Friend grabbed my child

[friends345]

I’ve been friends with let’s say ‘Louise’ for as long as I can remember.
I have a DC aged 3 and hers is 4.
we were out today and my DC had a toy Louise’s DC wanted.
Louise's DC was crying saying she wanted the toy. Mine wouldn’t give it.
I said to my DC ‘share the toy and take turns’ or something like that.

as my DC was walking passed Louise, she grabbed DC by the arm and pulled her back saying “no, you’re not having that toy’ and snatched it off her.
DC obviously got upset. I was shocked. I took DC to one side and comforted her.

I then went back to Louise. The kids went to play and Louise was saying “your DC needs to learn to share. If she’s upset my kid then I’m going to do something”.

so I replied that my DC is 3. A whole year younger than hers and she’s learning to share but she still shouldn’t have grabbed her. I let her know that wasn’t ok.

louise then backtracked and said she felt awful and that she only did that because that’s what she’d do with her own kids etc. she said she wanted to apologise to DC and she did apologise.

it was a bit awkward after that. She said to me “as soon as I did it, I couldn’t believe I’d done it and when you walked away with your DC I thought you might not want to see me again or be friends”.

i feel conflicted. My DC absolutely loves Louise’s DC and would be truly devastated if they couldn’t play together anymore. What would you do??

I think four is old for crying and wanting a toy someone else has. This would 100% be my two year old but not four.

Your extra posts give important info. If you value your friendship, I’d suggest having a proper talk with your mate and saying what you’ve said here. Maybe leading with ‘my kid loves your kid but I think we have different approaches to parenting’. And then saying what you’ve said - you can’t expect your child to be subservient to hers, even if your child was physically attacking hers laying hands on another person’s 3 year old is not on, etc. Maybe a learning opp for her. Sometimes people do need to be told how they come off to others.

Depending on how she reacts you maybe step back from friendship or let her try more.

For talking to your daughter I think worth stating that yes, your friend hurt her, it was wrong, we aren’t allowed to grab, you have told your friend off, it won’t happen again. So she knows it was wrong and you will protect her and she’s safe x

@friends345

Not as extreme, but I have a Mum who was so hell bent on putting her child’s needs first that my son (who struggles to self-advocate) was frequently trampled on by her more dominant child. The Mum was facilitating this. However, the children do get a lot out of their friendship. Gradually my son is becoming more assertive and I think we’ve both learnt over time to even it out. I intervene now if my son isn’t getting a fair turn or choice.

If my son had ever been grabbed or hurt by the Mum, I think I’d want to end the friendship. Did the Mum apologise to your child too?

I’d focus on facilitating other relationships for your DC.

Op if you had lost your temper with Louise you would feel awful re: modelling behaviour , you handled the situation exceptionally well.

However, I don’t think I could trust her again with my dd.

From your update this isn’t a moment of madnes but a pattern of behaviour.

I would remind your little one that adults should never harm children, and that Louise was wrong to do so. Remind her you will never allow anyone to harm her.

I would stop seeing them altogether. Your child is being compromised every time you meet up, by learning to give way to the other child’s demands all of the time.

I then went back to Louise. The kids went to play and Louise was saying “your DC needs to learn to share. If she’s upset my kid then I’m going to do something”.

Would she have apologized if you didn’t bring it up? It sounds like she was ready to lecture you about your parenting and only became sorry when you confronted her.

So similar arritude has happened before, but today she over stepped and grabbed your child.
When you return after comforting your child, she does NOT apolohise but tells you she will do something if your child upsets hers.
You call her out on this and THEN she back tracks and apologises??
Is it the first time you've stood up to her behaviour and called her out?
Would she have apologised at all if you hadn't?

Had she apologised immediately when you returned with your child I may think differently but in THIS situation I'd REALLY be rethinking this friendship.

And BTW sharing a toy does not mean immediately giving it up because someone else wants it!

I think you would be best messaging Louise and setting out expectations moving forward.

Hi Louise, I’ve been thinking about today’s events. I agree that children need to learn and take turns, and that is something I obviously will continue to reinforce with DC. However, I do not agree that my DC upset your DC, and I am not comfortable in teaching DC that it is acceptable for someone to forcibly take something from her, either adult or child.

These instances seem to occur because your DC wants something my DC has and gets upset when she can’t have it. I understand that’s a normal phase and is difficult but ishe has nothing at all that I do with my DC and I won’t be encouraging her going forward to give things up to keep others happy.

I hope you understand how I feel when that we can work on this together moving forward x

She apologised. If you really like her, give her another go, BUT I wouldn't leave your child in her care, alone. AND no, your kid does not always have to share, kids are allowed to just sit and play with the toy they are enjoying.

I wouldn’t trust that friend to babysit my child or have my child over for a play date without me there …

She’s taking the “mama bear” thing abit far isn’t she? If she’s not careful she’ll create a monster. The “my child first at any cost” attitude sounds like it manifests itself over and over.

I think I would calmly say or text “louse other peoples children and their needs matter too and your dc needs to be taught that or life will be difficult for them growing up”.

