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I didn’t realise Starmer was viewed so badly ,,

325 replies

aurpod1980 · 21/06/2026 00:01

He came into government at a challenging time - I didn’t realise his confidence score was so so The fatal flaw that brought Keir Starmer crashing down to earth

https://www.thetimes.com/article/8e98de80-1d48-4d1a-8408-ff4d48e1957c?shareToken=44bb913634621653058dd12f864e3eff

The fatal flaw that brought Keir Starmer crashing down to earth

How did a prime minister who won a landslide become the most unpopular in modern times?

https://www.thetimes.com/article/8e98de80-1d48-4d1a-8408-ff4d48e1957c?shareToken=44bb913634621653058dd12f864e3eff

OP posts:
Nel13f · 23/06/2026 06:32

Clavinova · 22/06/2026 22:48

But we know for a fact that it’s costing us £100bn per year due to lost revenue to the treasury (ONS data)
A permanent loss of 6-8% of GDP according to BoE analysis

Nonsense - neither of these estimates are facts in the slightest.

Most certainly not nonsense!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvg75npqkq4o

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/brexit-cost-uk-economy-bank-of-england-b2998943.html

https://www.nber.org/papers/w34459

MrsBennetsPoorNervesAreBack · 23/06/2026 06:46

Tableforjoan · 21/06/2026 16:38

I’ll get called a reform voter or a racist no doubt but I believe a citizen of the country should get a job before a non citizen if equally qualified.

We shouldn’t have doctors, nurses and midwives we have trained not being able to get employment because someone on a visa has that job. We clearly don’t need that job on the visa list if we have more people qualified than can be hired.

We used to have the Resident Labour Market Test, which required employers to demonstrate that they couldn't recruit from within the UK before they could sponsor people from abroad.

Boris Johnson abolished it in 2020 as part of his new immigration system post-Brexit.

Lovingapeacefulgarden · 23/06/2026 06:48

I think labour as a whole are useless. They lifted the 2 child cap which has cost millions the country doesnt have and has made it harder than ever for people to be better of working. I am a mum of 3. I have a disabled child and one with long term health issues. Both are unseen specialist care. My other child has no issues. Dh works full time. Until they lifted the cap we were better of me working. We no longer are. I am genuinely appalled at the situation. Despite everything we have going on I have always tried to work part time as I like working and earning. Now we are financially worse off I do. Removing pensioners heating money was a vile move and taxing businesses to the point of collapse. Add to that the number of migrants arriving that the tax payer is paying for is ridiculous. Labour are not a party that represents those who voted them in.

caringcarer · 23/06/2026 07:02

Lovingapeacefulgarden · 23/06/2026 06:48

I think labour as a whole are useless. They lifted the 2 child cap which has cost millions the country doesnt have and has made it harder than ever for people to be better of working. I am a mum of 3. I have a disabled child and one with long term health issues. Both are unseen specialist care. My other child has no issues. Dh works full time. Until they lifted the cap we were better of me working. We no longer are. I am genuinely appalled at the situation. Despite everything we have going on I have always tried to work part time as I like working and earning. Now we are financially worse off I do. Removing pensioners heating money was a vile move and taxing businesses to the point of collapse. Add to that the number of migrants arriving that the tax payer is paying for is ridiculous. Labour are not a party that represents those who voted them in.

I think a lot of people who are older remember exactly what Labour were like last time they were in. Younger people may not hyrealised. Now all can see just how useless Labour are. They went for pensioners, farmers, motorists, disabled and landlords with increase on SDLT of additional 2 percent. They made a lot of enemies.

Nel13f · 23/06/2026 07:27

Lovingapeacefulgarden · 23/06/2026 06:48

I think labour as a whole are useless. They lifted the 2 child cap which has cost millions the country doesnt have and has made it harder than ever for people to be better of working. I am a mum of 3. I have a disabled child and one with long term health issues. Both are unseen specialist care. My other child has no issues. Dh works full time. Until they lifted the cap we were better of me working. We no longer are. I am genuinely appalled at the situation. Despite everything we have going on I have always tried to work part time as I like working and earning. Now we are financially worse off I do. Removing pensioners heating money was a vile move and taxing businesses to the point of collapse. Add to that the number of migrants arriving that the tax payer is paying for is ridiculous. Labour are not a party that represents those who voted them in.

