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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To expect a child of three with ASD to sit nicely at the table?

225 replies

Damnrightwrong · 15/03/2021 07:46

Is it unreasonable and/or unrealistic to expect an an autistic three year old to sit nicely at the table at dinner time?

YABU - expecting too much of the child
YANBU - they should be able to sit nicely, regardless of a disability

OP posts:
BlackeyedSusan · 15/03/2021 08:50

High chairs....they were still strapped in. One was ok at sitting if in a high chair but it was hard work with lots of entertainment if out. It was eat quickly, and lots of walking round in between and eating at somewhere with a soft play and outside if possible.

Soontobe60 · 15/03/2021 08:50

[quote activitythree]@Soontobe60

Any of what?

The post of mine you quoted earlier? [/quote]
If I quoted it, its because you said it. That’s how quotes work!

AmaryllisNightAndDay · 15/03/2021 08:51

OP you could post on the MN Special Needs (Children) board and explain the full situation - you'll get good advice on how to handle the nursery. And less irritability than AiBU!

If he's finding lunchtime overwhelming and he's disrupting the others then it might be sensible for him to sit with one or two other children, maybe some of them taking turns to sit with him. Flowers

MidsummersNightie · 15/03/2021 08:52

He now has to eat separately to the rest of the children because he gets up and runs around, doesn't sit still etc

In fairness, my dd (who has quite severe sen) had to eat separately in her school because she wouldn't stay sitting down, or even eat sometimes. They thought that maybe all the activity and noise around was distracting her, and they were right. And her restlessness was distracting all the other children. She didn't have a 1 to 1 though, so ate before everyone else. So whilst it was unreasonable to expect her to sit, it wasn't unreasonable to change the surroundings she ate in until she would settle more happily.

BlackeyedSusan · 15/03/2021 08:52

It wasn't a regular thing. We don't eat at the dinner table together now. Too many sensory issues.

Oh and we gave up giving them yogurt..too many tries at getting it out of the curtains.

AdditionalCharacter · 15/03/2021 08:53

I am not being shitty, nor am I being hard work. I was answering based on what the title and the first post said. How else am I to assume the Op was talking about the preschool her child attends? I'm not psychic Confused

I apologise Op for my first few posts, if you had posted all of the information you would have gotten a much more clear and kinder response.

Does your child have a diagnosis yet, or are you going through the diagnosis process?

The pre school should not be making him sit by himself, they should be supporting him sitting with his peers, as that is where he will learn the routine. They are not being inclusive by excluding him and you can complain to whatever education local authority they fall under. If it is a ore school attached to a school, ask to speak to the SENCO and also write a letter to the governors of the school if you feel they are not listening.

Also, ask if the ore school can start an EHCP for his continuing education, as it takes a while to get one and it will be invaluable over the coming years.

RainingBatsAndFrogs · 15/03/2021 08:53

OP, maybe post about this in the SEN board where you will get experienced specialist knowledge support.

It is a serious issue you are dealing with and AIBU is a bun fight board.

Nith · 15/03/2021 08:54

Point out to the nursery that (1) it's discrimination on the grounds of disability, which is unlawful, and (2) they are also failing in their duty to use their best endeavours to meet your child's needs, because depriving a child with a social communication problem of the chance to learn to socialise is very poor practice.

Daftasabroom · 15/03/2021 08:54

When DS1 was diagnosed we went on some of the NAS courses. The best advice we had was "pick your battles". Sitting still at dinner isn't in the same league as learning to cross the road.

minniemoocher · 15/03/2021 08:56

Depends, asd isn't a generic condition! My dd did however I expected my dc to sit at the table from 6 months old, we always ate together and we obeyed the rules too - kids need good modelling

activitythree · 15/03/2021 08:56

@Soontobe60

Yes, but your response really didn't match my post. I just wondered if you had accidentally quoted me, your response here..

You’re totally wrong. A child with ASD who wanders off during mealtimes isn’t ‘behaving as he pleases’. Autism isn’t where children are just naughty. Isolating any child with a disability because they don’t ‘fit in’ with the norms is what used to happen back in the last century. Thankfully its not so common these days.
If you think he’s ‘naughty’ you clearly know nothing about ASD.

...was absolutely the opposite of what I said.

