To think it’s stupid to have kids with the wrong person?

[Fannyproblemos]

I have a couple of friends and family members who actively chose to have children with men who they knew would not make good long term partners. Each of them would admit to knowing this at the time. It’s not like the men or their relationships have changed dramatically. Now they are either trapped in unhappy situations for the sake of the kids. Or they have tricky custody arrangements, which bring stress and unhappiness. Whilst I sympathise. I cannot understand at all why these attractive and wonderful women chose these men to procreate with. Knowing they were already unhappy, knowing they would in most cases not make great dads, knowing their relationships wouldn’t last. Surely it would’ve been more sensible all round to leave these rot bags and try and meet someone they do love. Even at risk of not being able to have kids? I just think it’s a really selfish move to pop out a kid because you want one, knowing you’re intentionally bringing them into an unhappy situation. We should teach younger women this is not the way to go, it’s save a lot of heartache and divorce fees all round. And these are not cases of ‘sometime it just doesn’t work out’ they all knew in there heart of hearts it was not going to work out. Madness!

@Whiskeypowers

Nothing of the sort . Truth hurts and my empathy will always be with the children who have a poor start in life and likely poor outcomes as adults .

Surely no-one has kids with 'the wrong person' on purpose- they expect the dad to change/sort himself out/step up the plate and then he doesn't do it. So many women think they have a good relationship until they have kids- once it is not all about him and his 'needs' or wants the bad ones show their true colours.
My mum said to me years ago (30 yrs ago?) have time just the two of you and make 100% sure he is the man you want for your kid's dad. If you are in a shit relationship a child will never improve things. It's hard.

So much smug judgement on this thread

How many children actually have “two loving parents” in a secure home”. Most couples I know have quite a lot of conflict and unhappiness. On the other hand I have a happy conflict free home with dds and am good friends with their dad. Single parent homes are not necessarily inferior or harmful.

No one actively chooses to give their children a “shit dad”

Yes - many do!
Even when they know the man is irresponsible and neglectful of the child, they have more children with them!
Why hang around a loser, never mind reproduce with them!

No one actively chooses to give their children a “shit dad”.

If you choose to procreate with someone who’s a shit boyfriend and person you’re almost definitely condemning that child to having a shit dad.

And plenty of women absolutely do choose to get pregnant by men who are already shit dads to existing kids, their own and those from previous relationships. It happens all the time.

They want more kids and think it’s easier to give them the same dad. They don’t think they’ll meet anyone else. They have low expectations and expect a man/a dad to be useless/selfish/disengaged.

It must be hard work being so perfect all the time and never making a bad decision. Ever heard of negative self esteem, lack of self worth, abuse, trauma?

No. Men who choose to have kids with useless women are just as bad.

What do you mean “truth hurts”?
who is that comment aimed at?

why are you assuming that children who have a shit dad have a poor start in life and poor outcomes as adults? That’s by no means always the case.

in any event that doesn’t deal with your awful footing the bill comment as if all these “feckless selfish women” - and I quote you - are popping out children with men they know are unsuitable apparently?

see there is nothing in your posts about the men in question ………

I know, bat shit!

How many children actually have “two loving parents” in a secure home”. Most couples I know have quite a lot of conflict and unhappiness

Many children have two loving parents and secure homes - it’s worth aiming for. Nobody is saying ‘single parents’ are inferior - but it’s not the greatest plan to set out to be one, and certainly not to set out to have children as a product of a dysfunctional ‘shit relationship’ as OP mentions.

So in one fell swoop, you discard all the women who have chosen to go it alone, for what ever reason

I have a friend who turned 40 and really wanted a baby. The man she found was already a feckless dad so is unsurpringly also crap with her DD. She's quite wealthy so she and DC have a great life but she always worries about her when she's with the ex. She would have had an easier time with a sperm donor but i can totally empathise why she did it and could have seen myself in a similar situation if i were 40 and desperate for a child.

What do you earn? Are you a net contributor to the country (you personally not your dh or d dad)? Women are not responsible for men who don’t contribute to their children. I work hard, contribute to society and raise my dds well. Do u?

That is really no excuse.

This site is full of women who are rightly lauded for leaving and removing themselves and their children from abusive relationships thereby giving all concerned a better chance of a happier, more stable and emotionally healthier life. They are making the right choices.

I absolutely detest the notion that there is a swathe of women deliberately getting knocked up by “the wrong men”. There are normally a whole range of dynamics - both demographic, societal and cultural - as to why those who fall into this category are impacted as thus. Furthermore it also abrogates the responsibility in every sense of the men most of whom have not had to face the same pervasive damaging artifices society inflicts on girls and women.

I genuinely just despair.
of men were actually expected to be as present and ultimately as responsible as women are for children when the chips are down then we wouldn’t need these corrosive debates

I disagree that it’s wrong to set out to be a single parent. Single parents can be just as good as two parent families- once you control for finances there is no difference in outcomes for kids. A happy stable home can certainly be a single parent home and often is.

Or young men could be taught to do better?
Unfortunately, unsuitable inadequate men are a dime a dozen, with the ones who make great partners and fathers somewhat harder to find.
The search is in no way helped by the number who fail to reveal the extent of their inadequacy until after the event.
I don't think women can be blamed if they reach a point of thinking if I wait for a decent one I might wait for ever, and if they want children decide to do the best they can with the one they've got.
At least they're going in with their eyes open. The divorce rates would suggest that there are a fair few others thinking (perhaps a little smugly) that they were so much wiser in their own choice, only to get a nasty shock somewhere down the line.

@MsPincher

You've got a real chip going there .

Yes I do contribute significantly to the countries coffers I've been a higher rate tax payer my whole adult life but this isn't about you as a single parent or me contributing this is about irresponsible women breeding to feckless men with the sole intention of sitting on benefits and as I've said I don't particularly care about them because it's their children I feel bad for being given a shit role of the dice to not only having no decent dad but being raised in poverty . This is a crap start to a child's life

I don't think women can be blamed if they reach a point of thinking if I wait for a decent one I might wait for ever, and if they want children decide to do the best they can with the one they've got.

women are not entitled to children.

Who is saying they are entitled to children ?
a woman wanting a child doesn’t necessarily equate to a sense of entitlement?

Take that point of view to a board where women are using sperm donors and see where that goes ……

You’re the one claiming that you support single mums. Certainly not me. Why aren’t you suggesting women have jobs or financial security before children? Why is it all about picking the right man?

I think you'll find that given the absence of any legally enforced fertility controls, women are fully entitled to become pregnant and have a child at any time they wish.

A happy stable home can certainly be a single parent home and often is

Yes - but may not be, just the way that two parent families might splinter, or be bad examples to children by the way they behave to each other and their children!

The point I made is that it’s better to aim to bring a child up in a loving home with loving parents, modelling good parenting to their children so they can go on to form stable, secure loving relationships for their future offspring.

Setting out to deprive children of that experience seems very odd indeed.

This. 50% of marriages end in divorce and even lots of those that don’t end up unhappy. Imo if men are crap fathers it’s on them not on the mums.