Another AIBU to move to London thread..

[aIways]

I read the last similar thread with interest, but my situation differs in several ways, so I'd be so grateful for advice. I always write posts that are much too long so I'll try and keep it brief, but happy to explain if needed..

I'm in my mid 20s, single mum with a 4yo. My DDs dad was abusive and doesn't see her. I graduated last year, and currently work in a startup which has given me so much experience but there is absolutely no chance of career progression or a pay rise, ever. My salary is low, but I like and respect my boss and am really grateful for him giving me a shot, especially in the unusual circumstances I was hired.

I live in a city which is almost as expensive as London, but has none of the career opportunities. It's a 2 hour commute each way.

I first properly looked for another job last weekend due to my being pissed off at not getting paid on time yet again (though I always keep an eye out for things in my area), just to see what was out there elsewhere, and found a grad job which required no experience, but pretty much all of the tasks listed are things I already do in my current job. The office seems young and fun (though I’m very aware that a single parent in a new city has little opportunity for non-child related fun and I can absolutely live with that). I applied Sunday night and Monday morning the recruiter got in touch with me, seemingly really keen.

It mostly appeals for the decent salary, the development budget for each staff member, and the scope for career progression. Also the work seems interesting and I'd be very comfortable and confident that I could exceed doing it. I’ve searched hard, and I can’t find that anywhere near where I live.

I have always loved London and my favourite days are going with DD to new, interesting places. The idea of taking her to the science museum, or the history museum or Tate modern etc for free whenever I like actually gives me butterflies

I couldn’t commute, it’d take too long and cost too much that I would be more skint than I am now. I’ve had to move my dad into my poky 2 bed to afford to live. It’s squished and I love him but he’s really messy/ unhygienic and there’s not enough room for us all. He’s cool with us moving, he'd miss DD desperately but has a friend to move in with, and just wants me to be happy and then ok for money so is hoping I get the job.

So.. I’m sure this will be controversial, but my starting salary is 30k, so about 2k take home, and if I moved I'd get an estimated additional 1k universal credit. I know that’s really generous, but I’m mainly moving for the career progression and am planning to work my arse off to make sure I contribute to society’s ‘pot’ in the long run. I’ve been at the mercy of in-work benefits and their random reductions, overpayments and suspensions for years and it’s made me literally suicidal; I dream of being without them (though am obviously appreciative to life in a country where they’re awarded). Annual promotion is typical within the company, and each staff member has a generous development/ training budget which they can spend as they wish.

So that’s 3k a month. My office will be near Shoreditch. I’m scared about finding DD a school, but apparently 2015 was a really low birth year and though the borough I’m looking at doesn’t publish primary intake data, neighbouring boroughs say they have over half of schools undersubscribed.

I’ve found some nice enough flats for £1500. Though I don't know the areas, so I'm going to commute for a month and scope out which ones are too stabby to consider.. I’m estimating my bills to be £500-600. So that leaves me £900 for food, petrol, treats, savings etc. So so much more that I have now. Does this all sound about right to any Londoners? I'm pretty streetwise, have grown up in a not nice area and am not expecting Notting Hill, but I don't want to live anywhere we are at serious danger of getting hurt obviously.

Atm, even with my dad chipping in for bills, my income is barely more than essential outgoings. With my DD sharing a room with me, and a fairly long commute with absolutely no scope for career progression.

The lady in the other thread was overwhelmingly told that she was crazy to move for 55k, a little more than my gross salary (I’m told I can expect bonuses etc but obviously my universal credit will reduce due to these). But I’m desperate to be free from benefits, and to be successful and build a great life for my DD. There was 4 of them, they already had a nice house and life up north. There's just 2 of us, and we're barely surviving.

I haven’t got it yet! But it’s all progressing very quickly and they seem very keen. That wasn’t short at all! But am I mental?

Yes It definitely helps having family not too far away.
Re museums & river walks realistically you will probably not do this on a school/work evening but early mornings on the weekends are ok, just avoid the school holidays.

I think my school charges £50-60 a day for holiday camp. Hardly ever get a place as so bloody popular

Primary schools start at 8.50 - and you need to factor in your walk to whatever station you are nearest to - mine is 12 minutes and that's really close by. Always assume an hour for travel and then the walk at the other end. Check out places to live with good overland routes into London too. You can walk from Old Street station to Shoreditch which means you could live on the Great Northern Train line into Moorgate. Loads of affordable flats - probably a bit cheaper than £1500 and a maximum 25 min train journey to Old Street. Have a look at Palmers Green (great primary schools), Bounds Green, Wood Green, Finsbury Park. Easy interchange to Piccadilly line which is useful for museums/parks etc but the local areas also have loads of stuff going on. I proper love London and everything it offers me and my kids and although we don't go in a huge amount the days we spend there are some of my favourites.

