To dump nanny by text

[Newmum0322]

Seems harsh but let me explain. She started with us 2 weeks ago on a fixed term contract for a few months. she brings her own daughter with her which I was fine with, didn’t see any problems. My DD is 9 months, her DD is 6 months so their needs are fairly similar in terms of eating/napping/playing.

The problem is she can’t seem to take any initiative, when she feeds DD she needs me to make it up, she then proceeds to feed her own DD so I’m left feeding whilst I should be working. DD cries frequently through the day, when she wakes up early from her nap the nanny rarely gets her back down because she seeing to her own child. I never see her holding, cuddling or focusing on DD in any meaningful way.

We’re not happy with her and so we are letting her go. We have to give her notice which I’m happy to do, but don’t want to wait until her next working day, as that will prolong the length of notice. We have alternative childcare lined up.

So… AIBU to text her letting her know we know longer need her, bearing in mind length of service (she’s effectively worked only a handful of days) and the fact I’d like her gone sooner rather than later?

I’d send a text saying ‘can we arrange a time to have a chat, ideally as soon as possible?’ So she has warning it will be something like that, then explain on the phone you just don’t feel it’s working. I wouldn’t want her back, but appreciate if you need the childcare until you get something else sorted you might have to.

But everything you are saying applies to employees.

You said the nanny was self-employed and on a fixed term contract. So she is a self-employed contractor, not an employee.

So by “letting her go” you are technically terminating the contract you have with her. You aren’t “dismissing” an employee.

Becouse you also said nursery workers work find with a 1 to 2 ratio....they often don't and often actually have more to physically care for why staff tidy up etc. The feeding is one example of even its not fine. I've been in many nurseries over 30 years and cared on my own with twins and triplets. It's not ideal hence why childminder ratios are 1 under 1 ......but why are you being so rude I'm not raving about anything?

Same difference for employees/self employed.

Again… not relevant to me as I’ve decided how to handle it per countless posts above. But for other people in a similar situation a contract is a contract. If you have a contractual notice period, it clearly states that the notice is for both parties.
If a employee/contractor/other self employed person chooses not to work the notice in the contract… then they won’t get paid or provided a reference!

and yes… before you say it… self employed nannies do still ask you to provide a reference.

The previous post before said ‘she doesn’t have to work her notice as it doesn’t apply to her… we it does if a) she wants to be paid for it and b) if the contract stipulates it relates to both parties!

so where exactly is the difference??

Yes I imagine it does work for you.

however would buy out honestly treat all children the same in the event of an accident or hazard when all in need of very urgent attention from you?

I’m guessing your approach is “why use a dozen words when you could write a novel”?

I’m not talking about care @jannier
It would be a cruel person that didn’t treat your own child the same as the child you are nannying the same in terms of feeding them, ensuring they are warm, clean, well fed and entertained.

I am talking about when there is an accident / an emergency / you need to grab to get them away from a vehicle / you need to tend to them if both fall badly from tree etc.

Would you honestly not instinctively go to your own child without hesitation irrespective of who is closer

“Same difference for employees/self employed.” is completely incorrect.

It really depends on the T&Cs of the contract you both signed what the rights and responsibilities are. So I can’t comment on specifics. But generally you can’t terminate her contract without compensating her unless she has breached the contract. The compensation is usually payment for the rest of the contract term…so she’d get the full 10 weeks pay and no, she wouldn’t have to work any of that time past the termination date.

But again, I don’t know what you had her sign. But the way you are talking it sounds like you had her sign an employment contract, making her an employee.

Did you do this? and tried to put in that she is “self-employed on an FTC” to avoid employment law and taxes?

You need to watch out because if HMRC rules that she was an employee and not a self-employed contractor you would be liable for things like NI payments.

You have already hired a replacement and had a trial?

So when did you first start to have misgivings? Must have been on day 1?

You must be a troll, purposefully trying to wind me up with nonesense 😂😂

There is no other explanation for this level of ineptitude. So haha good laugh, let’s move on from this sci fi !!

