It's illegal to teach about white privilege, apparently

[BIWI]

Anyone see this?

article in today's Guardian

I'm absolutely astounded - not only that this is the equalities minister saying this, but also that she black herself. How can she justify this?

I didn't call you any of those things - I did find your post antagonistic rather than engaging and commented on it. This is yet more deliberate twisting and hyperbole.

How does this help anyone? Is the agenda for a positive outcome or just a fight? Yes I am asking that again and maybe it will get deleted again for all I know because yeah it does feel a bit like a twilight zone and unless the rule is white people aren't allowed to comment and will be met with having every word twisted then I don't understand the game at all.

That is a blatant lie. Your post was deleted because of all those things. In the last post you just repeated the last two of those things and called me rude.

Even Lovely Marie pointed out the things you said to me. You called me antagonistic and said I was looking for a fight because I used those four emojis in my post. You went on and on about it.

I dont want my tone policed because of my opinion especially on this section. I refuse to let it slide because the point of this section is to provide a safe space for black women to talk about their lived experiences 2without being told they should be more polite or not so rude, or that they are antagonistic or looking for a fight. I will not accept black women being reduced to the "angry black women trope", not in this section. That is the point. That is why I will not just keep quiet and let it go. Just because someone is an ally or seems to understand some things does not mean they do not have blind spots or understand they can still say and do offensive things.

It is not acceptable and the precedent that it isn't must be set. Your post was deleted because it was tone policing. So thank you to @MNHQ

Noone has twisted your words. I have used them verbatim

Tone policing isn't against mumsnet rules - half the posts would have to be deleted if that was the case.

You haven't used any of my words verbatim. I don't know how you can claim that and I genuinely don't know how to discuss with someone who just misrepresents and twists and doesn't discuss.

I'm not sure what fight you're fighting here unless it's that you don't want white women to post on here at all in which case just come out and say it.

@TheHoneyBadger that's not true. You called Dastardly's use of emojis rude and said she was just antagonistic and looking for a fight.

Her deleted post did quote you.

You are still engaging in tone policing and twisting her words. As @JayDot500 said Dastardly has not been combative unlike you. You should either walk away from the discussion or apologise. You shared your opinion and some agreed with you and others didn't. But you and Venice went after one poster calling her rude and antagonistic and you are now trying to play the victim.

My post called you out because I found your behaviour disgusting and inappropriate to come and bully a black woman in what is supposed to be a safe space.

I welcome anyone to post here even those who I dont agree with. I am happy to discuss anything with anyone. I wont tolerate anyone policing my tone or anyone else's in this section.

You called me "rude", "antagonistic" and said I "was looking for a fight". That is why your post was deleted. Tone policing is one of the things that was highlighted as unacceptable in this section when it was created.

@TheHoneyBadger no one is saying you do not have a place in this conversation. Your contributions had been praised, I'm sure quite sincerely. But the moment someone interjected to challenge the general consensus and flow of sentiments being shared on the thread at that time, you kind of went in a direction that can be construed a bun fight. I don't know what happened during the deleted posts, but the poster I was responding to completely backed you and agreed Dastardly was being angry with her use of emojis. Dastardly was being totally misrepresented to me by that poster. That wasn't fair, and quite rightly she's challenging that.

Sigh... and then you painted yourself as the victim here. Do you know this here is the part where our feelings get dismissed? Because we've upset someone who can claim their vulnerability with more ease than us black folk, fewer and fewer people listen to us and instead start cradling the victim.

My hope is that when you post in this section you will not call posters "rude", "antagonistic" or say they are "looking for a fight " or allude to them being too stupid to understand what point you are making because they disagree with you.

I am asking if you cannot see how inflammatory those comments are and how they allude to "angry black woman trope"? I am informing you that it is offensive. I ask that you be mindful what you say in this section and not to do it again in this section because it equates to silencing the people who use this section as a safe space to share their experiences.

But I am not that other poster.

I found your behaviour disgusting and inappropriate to come and bully a black woman - and that is utterly ridiculous!

Do you totally not see that your posts were inflammatory Dastardly? Or that you keep saying I called you rude and inflammatory when I actually found a comment rude and inflammatory?