Removing a wasteful heating allowance from wealthy pensioners that don’t need it is hateful but reinstating the child allowance cap thus benefitting many families who will be a lot worse off than you financially is appalling. Okaaay🤔

BIossomtoes · 23/06/2026 07:28

Yes, some of us do remember what the 1997 to 2010 government was like. There were lots of reasons to remember it with pride.

Introducing the national minimum wage and establishing the low pay commission
• The human rights act
• More than doubling the number of apprenticeships
• Tripled spending on our NHS
• Four new medical schools
• 42,400 extra teachers and 21,2000 more support staff
• Scrapped Section 28
• Introduced civil partnerships
• Doubled overseas aid budget
• Sure Start
• Lifted 900,000 pensioners out of poverty
• Good Friday agreement
• Tax credits
• Equality and human rights commission
• Reduced number of people waiting over six months for an operation from 284,000 to almost zero by 2010, 44,000 doctors, 89,000 nurses
• Beating the Kyoto target on greenhouse gases
• Stopped Milosevic
• Winter fuel allowance
• Climate Change Act
• Decreased homelessness by 73%
• Free eye tests for over 60s
• 16,000 more police officers
• Extended the opening hours of over three quarters of GP practices
• Free prescriptions for cancer patients
• Removed the majority of hereditary peers
• Free part-time nursery place for every 3-4year old
• Paid annual leave to 28 days per year
• Maternity leave
• Doubled education funding
• Increased the value of child benefit by over 26%
• Food Standards Agency
• Equality Act
• Freedom of Information Act
• Increased university places
• Helped end the civil war in Sierra Leone
• Crossrail
• Rural development programme
• EMA
• Free bus passes for over 60s
• Devolution
• Banned cluster bombs
• Ban on grammar schools
• £20bn in improvements to social housing conditions
• Longest period of sustained low inflation since the 1960s
• Heart disease deaths down by 150,000
• Cancer deaths down by 50,000
• Removed the minimum donations limit from gift aid
• Reduced the number of people on waiting lists by over 500,000
• Waiting times fell to a maximum of 18 weeks (lowest ever levels)
• Oversaw the rise in the number of school leavers with five good GCSEs from 45% to 76%
• Young person’s job guarantee
• Pension credit
• Cut long-term youth unemployment by 75%
• Doubled the number of registered childcare spaces
• Disability Rights Commission
• Free school milk and fruit
• Raised legal age for buying cigarettes to 18
• Banned tobacco advertising in magazines, newspapers and billboards
• Free entry to galleries and museums
• 2009 Autism Act
• New deal for communities programme (£2bn)
• Electoral commission
• Halved the number of our nuclear weapons
• Free television licences for those aged 75+
• EU Social Chapter
• Free breast cancer screening
• Record low A&E waiting times
• Reintroduced matrons
• Hunting act
• Banned testing of cosmetics on animals
• Department for International Development
• Reduced class sizes
• 93,000 more 11-year-olds achieving in numeracy each year
• London 2012 Olympics
• 10 years of continual economic growth
• NHS Direct
• Healthier school meals
• Access to life saving drugs for HIV and AIDS
• Points-based immigration system
• Equalised age of consent
• Smoking ban
• Public interest test
• Crime down 45% since 1995
• Wrote-off up to 100% of debt owed by poorest countries.

Nel13f · 23/06/2026 07:31

caringcarer · 23/06/2026 07:02

I think a lot of people who are older remember exactly what Labour were like last time they were in. Younger people may not hyrealised. Now all can see just how useless Labour are. They went for pensioners, farmers, motorists, disabled and landlords with increase on SDLT of additional 2 percent. They made a lot of enemies.

Wealthy pensioners and farmers which many agree with and as for increasing SDLT on second home owners and landlords that shut out young people from buying it was spot on. What exactly have they done to the disabled?