Yes day 1 I was unhappy, gave feedback. Nothing changed on day 2 so I made arrangements with a lady that applied after I’d already agreed a contract with nanny 1. The trial was yesterday. That went exceedingly well, she has accepted a job offer today!

How did the call go, OP?

A call would be nicer, but when she’s that bad at her job that she’s watching you do the most fundamental part of it by letting you sort out feeds, and she doesn’t improve when she’s clearly told, I think it’s fine to get rid in any way that you’re comfortable with.

So for those asking, I’ve dropped her a text letting her know I’d like to discuss how things are going, and asked her to let me know when she’s free. She said she’s free at 6pm…

watch this space!! Don’t know why I feel nervous…

There is no other explanation for this level of ineptitude

I highly recommend you get a tax advisor because you could face criminal prosecution if you have a nanny you are actually treating as an employee and do not operate PAYE for income tax and pay your share of NI on her behalf.

Your posts saying she is “self employed on a FTC” are then contradicted by posts taking about dismissal, working a notice, payment in lieu of notice, and the silly “same difference self-employed/employee” comment. It has me wondering are you inept or knowingly doing a tax dodge and in so doing denying a hard working nanny their NI credits towards their state pension?

HMRC has been cracking down on this tax dodge, and often all it takes is a sacked nanny feeling hard done by to kick off an HMRC investigation.

I don’t know why I’m even caring about you as you’ve been outstandingly rude towards me.

Under two years you don't have to give a reason. So just call her and let her go, pay her notice and say it is with immediate effect. It sounds like you don't want her working her notice.

I agree with you @Discovereads (I'm a lawyer and I used to employ nannies).

OP despite being within the 2 year period you have to be exceedingly careful here - I had a nanny who went on mat leave and then wanted to come back with her baby.

I went and talked to employment lawyers in my firm who warned I'd be on thin ice if I terminated her employment unless I did it exactly the right way with the "right" reasons so I had to structure things carefully.

(And no, saying she's "self employed" won't cut it - employrment is a matter of the applicable facts, not what you dress it up as or choose to call it)

@TheWayOfTheWorld
I have been hoping someone like you would find this thread and also pick up on the “self-employed on a FTC” statement not synching with all the talk about employee dismissal and notice period procedures.

As you know, a notice period in an employment contract is not the same thing as a notice period in a contract for services. There are different applicable laws and regulations.

@Discovereads the thing is that there are people who take their employer responsibilities seriously and do things fairly and correctly.... and those that don't.

My nanny was friends with the nanny of one of DCs school mates - apparently they paid her in cash (late), didn't pay holiday, pension, sick pay, income tax or national insurance. I don't know why she put up with it but they were fucking disgraceful.

Fucking disgraceful- 100% agree. And there is something especially despicable imho about a well off woman exploiting a less well off woman in such a manner.

I'm a solicitor in private practice and in the past an employer of nannies.

You seem to be under a bit of a misunderstanding of what a self-employed fixed term contractor is and an employee.

I hope the call goes ok.

Don't know people are giving you such a hard time tbh

Good for you. I’m a practicing chartered accountant, and if you read all my previous posts you’ll understand exactly what I’m doing, why I’m doing it, and how it’s not only within the rules but is considered best practice! Read ALL my posts before commenting on one element that is a) not only irrelevant to the thread b) but has already been covered thoroughly

anyway… I’ve just realised your clearly the same troll who has created another user name 😂😂😂😂 god you must be so bored of life!!

Same difference for employees/self employed.

Scary that a practicing accountant actually thinks this.

So… I spoke to the nanny, she called me!

Frankly I should have text! She was defensive, wouldn’t accept anything I said and was clearly entirely unprepared for the conversation. It would have been a kindness to text 😂

the whole convo lasted under 5 minutes. She asked for examples of what I was unhappy with, said she had worked on them, that I should give her more time as she’s a first time mum as well etc… the whole thing was very uncomfortable and ended on ‘ok fine, whatever then’…

If anyone finds themselves in a similar situation, do both of you a favour and text or email!