Young nanny should be energetic, no?

[OnePoisedLilacEagle]

We recently hired a part time nanny for our DD who is four. She's a young woman, early 20s, good references, experienced, pleasant enough. She looks after DD three days a week. I usually work from the office those days but have occasionally worked from home so I have some insight into what's happening.

Issue is she has the energy of someone running on 2% battery at all times. She's extremely lethargic. Park time consists mostly of her sitting while DD runs around like an overly caffeinated squirrel. Activities are very much the "observe from a distance" kind. Even crafting is mostly her handing supplies and letting DD get on with it while she scrolls on her phone. When I suggested maybe playing a game outside, she smiled and said she prefers to "supervise calmly" rather than get involved unless needed.

Nothing is unsafe. But it is very passive. What also worries me is the lifestyle mismatch. She's a very unhealthy eater. Her lunches are usually instant noodles, energy drinks, or crisps sometimes all in the same sitting. DD has now started asking if she can have "nanny lunch" and I'm dying inside a bit. I've never commented on what she eats, but it does seem to reflect her general low energy approach to everything.

DD is absolutely climbing the walls by the time we get home, like she's been storing up chaos all day. It feels like I'm paying for someone who seems to think engagement is an optional extra.
I expected someone young doing childcare, even part time, to be a bit more energetic and involved. I don't want a nanny doing a bootcamp workout in the playground, but a pulse above "mild hibernation mode" would be nice.

AIBU to think her age and being hired specifically for childcare should equal at least some actual interaction and enthusiasm? Is it time to have words with her about expectations? I am comfortable having the conversation but also don't want to be unrealistic about what is expected of a nanny, as I've never had one before.

Ugh, that's what I suspected. We did speak to someone who had a wonderful experience with them which encouraged me.

Now I’ve had a chance to think about it you’re bang on the re Little Ones- they were good about ten years ago- but as a nanny now I’ll not go near them. I did have an initial chat with them when I was last looking, but they didn’t seem to want to listen to any of the preferences I had about what kind of job I wanted and actually sent me to an interview where the position had already been filled- the new nanny answered the door 🤦🏻‍♀️ the parents were mortified and said they had communicated this very clearly to the agency- they hadn’t passed the message on or taken the position off the books.

Are you London based, as if you’d like I can recommend some decent agencies.

She sounds like my BIL who has ADHD and learned all these same lazy habits as you describe from my MIL. Always takes the easy route.

shes the wrong match for your DD needs and she won’t change. Get a new nanny!

I think the phone thing is bad. I don't really think the rest is her doing anything wrong. That being said, I can see why you feel she isn't a good fit for your child, and I think you would be fine to want to move on from her on that basis. Can I ask why you chose a nanny rather than a childminder? Not that I think your choice is wrong in any way, but it sounds like your child might enjoy doing more group activities with other children, and maybe having the structure that having a group of children normally brings.

I can ignore my own children perfectly well, I pay a nanny to be engaged.

I'm mostly joking but the trouble is I think a lot of people see childcare as an easy option.

In my opinion, it is one of the most exhausting / tedious jobs going and only very special people do it really well!

I've hired 4 nannies... I've put up with a lot of unreliability but I'd absolutely not tolerate phone scrolling. Didn't even do it myself with my first two (sorry third child) so no way would I pay someone to let my children think it's okay to be ignored.

Outside won't get her off the phone. It should be phone free whilst in charge.

I wouldn't accept a nanny being on her phone around children in her care, that's not good enough imo.

I don't think there's anything wrong with letting your child work at crafts by herself if the nanny hands her the supplies. Kids get enough direction and expectation of a specific end product in school.

I also think it's fine to let the child run around in the park while the nanny sits. Your child hasn't run off. Running around and amusing herself is fine.

Children don't need as much non-stop entertaining or hands on interaction with a caregiver as you think they do, and in any case they get a lot of that in school all day. Balance is important.

The phone scrolling would bother me, but younger people live on their phones.

If your child likes the nanny, I'd give her a chance. But I think your expectations are a bit unteasonable.

While I wouldn't expect anyone to run around like coco the clown all day , there is absolutely no way any adult in charge of my child would be scrolling needlessly while the little one gets little engagement. In fact even if it was a family member I'd still make other arrangements. I'd try again as this seems like an awful fit. Especially if you come home to a pent up child craving attention (more so than they usually would on seeing a parent)

Non-stop not paying attention to the child is definitely not on. Expecting to be paid for doom scrolling or even texting is quite ridiculous. Young people lay be on their phones a lot but not whilst working.

When she said "I prefer to supervise calmly" how did you respond?

