I didn’t leave the left. The left, left me.

[GenerativeAIBot]

Stop me if you have already heard this the last few days, I am trying to make sense of how I feel about Trump and other right leaning wins:

“Woke” issues being pushed to where they have been, has empowered the right by giving them something real and legitimate to campaign against. Something more than their usual transparently false bogeymen.

In general, Authoritarianism, compelled speech, no debate. Specifically men in women’s sports, in women’s changing rooms, unfettered immigration, being asked to ignore the evidence in front of our eyes.

This is happening across the world, Italy, France, Germany, USA, UK.

I remain entirely committed to progressive taxation, a social safety net, collective bargaining, workers rights, public schooling and health services as well as the rights of everyone to live contented, unmolested lives.

I reject identity politics in their entirety. For example, I consider terms like “Woman of colour” to be the epitome of divisive, racist, sexist thought patterns that seeks to infantilise people and move their locus of control from internal to external. Disempowering people and making them victims.

I didn’t leave the left. The left left me.

Reasonable?

Are you in favour of a flat income tax then? Or can you not see that many of society’s high earners rely heavily on low earners to maintain the infrastructure which allows them to earn stupidly inequitable multiples of the median wage?

Are you me? Staunch Labour voter my entire life, until very recently. Simply put, Labour represented the working person, working for a fairer, more equal society. I don't recognise this new ' woke' left more concerned with appeasing the mobs and identity politics- they no longer represent me. champagne socialists who sneer at the working classes whilst championing mass immigration and labelling people bigots for voicing their concerns. Worryingly, I've swung to the right and am starting to pay attention to kemi. I'd be entirely betraying my working class roots by voting Tory, and ultimately I loathe their rhetoric but if I believe in more of their policies than I do say Labour, I'm left with no choice. I'll hold my nose and do it. Ex Tories are not the only people voting reform, swathes of the neglected working class communities will swing that way too, ( as they did in the last g.e) and where does that leave us?

I think intersectionality is important but I do agree that the focus on identity politics is disproportionate.

I also agree that the left in many countries does not provide a decent alternative to the status quo. In fact it seems they want to continue it under a different guise.

The working class don't feel listened to and the left no longer represent their traditional voter base.

I think it’s less simple than saying OP has “moved to the Right on social values”, because the Left has also moved the goalposts on its social values. When you think about the kind of ordinary people who would have been natural Labour and Democrat voters thirty or forty years ago, those people's thoughts are on things like healthcare, maternity services, employment rights, accessible public transport, affordable housing, household economics, basic living costs. The politics of gender identity and ethical bdsm and compelled pronouns and centring trans people sounds alien to them. They don't want their elderly mother being told she's bigoted if she feels vulnerable and embarrassed to share a hospital bay with a male-bodied person, however much like a woman that person feels. They don't want their sister or daughter being forced to remove her hijab in front of men or boys in mixed sex changing rooms. They don’t think that trans women are especially stunning or brave, mainly because they often don’t think much about them at all. They are worried about food inflation and whether they can afford the after school club fees and whether there is going to be restructuring at work.

The Left’s current iteration of 'progressive' tends to be totally divorced from the lives of ordinary people. It's no longer about becoming awakened to broader social injustice or developing socialist opinion: the most important thing seems to have become shouting at other people about how wrong they are and so on. They are often very politically engaged, but on things like the importance of "bdsm ethical porn", eradicating "kink shaming", campaigning for gender neutral toilets, and so on. Lots of clicktivism and the extremes of Twitter politics. They aren't even that bothered about something as topical as climate change, when you consider their lifestyles more broadly (though lots are vegan activists); it's almost all around policing ideas about gender and queerness and intersectionality and so on.

Someone on here made a brilliant point when discussing Trump’s win.
People are more likely to vote for someone they despise than vote for someone who despises them. 👏

Please define the low earners to which you refer, in terms of role and income?

Ditto with the high earners.

So, I can then answer your question.

Thanks

I read a quote a few years ago that always stuck with me, it was roughly

The Left needs to realise that Socialism is a political view not an indication of moral superiority.

The Left these days seem to believe that they will always occupy the moral high ground and anyone who doesn't agree with them simply doesn't understand, they seem to comitted to saving fish from drowning
The Left has been responsible for more genocide in history than The Right and yet its deemed acceptable to be a Communist (like Mao or Pol Pot)
I loathe The Tories/Trump etc and would never vote for them but the Left loathes me so what do I do?

Not often, sometimes.

It's views like yours which push people to vote for the likes of Trump and Farage.

The issues with women's rights in the US and UK are poles apart.

The US has the Religious Right, we do not, thank God (excuse the pun).

Abortion is not a policitcal issue in the UK.

I dunno, I'm in NI and it still feels political.

But this time the noise to the left has become controlling and have been allowed to dictate to the silent majority.