Soontobesleeping · 23/06/2026 17:51

BIossomtoes · 23/06/2026 07:28

Yes, some of us do remember what the 1997 to 2010 government was like. There were lots of reasons to remember it with pride.

Introducing the national minimum wage and establishing the low pay commission
• The human rights act
• More than doubling the number of apprenticeships
• Tripled spending on our NHS
• Four new medical schools
• 42,400 extra teachers and 21,2000 more support staff
• Scrapped Section 28
• Introduced civil partnerships
• Doubled overseas aid budget
• Sure Start
• Lifted 900,000 pensioners out of poverty
• Good Friday agreement
• Tax credits
• Equality and human rights commission
• Reduced number of people waiting over six months for an operation from 284,000 to almost zero by 2010, 44,000 doctors, 89,000 nurses
• Beating the Kyoto target on greenhouse gases
• Stopped Milosevic
• Winter fuel allowance
• Climate Change Act
• Decreased homelessness by 73%
• Free eye tests for over 60s
• 16,000 more police officers
• Extended the opening hours of over three quarters of GP practices
• Free prescriptions for cancer patients
• Removed the majority of hereditary peers
• Free part-time nursery place for every 3-4year old
• Paid annual leave to 28 days per year
• Maternity leave
• Doubled education funding
• Increased the value of child benefit by over 26%
• Food Standards Agency
• Equality Act
• Freedom of Information Act
• Increased university places
• Helped end the civil war in Sierra Leone
• Crossrail
• Rural development programme
• EMA
• Free bus passes for over 60s
• Devolution
• Banned cluster bombs
• Ban on grammar schools
• £20bn in improvements to social housing conditions
• Longest period of sustained low inflation since the 1960s
• Heart disease deaths down by 150,000
• Cancer deaths down by 50,000
• Removed the minimum donations limit from gift aid
• Reduced the number of people on waiting lists by over 500,000
• Waiting times fell to a maximum of 18 weeks (lowest ever levels)
• Oversaw the rise in the number of school leavers with five good GCSEs from 45% to 76%
• Young person’s job guarantee
• Pension credit
• Cut long-term youth unemployment by 75%
• Doubled the number of registered childcare spaces
• Disability Rights Commission
• Free school milk and fruit
• Raised legal age for buying cigarettes to 18
• Banned tobacco advertising in magazines, newspapers and billboards
• Free entry to galleries and museums
• 2009 Autism Act
• New deal for communities programme (£2bn)
• Electoral commission
• Halved the number of our nuclear weapons
• Free television licences for those aged 75+
• EU Social Chapter
• Free breast cancer screening
• Record low A&E waiting times
• Reintroduced matrons
• Hunting act
• Banned testing of cosmetics on animals
• Department for International Development
• Reduced class sizes
• 93,000 more 11-year-olds achieving in numeracy each year
• London 2012 Olympics
• 10 years of continual economic growth
• NHS Direct
• Healthier school meals
• Access to life saving drugs for HIV and AIDS
• Points-based immigration system
• Equalised age of consent
• Smoking ban
• Public interest test
• Crime down 45% since 1995
• Wrote-off up to 100% of debt owed by poorest countries.

They inherited a sustained period of growth during which they sold off all the UK gold reserve when gold was at its lowest value, and put the NHS into debt with PFI that the NHS is still using a considerable share of its budget to pay back even now. And then of course we plunged into the deepest recession since the war…

Clavinova · 23/06/2026 17:53

Nonsense that you claimed those estimates are 'facts'.

All three of your links quote the NBER study which uses arbitrary modelling to estimate UK GDP if we had not left the EU. Clearly it's impossible to state those estimates as 'facts', so yes, you posted nonsense claiming that they are.