Also, is your child starting school this september? As of course all places are allocated for a september start and you would struggle to get into a decent primary. if they are starting in september 2020, then make sure you move before the application deadline (and move as close to your desired school as possible!) And if they aren't starting till september 2020 you'll have to pay a lot in childcare until then, nurseries are expensive in london and decent childminder places are like golddust!

*You will sadly most likely find few people working from 9 til 5.

Most likely you will want to drop at breakfast club at 8, get in for 845 on a good day or 900 if mild delays.

Then rush off at 515 which will feel earlier than everyone else. But you will be fined/lose your place if late for an After school club.*

I'm worried about this. I'm a real perfectionist and a little bit obsessed with exceeding expectations. The company I work at is really small and it's never been the culture not to leave work on time. But I'll work through my lunch if needed, check my emails on my days off, work extra from home where required as I just want to do the best job and help the company succeed. The recruiter said the office is really chilled - yoga at break times, masseuses floating about, early Friday finishes for cocktails on the roof terrace etc. Typical London young techy start up I think. But that means they may not be used to people tied into childcare?

I could probably afford both breakfast and after school club, I think my UC would increase quite a bit if my childcare costs were higher. I'll do the sums tomorrow.

Glad you guys don't unanimously think it's a completely ridiculous idea though!

The flat you linked to in homerton is in a great area - lots of families round there. You might also be able to find an after school nanny share for a couple of days a week, so your dd doesn’t go to after school club every day. Or there might be a teaching assistant who could bring her home and look after her for a few hours.

Like others say, I would also look at Walthamstow. After you’ve been working a few months perhaps you can get flexible hours and take your dd to school / pick her up one day a week.

London is a great place to bring up kids. We go to the free museums all the time. We take the boat down the river. We go cycling for hours in the parks.

What have you got to lose?

Also each year I usually get membership of one thing e.g historical royal palaces or zoo and visit it constantly. Per visit it works out pretty cheap. Or makes a good Christmas present from relatives if you explain your kids favourite thing for Christmas would be something fun to do.

And there are really cool free places like the museum of London which are less crowded than south ken

My only word of caution would be that tech start ups are notoriously precarious. How long is the contract for? Do you have enough savings to tide you over if they let you go?

Also, is your child starting school this september? As of course all places are allocated for a september start and you would struggle to get into a decent primary. if they are starting in september 2020, then make sure you move before the application deadline (and move as close to your desired school as possible!) And if they aren't starting till september 2020 you'll have to pay a lot in childcare until then, nurseries are expensive in london and decent childminder places are like golddust!

Yes, this September! I know it's terrible timing. But when I've googled, it seems 2015 was a low birth year, and Brexit has had an effect (so the papers say) meaning London has many more primary places unfilled than usual. But yeah, this is what I'm most nervous about. Especially as even if we're lucky enough to get an ok school near us with wraparound care provisions, it's realistically going to take a couple of weeks. So I'll need to try and plan the move the week before a holiday/ half term and probably book another week off too to be sure and hope the LA find her one within that time. And the poor blighter will probably have to start at one school then move. But we're really in a precarious situation money wise atm and I do feel like I'm failing her sometimes. I'm doing it for her, and I think it'll be worth the upheaval. I hope, anyway!

My concern would be that there will be lots of young people without kids at a techy start up. And that the more senior people will be men whose wives are picking up the kids.

Maybe something in the public sector might be a better bet? I've never worked in the public sector though so not that knowledgeable.

"But schools generally start at 8.15, right?"

Nope, never come across that in london primaries. Mostly 8:45am and it takes longer in reception when you go in with them. Don't let it put you off though. Just make sure you factor maximum childcare fees in as even if schools have wraparound care it may be full and an au pair might make more sense so you can work late. Basically never calculate on the side of caution - in London everything costs more than you expect, journeys take longer etc. It's worth it and I encourage you to go for it, but only with your eyes wide open.

My only word of caution would be that tech start ups are notoriously precarious. How long is the contract for? Do you have enough savings to tide you over if they let you go?

Don't know if startup is the right term for it anymore. It's one of the fastest growing UK companies and seems to be expanding massively. They are continuously recruiting, so I'm not really concerned re that. My job at present, where I cross my fingers come payday hoping that my salary has actually appeared, is a lot more precarious, that's for sure.

As another poster says do a much research on the employer as possible, don’t just take the recruiters word for it re hours, culture, bonus etc.

Also each year I usually get membership of one thing e.g historical royal palaces or zoo and visit it constantly. Per visit it works out pretty cheap. Or makes a good Christmas present from relatives if you explain your kids favourite thing for Christmas would be something fun to do.

Great idea! We do that at the moment with nearby farms and zoos etc. How exciting that we could be doing it for our neighbourhood London landmarks soon

I would be tempted to shop around for another role that might pay you more ? Can I ask what type of role you do in the startup - is it the same type of job you are moving to? If you have a couple of years experience you might get more than 30k.