Sockwomble · 15/03/2021 08:56

"It’s not naughty behaviour, but behaviour that is potentially distracting and has a negative affect on all the other DCs in the group"

Oddly enough children in special schools who will have a similar level of understanding manage with others around them having distracting behaviour at lunchtimes.

minniemoocher · 15/03/2021 08:58

Ps my dd was at an autism specialist nursery and they all sat at the tables, no exception

zen1 · 15/03/2021 08:58

They are discriminating against your child due to his disability. Under the Equalities Act, they are supposed to make ‘reasonable adjustments’ for him. It sounds as if they have no understanding of ASD. The SEND code of Practice (2014) which is available online will also outline their duties to him as a child with SEND.

BrumBoo · 15/03/2021 09:03

@Damnrightwrong, I changed my 3 year olds preschool because of just this. Sitting down nicely was expected above all else, the last straw was suggesting that there was was something inherently wrong with my small child for not being able to do so. New school doesn't force anything, and treats any instance of sitting nicely in a group as a big celebration, so much encouragement yet no pressure.

First preschool broke him and me. Made me feel like my child was nothing but a nuisance and I was a bad mother for basically not having forced 'sit down time' every day. Took my lovely HV to realise that the issue wasn't with us, plus not all 3 years olds - NT or otherwise, can bloody sit still anyway.

It does take compromise but no, there shouldn't be any expectations that a 3 year old with autism can sit still at a table, especially in a busy and stimulating environment.

ParadiseIsland · 15/03/2021 09:05

Surely, it depends on the child, ASD or not??

I know a few children with ASD. Two of them were able to sit at the table, others didn’t.

Instead of wondering what the majority of children do age 3, look at what your dc can do and their own true abilities.

Duggeehugs82 · 15/03/2021 09:07

My daughter is 4 with autism she spends much of her time standing while eating as reqlly struggles but she also isnt able to follow any direction due to her not understanding language and she is also non verbal. I think it really depends on the needs of child, but 3 year old in general some struggle, i wouldnt be happy with my child having to be in separate room, i also wouldn't be happy when they said all children need to learn i think its obvious they dont have the understanding or knowledge on autistic children and i wouldnt be comfortable my child being there

WhateverHappenedToFayWray · 15/03/2021 09:08

@BrumBoo I experienced something very similar with my daughter's first pre school. Every time I collected her she was strapped into her buggy and what made it worse was that my 'friend' was the nursery manager. I thought that she would look after her but I couldn't have been more wrong.

The best thing I ever did was remove her from that pre school.

Sirzy · 15/03/2021 09:12

Is he able to eat better when he is sat without distractions? Perhaps you could ask for him to sit separately but with a small group of peers rather than in the larger group?

BlackeyedSusan · 15/03/2021 09:13

Being separate may not be a bad thing. I would prefer that, even now, less noise of people eating etc.

Before you think it is wrong, think about it from his point of view. Does he have sensory issues? Is this better for him. Does it give him time to recover from sensory overload in a quiet environment? Are you looking at it from a NT view?

It may be really beneficial for him.

Wnikat · 15/03/2021 09:13

I would take him out and put him in a more nurturing setting

VettiyaIruken · 15/03/2021 09:15

You need to change preschools. They clearly know sweet fa about autism and keeping him in that environment will be hugely damaging for him.

Asd is a disability with a set of traits that exist because they are the result of the disability.
It fucks me off that people come out with the utter bollocks of asd is no excuse they still have to..

Go to a blind person and say yeah ok, you're blind, you still have to read aloud what's written on the board.

Go to a deaf person and say being deaf is no excuse for not listening.

Go to someone without legs and say everyone has to walk, you just need to do it.

I'm so fucking sick to death of fucking ignoramuses spouting their utter drivel. If you don't know about autism, keep your fucking mouth shut.

He needs to have adjustments and adaptations same as the examples above would need and to be in an environment that isn't run by fuckwits.

PurpleDaisies · 15/03/2021 09:16

@zen1

They are discriminating against your child due to his disability. Under the Equalities Act, they are supposed to make ‘reasonable adjustments’ for him. It sounds as if they have no understanding of ASD. The SEND code of Practice (2014) which is available online will also outline their duties to him as a child with SEND.
A reasonable adjustment could be eating in a quiet room, possibly with just one or two friends. This doesn’t automatically have to be a punishment.
Ellie56 · 15/03/2021 09:18

The pre-school needs some Disability Awareness training.

Love51 · 15/03/2021 09:18

He doesn't have an ehcp yet but surely he must be on some flavour of education or care plan? Go back to the plan with staff, look at his needs with them and see how this is meeting his needs. If it is, good. If it isn't, they need to come up with something else! Nurseries do tend to provide a lot of opportunities for eating, and he may not need all of them. Does he sit and eat better if he is actually hungry at the mealtime?