Also I had completely dropped all of this and then you came back and straight in with it again when conversation had moved on.

But I am not that other poster. But she jumped on board a point she thought you were driving at.

Imagine this was the normal MN space, where people who are black and/or share the opinion of @Dastardlythefriendlymutt are a minority. Many more would have hopped on board and followed the sentiment that Dastardly's tone was too angry to engage with, effectively silencing and dismissing her. That's tone policing. That's what's real, that's why this section exists.

You called me

• rude
• antagonistic
• looking for a fight

The other poster SUPPORTED YOU and went on to say I should be polite etc. What were they supporting if you didn't say those things initially?

How magnanimous of you to drop it when you were not the recipient of your insults. You are not the victim despite continually trying to paint yourself as such.

My post was deleted because it quoted you and the insults you made at me.

I will repeat. Those words when posting in this section are unacceptable because they silence the women who this section is meant to help. I kept pointing it out hoping you would come to that conclusion on your own - that has not worked. So I will inform you instead. Please do not police people's tone in this corner of MN. Go ham on the main board but not here. I won't let it go because I know how I felt when I read your comments and almost completely shied away from commenting all together. I wont have other posters who come to this corner of MN to share their experiences fearful to do so because they will come across someone like you.

I am also glad your earlier posts indicate how much good work you do and even that you are an ally by all accounts, because it highlights that noone is immune from blind spots and their own unconscious bias and that no matter how much work you have done, you are not immune from acting in a harmful manner, especially the way you keep insisting on acting like you are the victim which is another way 2white people try to silence black people.

You also called me angry

Shocked at what I'm reading on here. Of course white privilege is a fact, not opinion.
My 6 year old is aware of this, they're all over it at her school thank goodness.
Some people really are determined to pedal backwards into the dark ages.

That is SO not honest. I did not call you those things however lovely did personally attack me and do a one woman pile on.

I'm out - which is presumably the whole point of this. There's no conversation where lies are just repeated. I did not call you angry - I commented on a post that was a dig and eye rolling in response to me trying to articulate muddled thoughts. If I'm meant to accept that that isn't rude if it's coming from a black woman even though I'd think it rude coming from anyone and if that is the definition of an 'ally' then I guess I'm not one on here.

I'll continue to do what I can do in the world in which I can have effect but it won't include bowing and scraping in the face of rudeness and twisting of my words.

You did call me all those things that is why your post was deleted - it was textbook tone policing. That is not welcome in this section of MN.

Funny it's a pile on now, because posters are calling you out but it wasn't when you and Venice were piling on Dastardly in numerous posts calling her rude, angry and antagonistic.

I stand by my post because your posts were disgusting and not in the spirit of this board. One poster didn't fawn over you & expressed a different view & you saw fit to attack her.

You have now started to play the victim in an attempt to silence her again.

Your post was deleted for tone policing. So were Venice's. Dastardly's comment calling you out was deleted because it quoted your deleted post. With all that evidence you still insist you are the victim. Learn to listen. Don't alienate black women in their own space.

And would calling someone angry (if that is what happened) be deleted elsewhere on MN? If not, why not?

Obviously white privilege exists and we should discuss it in school. We should look absolutely look of the way out education is set out. White men are prevalent through education whilst women and people of colour should be in their too.

However I do not agree with my children being taught inherited guilt. It’s unhelpful and serves no purpose.

@Venicelover

Eye rolling emojis are dismissive and rude whoever posts them. Whichever thread they are on. They were an unnecessary addition to the post. Most posters on MN would have commented.

In your opinion.

This is a space specifically for black mumsnetters. If you don't like how we communicate on racial matters then take your fragility elsewhere.

@RedMarauder, and I suppose that comment is not rude either?

Pointing out a difference of opinion or perspective is not 'fragility' it is the cornerstone of debate.

You have no idea of my ethnicity, but you clearly only want people who agree with you to post on here and now they must also be black apparently. Presumably, that means non of the white posters are now welcome?

Where has redmarauder said no white posters are welcome?!
Said nothing of the sort from what I can see!

@Quaagars

Where has redmarauder said no white posters are welcome?! Said nothing of the sort from what I can see!

It is implied by the use of the word 'specifically'.

And the use of the word 'we' which 'others' anyone else.