*always it sounds to me like you need to save more of a cushion before making this move.

Maybe look for a better job where you are and save. Then you can start with a two bed and an au pair for the first three months who can drop off where ever you want until you get Child care sorted.

It sounds to me like this will be too precarious without more of a savings cushion.

I live in the area you're looking at and lots of state schools have great after school care / breakfast clubs. Worth ringing round to understand which ones have limited numbers of places and which will take all pupils before you DD starts school. Good luck op

Regarding schools, as it's this september you're looking at, I would recommend moving as close to the schools you are interested in as possible. Yes, overall there are more spaces than kids, but that doesn't mean the spaces are where you'd want to send your kids. Basically decent schools will have waiting lists, which are really 'proximity lists' basically the closest person to the school will get the first place that opens up etc. you may end up having to go to another school, far away from your home, first whilst waiting for a place to open up, but the closer you get to the school, the quicker you'll get a place where you want.

*My concern would be that there will be lots of young people without kids at a techy start up. And that the more senior people will be men whose wives are picking up the kids.

Maybe something in the public sector might be a better bet? I've never worked in the public sector though so not that knowledgeable.*

I wanted to apply for the civil service grad scheme, but the earliest start date is Sept 2020. I can't stay in this financial position until then I agree though. I'm v nervous about that. But I can commute for the first month or two and join in on all the after induction drinks etc and hopefully be friendly enough with everyone. Doubt I'll meet any besties as they'll all be in a different life situation than I. More desperate for some mum friends, which I'll be scoping out at the school gates (whilst rushing for the tube I'm sure).

But anyway, I'm a really hard worker and I think I could do the job really well. If I don't get chosen for promotion because I have to leave to pick up my DD, I'll be gutted but I'll never know until I try? There is some stuff about flexible working in the info I've got and they're all about valuing their staff and not being like a 'traditional' employer so I'm hoping they're one of the good ones, who value quality of work output rather than just bums on chairs.

I've never worked in the public sector though so not that knowledgeable.

Ha, I moved into the public sector & I have to say (very quietly) it’s great. Some periods are busy (month end, yr end) but most days everyones screen is off on the dot. So refreshing after a lifetime of scheduled 2pm meetings actually starting at 4.30pm.

Yep, if I get the job the first thing I'll be doing is calling the surrounding boroughs to find out which schools have spaces and moving as close to any half decent ones as possible.

That, along with being able to get to work on time, is my absolute main priority. If we need to share a 1 bed for it to happen, that's fine. We do it now with my dad making a mess of every other bloody shared area, so it'll feel like a palace anyway

In regards to housing, I'd suggest checking housing association private rentals rather than renting from a regular landlord if possible. There's much more security, you won't get evicted if someone wants their home back and you have the added bonus of a residents association. I know L&Q have developments in/near Walthamstow and I the area is very up and coming... plenty of young families are moving there for the good schools, cultural scene and excellent transport links.

*Maybe look for a better job where you are and save. Then you can start with a two bed and an au pair for the first three months who can drop off where ever you want until you get Child care sorted.

It sounds to me like this will be too precarious without more of a savings cushion.*

Sorry, I am taking on board posts like these, not just ignoring them. It's tricky as I've been looking for a better job for years, there's just so little out there. I was lucky to get the job I have as I had no relevant experience but my boss just heard my life story and saw something in me. Im really grateful as I'm now more than confident to chat away at phone interviews etc because I've got loads of relevant experience.

I'm close enough to London for any nearby decent jobs at pretty much entry level (though with a degree and less than a year of industry experience) are in London. Or pay 21kish. I have a pretty good set up re work flexibility atm, work at home a couple of days - my boss doesn't care if my DD is around though I do the majority whilst she's in bed unless it's something urgent. It wouldn't be worth leaving it for such a tiny pay rise, with such little career progression. Plus on benefits, the pay rise is even smaller.

The sector in my area is pretty much recruitment consultancy and that's it. Unless you have several years of experience and professional qualifications. So if it doesn't work out but I can make it work for a few years and get this under my belt, I'd be in a much stronger position to come back.

In regards to housing, I'd suggest checking housing association private rentals rather than renting from a regular landlord if possible. There's much more security, you won't get evicted if someone wants their home back and you have the added bonus of a residents association. I know L&Q have developments in/near Walthamstow and I the area is very up and coming... plenty of young families are moving there for the good schools, cultural scene and excellent transport links.

Ooh, this sounds interesting. Didn't think I'd stand a chance though not having lived in the area for a certain amount of years? I couldn't imagine anything better than feeling secure in our home, knowing it couldn't be sold at any moment.

I'll look into it, thank you!

Don’t underestimate flexibility & the opportunity to wfh with small children. I’m part time but it’s still a lifesaver as there is always a big going around or a school play etc.