Critiques/peer reviews of the NBER study here - one from a pro-Brexit economist, the other from economists working for Bloomberg - Bloomberg donated £250,000 to the Remain campaign in 2016:

What the NBER gets wrong on the ‘Economic Impact of Brexit’

https://julianhjessop.substack.com/p/what-the-nber-gets-wrong-on-the-economic

Bloomberg (pro-Remain);
'... the estimate is misleading because the NBER doppelganger includes Ireland, where growth has averaged 7% a year since the 2016 referendum thanks to its low-tax strategy, and is heavily weighted to the US, which unlike the UK “wasn’t hit by an energy shock in 2022, has benefited from significant fiscal stimulus and is seeing the benefits of AI investment.”
Stripping out Ireland reduces the hit to about 6% and adjusting the US growth trajectory to reflect pre-2016 levels of outperformance lowers the impact further to 3.4%. Alternatively, using the World Trade Organization’s Global Trade Model, capturing the impact of higher trade barriers, points to a 2.5% long-term hit, Bloomberg Economics said.'

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2026-06-09/how-the-uk-s-options-for-rebuilding-ties-with-europe-stack-up

BIossomtoes · 23/06/2026 17:57

Soontobesleeping · 23/06/2026 17:51

They inherited a sustained period of growth during which they sold off all the UK gold reserve when gold was at its lowest value, and put the NHS into debt with PFI that the NHS is still using a considerable share of its budget to pay back even now. And then of course we plunged into the deepest recession since the war…

Remind me of the cause of that recession …

Clavinova · 23/06/2026 18:02

Myli1 · 23/06/2026 06:23

Certainly the European Commission themselves said it was a myth, so straight from the horse’s mouth I guess. This is an old article, but nevertheless has some other amusing myths: news.sky.com/story/the-top-10-european-union-myths-debunked-10404440

In fact your link is inconclusive on the banana question;

'according to the European Commission, not really true' -

'not really' is a fudge.

And I remember quoting from the Euro Myths page on the European Commission's website - their answer was 'Yes and no' - another fudge.

Myli1 · 23/06/2026 18:20

Clavinova · 23/06/2026 18:02

In fact your link is inconclusive on the banana question;

'according to the European Commission, not really true' -

'not really' is a fudge.

And I remember quoting from the Euro Myths page on the European Commission's website - their answer was 'Yes and no' - another fudge.

Well let’s put it in as simple language as possible for the avoidance of any doubt. The European Commission clearly stated that they have never mandated that bananas sold within the bloc must fit any particular shape - straight, bendy or otherwise.

Lovingapeacefulgarden · 23/06/2026 18:27

Nel13f · 23/06/2026 07:27

Removing a wasteful heating allowance from wealthy pensioners that don’t need it is hateful but reinstating the child allowance cap thus benefitting many families who will be a lot worse off than you financially is appalling. Okaaay🤔

They removed it from those that did need it many of whom had worked there whome lifes. I dont know many well off oensioners personally and yes i do think a government who has made people worse off working financially by lifting a child cap benefit are useless. People need an incentive to work they have removed that. How is thar sustainable as a country? Give working people free childcare, free holiday clubs, free qrap around care with the money instead.

Clavinova · 23/06/2026 18:35

unistress · 23/06/2026 05:50

Yes, I did - did you? I ask because it doesn't mention bananas and seems to focus on produce grown in this country and growers' frustration that some of it didn't meet the rules. I don't know if you're aware, but we don't grow bananas in this country. Since Brexit, I have found fruit and veg sections of supermarkets in this country to often be depressing, with lots of empty spaces. In Europe when I visit they are remain vibrant and plentiful, so I don't feel the rules in the 17 year old article you took the time to link have had much of a detrimental impact on the ability of European supermarkets to stock plenty of fresh produce.

My Guardian link was indicative of EU overregulation - I posted that the article referred to 'similar complaints'. Bananas had their own similar overregulation.

I don't know if you're aware, but we don't grow bananas in this country

The Guardian article referred to regulations on 26 fruit and vegetables that EU growers and sellers were hoping to relax. I've looked them up - we don't grow some of these products in abundance either;

apricots, artichokes, asparagus, aubergines, avocadoes, beans, Brussels sprouts, carrots, cauliflowers, cherries, courgettes, cucumbers, cultivated mushrooms, garlic, hazelnuts in shell, headed cabbage, leeks, melons, onions, peas, plums, ribbed celery, spinach, walnuts in shell, water melons, and witloof/chicory

I don't feel the rules in the 17 year old article you took the time to link have had much of a detrimental impact on the ability of European supermarkets to stock plenty of fresh produce.

