Not To Tell My Employer

[Charliesunnysky10]

I'm struggling financially, but my 9-5 weekday office job pays minimum wage and I'm getting further into debt. In the past 3 months I've had to replace the broken boiler, sort the roof, and pay for repairs on my car until it eventually became unviable and I had to sell it.

I want to work my way out of the debt and also get out in the evenings and weekends so I'm not home worrying, and a job with these hours seemed the perfect solution.

But I asked informally a year ago when a friend suggested I come to work with her in a local coffee shop as they were extending the hours into the evenings for a bar. I was told permission will not be granted because it may impact on my ability to do my day job.

Since then, my financial situation has worsened and I spend hours in the evening with no money to go out and wishing I could put these hours to good use. My friend's bar is now a huge success and she persuaded me to apply. I was interviewed for the job and have been offered it. The manager said they will try to give me weekend hours rather than weekdays when I'm at my day job, but there will inevitably be weekday late evenings here and there. I don't go to bed till after 11pm anyway, so it's not like this will make a big difference and I felt so happy to be getting out and meeting people again.

Today, the manager messaged me to supply reference details. I had planned not to tell my boss and if they ever found out I'd have proved I can do both roles, and I will accept the punishment.

I'm not deceitful by nature, but I'm angry that I'm not allowed to get out of debt and need to put this first. I don't want to leave this job as I've been here 10 years and my co-workers are so lovely. I like the job here too, but it just doesn't pay well.

The problem I have is the reference - can I ask my former manager who left just over a year ago? She can hardly comment favourably on my honesty when I'm being so duplicitous, not asking my current boss - she will wonder why I'm not asking them. And she may know I'm required to seek permission.

I'm in a mess and I don't know where to turn.

@Quveas The reason I mentioned writing to her MP was not because the MP would be able to directly intervene right now, but because legislative direction would be needed to prevent the ridiculous situation of an employer paying NMW not allowing an individual the autonomy to work their way into a better financial position, without being in breach of their contract. MPs represent us in parliament, which is the legislative branch of government and the only way this situation could in future be handled better in law. I thought it was fairly obvious I wasn't suggesting the MP could intervene, but it's a case study for him/her to look at and potentially escalate in the relevant committees, given the whole topic of encouraging more employment is a big part of this budget cycle.

@Whiteroomjoy Thank you. I'll be sure to pace myself. I don't want to come across as high maintenance to either employer so I'd not want to ask for fewer hours at the get-go. I could possibly look at this if there is push-back from my daytime employer though.

I honestly feel like taking control of my finances instead of feeling bored, broke and trapped in debt every evening will be less harmful to my health. I need to try it to know which is the lesser of the 2 evils.

@TaunterOfWomenInGeneralSaysSayonarastu Oh that did make me chuckle 😂

I have always worked in the public sector and its very common to have a clause in the contract of employment re second jobs. So it comes under the general heading of doing something that might cause issues with your full time job eg conflict of interest or bringing the employer into disrepute. I have worked with people who had another job and periodically they would be asked if they were still doing that job. So, one chap was in a band and that was OK. If he worked as a debt collector for example then it might be considered to be incompatible with his full time work as he had priveliged information. I think you do need to ask HR rather than your manager as they can guide you best.

@loislovesstewie I asked HR a few months back when I first considered secondary employment and they said I must obtain permission from my line manager.

I work in a white collar professional setting. Lots of of people have had bar jobs etc. a couple of evenings a week to top up their salaries for whatever reason - holiday, wedding, house deposit etc.

It was such a non-issue. If it was for a competitor or something unreputable fair enough but your employer is just being a dick if they said no to this very reasonable request, particularly with the CoL situation.

Good luck OP and good on you for having such a great work ethic. Your employer should take note.

@Cavies That's such a lovely thing to say. Also, I wish you were my boss.

Agreed re opting out for both employers and the reason for the rule being in place.

It came to light with the employee I was speaking of at my company when he ended up exhausted and taking extended leaves of sickness as a result.

If you are happy OP that you'll be able to cope with the extra hours, I would agree with a PP post about asking for permission from your current employer, but saying it's a weekend job and point out that there is no conflict of interest.

And put the request in writing, so you actually get a response in writing.

On what basis can you current employer stop you taking additional employment?!

if they don’t want you to, they need to pay you not to. That’s their only option !!

If it’s in her contract and they decide to enforce it

And it's a valid element of the contract.

This is why you should always check your contract. I worked somewhere and one April they randomly presented us with written contracts to be signed that day. There were a few clauses I wasn't happy with and one was seeking permission to work elsewhere. I said I want happy with that and as I had been there less than 2 years I was told take or leave it.
Well I took it....edited it and reprinted it then we both signed. It was filed away with the others. When I later left I was told as I hadn't given a month's notice I would not get paid, but i was paid weekly. It's in your contract they said....erm not mine it isn't!
I guess if you've signed a contract they could sack you....but I doubt they will. If they say you can't do the extra job ask them what they're proposing in lieu. I don't generally advocate lieing but in my eyes it's an unfair contract so my conscience would be clear.
No one makes an employee sign to say they won't get pissed or have a baby keep them up all night. I really don't think it's right.

I had a clause in a contract prohibiting me from taking on additional employment. I assumed it was because of confidentiality and a conflict of interest until a colleague confided that she worked in a restaurant in the evenings/weekends and that was also prohibited!

We were not surprised as she occasionally rang in sick and when she returned would mention that she had been asked to work in the restaurant during the day midweek. She was effectively getting paid twice for the same time. It became very apparent why employees were not allowed to take up a second employment.

Just take the additional job. First job can whistle. They can’t enforce that contract clause in all likelihood and any reputable company would be paying way over the minimum wage anyway. It’s none of their business what you do outside of work, unless you’re doing something that rivals what they do/pinching customers etc.

No it isn't. Their other option is to dismiss her. She agreed to a contract in which she undertakes not to take on any other employment without permission. Whether anyone here likes that clause or not it is legal (and not at all unusual). They absolutely CAN enforce the clause, despite what people here are telling the OP - by dismissing her. How does she survive on 16 hours a week and a dismissal on her record? Ten years is a long time in a job, and a gap that can't be covered up.

If it’s written into her contract of employment and they can show good reason for including it, they absolutely can enforce it, up to and including firing her. Even if she won a tribunal she would still be out of a job.

You’re overthinking it. It’s not in competition with your current job. Your work are entitled to know if you’re working elsewhere to make sure your health and wellbeing isn’t impacted by working too many hours and that your work with them isn’t affected by the second job but they don’t bloody own you and can’t otherwise control what you do, certainly not for a minimum wage office job

Don’t ask them. Tell them this clause is not reasonable in the circumstances and you are informing them you are taking up a second job.

What good reason would that be? They have to have bloody good reasons to sack someone with 10 years service. Not an arbitrary bog standard contract clause.

you’re right of course employers can basically do what they like and it lis down to the employee to seek redress but I guess what it comes down to is if she’s happy to remain in debt and be walked over for a minimum wage office job or pull up her big girl pants

It won’t, she’ll just be on a BR code and pay tax on every penny

What good reason would that be? They have to have bloody good reasons to sack someone with 10 years service.

Breach of contract. Works every time. If you expect employers to abide by contracts then you can't argue that employees shouldn't have to - they do!

No, she won’t as she says she earns not far off minimum wage so she won’t be earning anywhere near the £50k threshold

Yep, my clumsy wording as already been covered further in the thread and I have accepted that my understanding was wrong. 😀

Thank you so much for your advice and sharing your own thoughts and experience. I can't even begin to tell you how much I've learnt and benefitted from your help.