I would have gone with something like "I would prefer you to engage with my child in activities that support their development and they enjoy rather than sitting back and -ignoring- watching them".

She doesn't sound great, the diet thing alone would bother me less but she should be modelling healthy habits to your child. If she was with a childminder or nursery she would be expected to be providing more active opportunities than this nanny is. She probably deserves the opportunity to show you she can improve, so you will have to give her some feedback. If she doesn't then I would be looking for another nanny.

She has already been removed and will not longer be working with us. Maybe her agency can find her a new placement.

I'm sure she will be a good fit for someone but I think her baseline just isn't good enough so I doubt she'd ever get to the place where we could be comfortable. DD attends nursery a few times a week so I'm hoping the next nanny can continue that level while in the home.

My exact thinking. This was her job. If I was paid to be a lunch lady at a school, it probably wouldn't the most stimulating job in the world. However, I would fulfill my duties as expected. They probably wouldn't want me scrolling on my phone while the food cooked, so I wouldn't. It's just basic expectations for work - something I think is lacking in some people, and she was one of them.

DD goes to nursery a few days a week and my mum cares for her afterwards on those days. So she's getting the group interaction and is benefitting from it immensely. I also organize playdates with the nanny so it's not like they are alone all day. The main reason I hired a nanny was for the flexibility (my work hours can be a bit unpredictable) and because I wanted DD to get to take full advantage of all the things London has for children before she starts school and it becomes harder to spend a day at a musuem or park. So I'm hoping she's getting the best of both worlds!

She is young. Has she had any sort of training as a nanny or nursery worker? She needs a structured day and the tools to make that happen. It is quite usual for a parent and nanny to sit down together and work out a structured day plan that both agree to but is in essence what the parent more or less expects to happen. Depends on start/finish times and what, if any, household/ cooking tasks are expected. It doesn't need to be a tight plan but it looks like some guidance and structure is necessary. For example Breakfast given and cleared away. 9.30 to 11.0O walk and play in park. 11.15 to 11.45 book reading together. Light lunch prepared and eaten together
(Parent to provide appropriate food) Food cleared.
Afternoon
1.00 until 2.30. craft time. Could be finger painting. Making bead necklaces/ cooking ext. (Parent needs to ensure all necessary equipment is available.) Nanny and child tidy up activity together. 2.45 to 3.15 (roughly) Child looks at book/plays with Lego/ maybe screen time while nanny gets done any child related tasks you have agreed on. Some nannies tidy child's room/change/bedding/do child only laundry depending on what has been agreed on. Obviously there would only be time for one of these tasks each day.
When finished short playtime in garden with a ball or on play apparatus if available.
Obviously nanny rest time has to be incorporated into the day so if the child is too old for a nap a definite quiet time for child is necessary at some point in the day. I would go for something out of the house every morning and something different craft/cooking/painted related in the afternoons as a basic starting point. If it's cold the outside actively can be a play centre. It's possible that the nanny also takes the child to some other paid for activity like dance/aerobics/music if available .
The point is some sort of agreed structure is necessary with ways and means provided. How does the nanny get to outside activities? Does she have a car with expenses paid/bus and bus fare/walk/dropped off one way and his back. If she's a bit back Ng; n motivation you need to make sure you have the afternoon activities laid out ready/paints/recipe ingredients ect
A well qualified nanny should know all this but with a bit of direction and encouragement hopefully you (and she) can turn this around. 😀

Ah. I see that you and the nanny have parted company. If you have another nanny I hope you have a better experience

Thank you. I do plan on being a lot more proactive with the next one about expectations for behaviour. We already did a lot of day planning stuff but I need to be more clear about expectations during those activities (eg, play with DD when you go to the playground, don't just watch from the sides unless she's playing with the other children). Which all feels a bit OCD but as I've been reading on this thread and others, it sometimes needed!

Thank you for your advice, it's very helpful.

I think what you want is someone who you don't need to explain these basic things to. If anyone is needing this explained they're not suitable for sole charge childcare.

Instead, look for mentions of using their initiative/being engaged in their references. Then ask at the interview how they would plan the day/what do they like to do with children/what activities don't they like etc. Ask about phone usage. Don't believe anyone who says they never look at it. Be wary if anyone who doesn't understand why it would be a problem. You need the middle ground: realistic!

That was my thinking! If I was hiring a chef, I would not expect to have to sit down and tell them about how I expect them to keep their knives sharp. That's just an inherent ability and knowledge that someone in that field should know. Ditto for childcare - I should not have to say to them, "when you go the playground, I expect you to play with my child. Do not sit on the bench on the side and scroll on your phone."

But some of the replies made it seem like a full job spec was needed outlining expectations for behaviours. So I'm trying to find a middle ground!