Another AIBU to move to London thread..

[aIways]

I read the last similar thread with interest, but my situation differs in several ways, so I'd be so grateful for advice. I always write posts that are much too long so I'll try and keep it brief, but happy to explain if needed..

I'm in my mid 20s, single mum with a 4yo. My DDs dad was abusive and doesn't see her. I graduated last year, and currently work in a startup which has given me so much experience but there is absolutely no chance of career progression or a pay rise, ever. My salary is low, but I like and respect my boss and am really grateful for him giving me a shot, especially in the unusual circumstances I was hired.

I live in a city which is almost as expensive as London, but has none of the career opportunities. It's a 2 hour commute each way.

I first properly looked for another job last weekend due to my being pissed off at not getting paid on time yet again (though I always keep an eye out for things in my area), just to see what was out there elsewhere, and found a grad job which required no experience, but pretty much all of the tasks listed are things I already do in my current job. The office seems young and fun (though I’m very aware that a single parent in a new city has little opportunity for non-child related fun and I can absolutely live with that). I applied Sunday night and Monday morning the recruiter got in touch with me, seemingly really keen.

It mostly appeals for the decent salary, the development budget for each staff member, and the scope for career progression. Also the work seems interesting and I'd be very comfortable and confident that I could exceed doing it. I’ve searched hard, and I can’t find that anywhere near where I live.

I have always loved London and my favourite days are going with DD to new, interesting places. The idea of taking her to the science museum, or the history museum or Tate modern etc for free whenever I like actually gives me butterflies

I couldn’t commute, it’d take too long and cost too much that I would be more skint than I am now. I’ve had to move my dad into my poky 2 bed to afford to live. It’s squished and I love him but he’s really messy/ unhygienic and there’s not enough room for us all. He’s cool with us moving, he'd miss DD desperately but has a friend to move in with, and just wants me to be happy and then ok for money so is hoping I get the job.

So.. I’m sure this will be controversial, but my starting salary is 30k, so about 2k take home, and if I moved I'd get an estimated additional 1k universal credit. I know that’s really generous, but I’m mainly moving for the career progression and am planning to work my arse off to make sure I contribute to society’s ‘pot’ in the long run. I’ve been at the mercy of in-work benefits and their random reductions, overpayments and suspensions for years and it’s made me literally suicidal; I dream of being without them (though am obviously appreciative to life in a country where they’re awarded). Annual promotion is typical within the company, and each staff member has a generous development/ training budget which they can spend as they wish.

So that’s 3k a month. My office will be near Shoreditch. I’m scared about finding DD a school, but apparently 2015 was a really low birth year and though the borough I’m looking at doesn’t publish primary intake data, neighbouring boroughs say they have over half of schools undersubscribed.

I’ve found some nice enough flats for £1500. Though I don't know the areas, so I'm going to commute for a month and scope out which ones are too stabby to consider.. I’m estimating my bills to be £500-600. So that leaves me £900 for food, petrol, treats, savings etc. So so much more that I have now. Does this all sound about right to any Londoners? I'm pretty streetwise, have grown up in a not nice area and am not expecting Notting Hill, but I don't want to live anywhere we are at serious danger of getting hurt obviously.

Atm, even with my dad chipping in for bills, my income is barely more than essential outgoings. With my DD sharing a room with me, and a fairly long commute with absolutely no scope for career progression.

The lady in the other thread was overwhelmingly told that she was crazy to move for 55k, a little more than my gross salary (I’m told I can expect bonuses etc but obviously my universal credit will reduce due to these). But I’m desperate to be free from benefits, and to be successful and build a great life for my DD. There was 4 of them, they already had a nice house and life up north. There's just 2 of us, and we're barely surviving.

I haven’t got it yet! But it’s all progressing very quickly and they seem very keen. That wasn’t short at all! But am I mental?

I don't want to piss on your chips, as I think it is great that you are trying so hard to get your life sorted.
However...! 1500 is unlikely to get you a decent place in Shoreditch. If you move further out, you need to factor in travel. Plus after and before school care for your dd.