Nevertheless, the article reported that (at the time) an estimated 20 per cent of British farmers' produce went to waste because of EU regulations. Not forgetting of course that the referendum was 10 years ago, therefore articles in the years prior to the referendum are relevant.

Since Brexit, I have found fruit and veg sections of supermarkets in this country to often be depressing

If we rejoin the EU is there going to be some sort of guarantee that our supermarkets will look vibrant and plentiful? When will Labour's EU-reset kick in? I shall be disappointed if I don't notice a significant change.

As an aside, there have been plenty of protests from farmers across the EU more recently:

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2024/feb/10/theyre-drowning-us-in-regulations-how-europes-furious-farmers-took-on-brussels-and-won

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2026/jan/10/thousands-of-irish-farmers-protest-against-eu-mercosur-trade-deal

Clavinova · 23/06/2026 19:01

Myli1 · 23/06/2026 18:20

Well let’s put it in as simple language as possible for the avoidance of any doubt. The European Commission clearly stated that they have never mandated that bananas sold within the bloc must fit any particular shape - straight, bendy or otherwise.

In fact your link says;

Several newspapers reported in September 1994 that the EU was to ban curved bananas. The EC says the rules only apply to green, unripe bananas...

Apparently you have never seen a green banana.

Peachykeenjosephine · 23/06/2026 19:09

I had a lot of respect for him when he stood up to Trump and kept us out of the war.

Myli1 · 23/06/2026 20:25

Clavinova · 23/06/2026 19:01

In fact your link says;

Several newspapers reported in September 1994 that the EU was to ban curved bananas. The EC says the rules only apply to green, unripe bananas...

Apparently you have never seen a green banana.

Hooray! We can all now go out and buy green unripe bananas to our heart’s content! I mean ok it’s cost us £2,000,000,000 per WEEK to do so but hey let’s not worry about those kind of minor trivialities…

Clavinova · 23/06/2026 20:50

Myli1 · 23/06/2026 20:25

Hooray! We can all now go out and buy green unripe bananas to our heart’s content! I mean ok it’s cost us £2,000,000,000 per WEEK to do so but hey let’s not worry about those kind of minor trivialities…

Are you promising mahoosive tax cuts if we rejoin then? Otherwise I can't see the point in rejoining. All that bother.

Soontobesleeping · 24/06/2026 00:41

Peachykeenjosephine · 23/06/2026 19:09

I had a lot of respect for him when he stood up to Trump and kept us out of the war.

He has sent billions to the war in Ukraine

Bleachedjeans · 24/06/2026 06:18

Almost as soon as he became PM he 1) ditched winter fuel allowance 2) accepted loads of freebies - he was an idiot from the outset.

Soontobesleeping · 24/06/2026 10:45

Bleachedjeans · 24/06/2026 06:18

Almost as soon as he became PM he 1) ditched winter fuel allowance 2) accepted loads of freebies - he was an idiot from the outset.

A lot of the front bench have had hugely questionable increases in personal wealth since entering government.

gamerchick · 24/06/2026 11:08

Soontobesleeping · 24/06/2026 00:41

He has sent billions to the war in Ukraine

And?

Does the mean we should join every war going?

Theolittle · 24/06/2026 11:10

Soontobesleeping · 24/06/2026 10:45

A lot of the front bench have had hugely questionable increases in personal wealth since entering government.

Your source?

Badbadbunny · 24/06/2026 11:37

Myli1 · 23/06/2026 06:31

Utter nonsense

They admitted the doctored footage of Trump, so that's not utter nonsense!

Wipeywipey · 24/06/2026 13:41

gamerchick · 24/06/2026 11:08

And?

Does the mean we should join every war going?

I also grew respect for him standing up to Trump and Israel and refusing to join - he learnt that Blair never recovered from following America. Sadly that is when the knives out internal Burham rise seemed to begin...

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