Before I read the update I would have said , she made a mistake and apologised but this is a pattern that needs breaking

Stop forcing children to share people!
let then have their things, encourage them to play together. but the whole ‘you must share’ triggers this sort of snatching (usually by other children admittedly)

Honestly, regardless of whether or not you want to carry on this friendship, for me it would be tainted now anyway, and would never feel the same. Add to that that I would never feel comfortable leaving my DC out of sight with Louise or her DC, and that would naturally be the end of the friendship for me. I wouldn’t want to spend time I couldn’t trust around my DC without needing to watch their every move.

Also, the fact that she said she did what she did, because that’s what she would have done to her own DC rings alarm bells in that she’s overly aggressive anyway. I would be done with this friendship, even on a one to one basis as adults.

The sharing message is fair enough on a communal bit of equipment or something. It’s right to share that and be mindful of others having a turn not to hog for oneself.

However it’d taken too far when DC are bullied into handing over smaller valued items they are playing with to others just because the other kids wants it. That’s not how the adult would works so don’t think it’s a helpful message.

I think now you've addressed it you'll find it much easier to stop her in future from nicking your dd's stuff to placate her dd's. I'd give her a chance but watch like a hawk and be ready to step in if she starts this again. And absolutely zero tolerance on hurting your dd obviously

Your three year old won’t be devastated if they can’t play with a four year old. Those age groups generally play alongside not with each other. Your three year old would probably be more devastated she keeps getting grabbed by an adult.

You would be crazy to continue this friendship. She will just be cruel to your dd when your back is turned.

Please prioritise your dc’s well being and confidence and end this friendship. Your dc will find nicer friends.

This. Her initial response was her honest one ‘your kid’ was of no consequence to her, she couldn’t care for them less. You can’t trust her to be near your child when you are there supervising, you certainly can’t trust her for a moment to nip to get a bottle or water or pop to the loo.

Does Louise have many other mum friends? Do you if you ditch her over this?

I think your update shows a pattern of how, until this occasion where she became aggressive, you have let it go if she has said your child needs to share - have you usually given your child's biscuit over to suit her? I think she only apologised as you stood up for your child and it doesn't sound very sincere.
Her child sounds like hard work, maybe due to Louise not telling them no. Why should your child hand over a biscuit when her child has finished? Louise should be saying no to her child and reminding them they had one.

Whose toy was it in this situation? Again if it was your child's, then it is nice to encourage sharing, but ultimately the child should have been told that's Beth's toy, and given something of their own. Or if it is something from a play centre you should both set a time limit and both children aware of this.

I’d be in jail after she put her hands on my kid. It sounds like you’re more sensible though.

If you still want to be friends with her then you need to make really clear boundaries.

Id drop her though.

If she feels comfortable snatching a child and using physical violence and bullying in public, what’s she doing to her kid behind closed doors. She sounds like an oppressive bully that doesn’t mind using violence and intimidation against defenceless children. A true coward.

She forgot herself and put her hands on your kid. And I think she would do it again.

Which child owned the toy, ie did your daughter take the other child’s toy; or did that child want your daughter’s toy?

I’d be in jail after she put her hands on my kid. It sounds like you’re more sensible though
Are you okay? Children are much more resilient than their parents. A 3 years old will survive the mental scars of having a toy snapped from their hands, especially after they were told sorry.

People on MNs are a real interesting bunch. I do wonder how they manage to survive the ferocious jungle of real life!

“If they have biscuits and Louise’s child finishes hers first and wants my DC’s, she’ll cry and Louise will just say “can my DC have yours biscuits because she’s upset”

OP, my DSis use to go in for this sort of nonsense, until one day, I said to her, “You do know that you’re teaching your DC to kick up a fuss whenever he wants anything, because they know you’ll give in?” My sister denied it, but I pointed out to her that she’d told her DC that they could have one biscuit, and then when he’d kicked up a fuss (at my house) had said, “ Oh bless them, Auntie will let you have another biscuit, won’t you?” I said, DSis, you told him he could only have one, and you are teaching him to put on his parts to get what he wants. If you want to change things, then you have to do it on your terms - you say, well if you can behave until the big hand reaches the top (five minutes) then you can have another biscuit.” I’m afraid that your friend “Louise” is just teaching her child to be a brat.

I wouldn’t continue to meet up with the children there. Taking a biscuit from a 3 year old to give to another child who already finished theirs and is having a tantrum over it is crazy behaviour. That, combined with her comment in your OP about “if she upsets my child I’m going to do something about it” shows that she’s willing to upset your child to pander to her own spoilt one. Your child hadn’t done anything to “upset” her child beyond simply holding a toy.

For those saying 'she apologised so move on' I would be interested to know if you would have that same approach if a 'friend' who was annoyed with you grabbed your arm, hurting you, and forcefully pressured you into doing something you didn't want to do.
I would be suprised if most would want to continue the friendship.

The apology sounded like an after thought and a pity plea to me.And doesn't change the fact she still did it.Sorry isn't always enough.

Don't subject your child to having to feel fearful/uncomfortable around this woman again OP....because she will.