How would you be entitled to uc? You don’t only need a school, you also need a school with amazing wrap around care.

Could your dad not move with you in the short term?

I don't want to piss on your chips, as I think it is great that you are trying so hard to get your life sorted.
However...! 1500 is unlikely to get you a decent place in Shoreditch. If you move further out, you need to factor in travel. Plus after and before school care for your dd.

Thanks for your reply! I don't expect to be bang in the middle of shoreditch. I'm just saying that my office is near there. But I'm searching for 2 bed flats under £1500 within 3 miles of EC2 and there's loads. I don't have a clue re areas but there's lovely ones in Walthamstow, Stratford etc and the journey seems to be less than 30 mins. I will struggle without a school which provides before/ after school care, I know, and that seems to be the biggest risk that I can see. I have no idea if I'll be allocated a nearby school, and if that school will have after school care available. I have spent loads of time googling random school's provisions. I know the LA does not have to provide me with an alternative school if I turn it down. I take it I have an OK chance of finding a CM who may cater? Especially if I bag a 9-5 (so no before school care required?)

I would say, what about childcare? Make sure you factor that into your calculations.

School often feel like they are shut for half the year. On the other hand you could probably make do quite happily with a one bed with a 4 year old. So that could be an option.

I would make a spreadsheet and if you can definitely survive then go for it.

Another option would be rent a two bed and get an au pair. Only if you can't find a school with an after school club though.

Also look into Wanstead. It's a lovely area with good schools. Shouldn't take too long to get to Shoreditch.

*How would you be entitled to uc? You don’t only need a school, you also need a school with amazing wrap around care.

Could your dad not move with you in the short term?*

It says I would be on entitledto? 30k salary, 1500 rent in the above borough, £300 a month childcare (spread out including holidays, general estimation and may be totally out).

No, he absolutely wouldn't. He'll look after DD for a month or two in the mornings/ evenings whilst I commute to and fro, so I can scope out whether it suits and where would be ok to live. But he is quite clear that he can't imagine living anywhere worse than London takes all folks..

I think it would be a great move, and worth a shot. Is there any way your Dad could temporarily move with you while you get things sorted out? The childcare arrangements can sometimes take a bit of time and being on waiting lists before you get into clubs or accepted by a childminder. September is when a lot of CMs will have vacancies.

London is full of holiday clubs so you will be fine to find one. But it will cost around £200 a week so make sure you budget for it.

@GrapefruitsAreNotTheOnlyFruit I really don't have much idea, but if it's more than £300pcm then my universal credit figure would rise a bit too. Is that about right?

Tbh I'm dying for my own space after living with my dad for a year! We're used to living in a 1 bed if necessary. But I don't feel grown up enough to have an au pair I'd rather not if I'm honest but if that's the only way it could work, I would. Would a childminder not be better, just for a few hours each afternoon? Especially as its subsidised. Or is that not readily available in London?

Go for it. What an amazing opportunity for you and your daughter. Yes, housing is expensive and you'll need to think about school holiday childcare but everything else is the same price as everywhere else in the UK.

We spend a lot of time exploring different parts of London, which can be done for free or inexpensively. I'll never tire of it.

I'm sure it will take a while to get everything in place but once you do, you won't look back. Good luck!

And thank you so much for the area recommendation. This is what I'm aiming for tbh because I have literally no idea. Though am lucky my dad is pretty much forcing me to commute for a month so I can make these decisions. Said I was planning on asking MN but he wasn't convinced you guys were satisfactorily knowledgable to advise where his precious DGD would be moving to

I think roughly holiday childcare from 8 til 6 will be about 180 to 250 a week.

After school club and breakfast club maybe about 100 a week

Au pair about 110 a week but not proper official childcare so I don't expect it would work with UC. That said lots of people just want to come to London for a few months so definitely a good option if you are on a Waiting list.

Child minder , last time I used one was £8 per hour.

Obviously do your own research in the areas you are interested in.

But Wanstead is my top East London recommendation. Lovely place, very relaxed. You should go and visit.

Don't forget to add in the cost of the travelcard.