I completely agree. I always thought of myself as a bit of a lefty but I look around at those who'd call themselves progressive and liberal, and just how fucking awful they are to anyone who disagrees with them, who dares be even fractionally right-of-centre (apparently there is an entire spectrum of left-wing views but on the right of centre there is only a yawning maw of fascism...), who dares go against the Correct View on whatever subject is at hand. There is no plurality of view or nuance, just good people and the unspeakably bad who deserve everything they get.

I also intensely dislike the left's determination to treat people as victims. There is never any sense of anyone having to take responsibility, own their choices and make a bit of an effort. Nope, it's should be permanent hand-outs and endless pandering.

I believe in a state that looks after its weaker members and gives them a decent, dignified standard of living with autonomy and respect. A good education and a good healthcare system should remain free to everyone. Those who slip through the cracks in life should be helped back up.

But the welfare state safety net should be a trampoline, not a hammock. State housing should be for those who need it but only for as long as you need it, not winning the "home for life for you and your descendants" bingo. If you behave in an anti-social way, you will be warned then removed from your housing. You can come back any time you agree to behave well.

Not got a job? Fine, here's all the help you need and we'll be realistic about what we expect from you. But you HAVE to get a job and if you don't, your benefits will be tapered off. Breaking the law? We will try to rehabilitate you but if you don't engage or change then it's a long spell in prison for you.

And so on because there has to be an element of personal responsibility. Likewise, there has to be an understanding that someone is not a monster because they have a different point of view. I am SO FUCKING TIRED of all the wokery and demonisation of anyone who dares not "be kind".

How are the left dictating anything in the UK? The Government are more centre than left.

Ah I see, it's another bonkers trans thread.

Goodbye.

Apologies, I forgot about NI. Yes, I can understand it being political there.

I've just googled and they are different from those in England.

It never comes up during elections in England.

Yabu. The left isn’t one homogenous group of ‘woke’ women-haters demanding everyone be given free rein to move wherever they want, any more than the right is one homogenous group of thick racists demanding cultural purity. And the only thing "happening before your eyes" is a real time example of how media influence manipulates public perception.

If you’re genuinely committed to all those other left-wing ideals, it’s mind-boggling that your response to facing a part of the left you don’t like is to hand power to people actively working to strip away everything you supposedly stand for.

An excellent quote. Also, Bernie Sanders said that the left abandoned the working classes so can hardly be surprised when the working class abandoned the left.

All too often the political left is staffed by self-appointed habitues of the moral high ground who are here to tell you why you're wrong not to have their views. Failure to accept you're wrong will mean you're a racist gammon bigot and quite beyond the pale.

Yes, I agree entirely. The vast majority of people I meet have very sensible middle ground views.

And yes, the left has left me. I refuse to get lumped in with anti- abortionists, but I am horrified that some people think it’s fine to produce and illustrate books aimed at young children with images of people in bondage and with scars from removal of healthy breasts.

I watched a video of Trump talking about/reading a script about pushing back on gender identity/gender affirmation in young people. I agreed with every word. I’m having trouble coming to terms with that.

Well now - 72 odd million Americans may just disagree with you.

But perhaps you are right, and they are wrong.

A terrific post, genuinely.

If only all Party Leaders would work out what most of us want instead of only taking note of activists. I include Trade Union leaders as activists.

Agree 100%. I once read that if you’re not left leaning when you’re young you’ve got no heart, and if you’re not right leaning when you’re old you’ve got no head. I never ever believed that shift would happen to me, but here we are.

I find myself in the absolute headfuck position of wanting to vote left wing/liberal, but being too angry to do so, and coincidentally finding myself more often agreeing with people on the right, who are otherwise raving lunatics representing despicable views.

Raising legitimate concerns about women’s right and protections in relation to identity politics sees me shut down or painted as slightly right of Nigel Farage by my own children, who have a tenuous grasp of the facts but absolute certainty that I’m on the wrong side of history.

WTAF is happening?! I honestly don’t feel my personal politics have changed, but the political ground has literally shifted beneath my feet.

Ear ear? 😁

I was thinking today about our pursuit of equality, mainly off the back of some threads I was perusing this morning.

Pet friendly cafes, no pet cafes, adult only transport, child free places and minority only playgroups (although that wasn't the intent of that thread, it was taken out of context)..so we want equality, everyone respected...by segregation. For some.. I think they have flown so far left they have looped back on themselves 😂

As a PP has stated, I don't believe it's the general consensus. I believe the media is a bugger and enjoys fanning the flames for a dollar. I am not the brightest spark, if I am baffled by the logic of a few opinions I guarantee everyone else is. There is also that issue of things being taken out of context. A haphazard comment or snippet of information snowballing.

I should clarify that I mean certain individual politicians, not that everyone who’s right of centre is a raving lunatic 😂