killed, stereotyping people who are protesting for a ceasefire and making sweeping judgements. Really shameful behaviour.

But it is on a much smaller scale
March in Manhattan was huge
you work with Sudanese people and often these protests will be really only attended by people with links to a particular country.
Nah mix of people at them and not all are linked to the Sudanese community I work with

I bet if you asked the average undergraduate British kid on a pro Palestinian march, they wouldn't even know where Darfur was.
Why assume anything? ask them and test your theory

I have responded to a poster who said no one is doing anything about these other areas with evidence people are but it is still not good enough! The fact people even have to show we care about other causes too, in order to some way demonstrate to you that we are not specifically anti Israel or anti-Semitic is ridiculous and insulting.

There are not marches every weekend in London with tens of thousands of protesters for Sudan. There just isn't. It's a much more niche cause. I also didn't see any banners on the London marathon route this weekend for Sudan or Yemen.

Who has refused to condemn children being killed?

Were you laughing so hard when big companies like McDonald's pulled out of Russia? Haha, so hilarious, companies not contributing to the economy of countries on trial for genocide 😐

@TextureSeeker

"It's funny isnt it, I've seen so many posters here obsessing over signs 'condemning Hamas' but the same posters never 'condemn' the killing of children by the IDF,"

So I genuinely do think that it is deeply concerning that despite on every thread posters are anonymously willing to condemn or claim to condemn the actions of Hamas yet in real life at protests out of the hundreds of thousands of protesters there are literally none willing to do this in person.

This is not obsessing but trying to establish whether the protesters are either too scared to condemn Hamas publicly, don't really care about what Hamas is doing / has done to Israelis and Palestinians, don't even know about Hamas or are sympathetic / supportive of Hamas.

The reason this is important is that if they are too scared then we need to question whether the protests are indeed peaceful or if they don't care then we need to question whether they truly understand what is happening in Gaza and if they are supportive of Hamas then they are breaking the law.

And yes I certainly condemn the killing of children as @Comedycook posted it should be a given as no one should support the killing of children.

And there are No marches in Dublin every weekend for Palestine because the Irish do not need to protest against their governments stance on the conflict. This is what people keep forgetting, they are marching every weekend in London to send a message to the British government.

But that doesn’t explain why hostages posters have been ripped down and why people holding them are not welcome on pro Palestinian marches . ( It’s not enough for you to say here you personally would welcome it - the reality is different. People holding up placards condemning Hamas have been attacked)
Im sure you will respond to this by ignoring the substance of my post and accusing me of being a genocide supporter…

Yet posters here have answered that question so many times over the past six months but still people don't seem to know the answer and still 'wonder' why there are no signs against Hamas.

I would also wonder how many protests you have been to where you have examined all of the signs and know for sure that are indeed no signs that condemn Hamas in anyway? There are a lot of protests, some of them very large, how many have you attended?

I really think you miss the point some of us are making.
I am not pro Israeli government . I deplore the actions of Israel in Gaza. I felt heartbroken listening to Feargal Keane’s report on the 15 children ( from one family) that were killed last night . The killing in Gaza of innocent people is unjust and cruel.
I hope you will not continue to describe me as a genocide supporter when my concern is community cohesion in THIS country and city where I live and teach lovely children from BOTH communities .

I absolutely believe that the majority of marchers are good people but it does concern me when certain posters on here minimise, deflect and mock the concerns of the Jewish community.

Your implication here is really nasty. What I read in your words is an insinuation that posters who are broadly supportive of Israel don't care about Gazan children being killed unless they plaster it all over MN.

Of course I condemn this. I am a mother and I feel pain in my heart whenever I read about children dying- whether those deaths are deliberate or otherwise. As mothers (which i assume most of us are here) we all know and understand our greatest fear. What difference does it make if I say this on MN? Who else do you demand this of?

Turn on the news, all the media outlets are condemning hamas. Unless you've been under a rock every one interviewed gets asked to condemn hamas. There are 35,000 dead in palestine now and whomever alive is on their way as they're being starved terrorised and no water. People are done with the hamas thing now! It doesn't excuse what Israel are doing. Yes hamas is terrible terrible terrible. But guess what? Israel are doing an amazing job of recruiting more hamas right now with their treatment of the people they occupy

An example of the above is one poster who compared the Chief Executive of the anti semitism campaign to a deplorable, notorious far right activist .
When challenged she stood by her description.

You’re missing the point. The absence of posters condemning Hamas is polarising . I think many many Jews would join the marches deploring the slaughter of innocents in Gaza if they felt they were not marching with people who were Hamas supporters. Placards saying “we condemn Hamas” would reassure them they are not marching with people whose values do not align with theirs

Agree.

I generally post on threads talking about what's happening in the UK as a result of the conflict rather than actually posting about the conflict itself. I try to avoid it because I feel like depending on what I say, I'll either be seen as an acceptable Jew or a genocidal maniac.

I find it concerning when people minimise, mock and deflect what is happening in Gaza. It's not genocide, look over there at what's happening in Yemen why are you only protesting about Gaza why is it only when Israel slaughters people that you care, your signs are wrong why are you holding signs against the people that are committing the genocide that you want to stop.

You can't control what people post though 🤷🏻‍♀️

It always goes this way. If posters don’t perfomatively denounce the Israeli government at the start of every single post they make expressing concern about antisemitism or whatever, they’ll be accused of supporting the murder of children. Like clockwork.

So I’m not surprised that a Jew not carrying an approved banner was called Nazi and scum. The same attitude is regularly visible here on MN.

Incidentally, this is not me refusing to condemn Israel, I will refer posters to my previous posts on that.

Yeah people trying to police what banners people hold are a real PITA. That attitude is all over the last few pages of this thread.

This response is typical of the deflection, misrepresentation , minimisation and mockery exhibited towards any questioning of the conduct in the weekly marches .

So are some of the people posting on here saying that they would more vocally oppose the genocide in Gaza, if they perceived that Israel was being treated fairly?

But as other countries are committing crimes against their own and various groups of people, and even though our government isn’t supporting this, we should all just shut up.

Clearly the dead, dying, disabled, heartbroken starving people in Gaza are the ones being treated the most unfairly here.