You're planning to do this for a longer term gain, so it is worth a bit of sacrifice.
I'd say save on accommodation, 1 bed flat would be fine if it's just the two of you and keep as much disposable income for childcare. Location will be everything for you. Find something really close to a good school ( I believe "good schools can often be better than "outstanding" ones). Make you're close to transport links and and amenities.
If you locate yourself well you won't care about the extra room, as you'll be spending all your time rushing to work, school pick ups, parks and last minute grocery shopping on the way home. These are the things that will make your life easier.
When you're a high flying career woman further down the line you can have your big kitchen and spare bedrooms and invite us all over for champagne!

*I think roughly holiday childcare from 8 til 6 will be about 180 to 250 a week.

After school club and breakfast club maybe about 100 a week

Au pair about 110 a week but not proper official childcare so I don't expect it would work with UC. That said lots of people just want to come to London for a few months so definitely a good option if you are on a Waiting list.

Child minder , last time I used one was £8 per hour.

Obviously do your own research in the areas you are interested in.*

Ooh, that does seem expensive. I don't know the hours yet - hopefully they're 9-5 as from the schools I've googled, it seems to be half the price for just the afterschool club. So if I get 4 weeks holiday, that's 9 weeks left @ 200ish a week. £1800. Remaining 39 weeks @ 50 is £1950. £3750/12 £312. So not far off. But depends on hours and specific prices I guess..

3k a month is like getting paid 49k so not that much different to the other thread. Do you get UC now?

Personally I wouldn’t move away from friends & family. I don’t really know East London well, Walthamstow has some good bits & bad bits.

I’m in SW London. My CM is £10 a day & wrap around school clubs are £14 a day unless you go for an actual club eg coding, tennis etc which is more.

But if you need to get to work for 9am surely you will need breakfast club from 8am?

I would always tend to allow an hour for a London commute as transport can be unreliable.

I’m not sure how universal credit works but I assume it reduces as your salary increases so your disposable income may not change for some while.

I think you’ll find most schools offer wrap around care. I don’t know of any that don’t round here (London Bridge). Ours costs £55 a week for both mornings and afternoons. I know some cheaper, but also some dearer.

I think it’s worth doin even if it’s a struggle at first sorting out schools ect. Everything will fall in to place andnit sounds like you will enjoy better off long term.

On a side note, I actually hate living in London with my kids and never visit the free museums beciase they are always ridiculously busy. I can’t wait to get out of the city for days out with the kids.

@fancynancy can't believe you found a Child minder for £10 a day in SW London. Maybe I have been looking in the wrong places. I have been paying £15 just for pickup until 1630!

Walthamstow is lovely and the schools are mostly great and honestly I arrived in London on a 16 k salary and 9 years later I'm on 54k so totally get the whole opportunity thing.
I personally used a childminder for years rr drop off pick ups and after that a babysitter paid 8 pounds an hour.
My oldest daughter babysits for 5 pounds an hour and many local mums call her for ad hoc jobs
You can do this, it's going to be hard, London can be really tough especially the rental market (was kicked out of my 2nd home because the LL wanted to increase the rent by 500 pounds and knew I couldn't afford it) but it can be worth it

She’s also fab but popular. She doesn’t really do pick ups (I still have a toddler) or Friday’s and I do pay her holidays/bank holidays.

Could you also send your dd to your dad when on holiday to save some money. I used to send mines to their grandmother when she could which saved me a fortune

Don't know if I'm missing something, but why will you only need after school care and not the breakfast club? Who will drop her at school if you need to be at work?

When you're a high flying career woman further down the line you can have your big kitchen and spare bedrooms and invite us all over for champagne!

Oh, I definitely will. I signed up to MN when I was 21 - homeless, jobless and pregnant in an abusive relationship, panicking and needing to read every thing I could re parenting to make sure I'd be a good one. In the past 4 years, I've completed a degree, I'm a massive feminist (and have strong views on toilet brushes and P&C spaces natch) and am debating a relocation to London for the sake of my career. I will be a quintessential middle class MNer if it's the last thing I do, and you're all invited to my weekly dinner parties