Calling Tory Voters

[donquixotedelamancha]

Some recent NHS themed threads have me thinking. I wonder whether those who voted Tory at the last election, or the one previously, wouldn't mind giving their oppinions:

1. Do you think that the NHS is in crisis? If so do you want it to receive more money?
2. Was the NHS an important issue for you, when you voted?
3. What do you want to see replace the NHS?
4. Do you intend to vote the same way again? Does this fit with your answers above, or do you feel torn?

I'm a die hard labour voter but still think this thread is a bit goady!

I'm a die hard labour voter but still think this thread is a bit goady!

We'll it's kind of meant to be: I'm genuinely interested in some constructive disagreement.

P.S. That's a great first post :-) I love a good snipe.

No idea what an oppinion is, but:

1. Yes. No.
2. Yes
3. Not applicable
4. Yes. Yes. (No, I don't feel torn).

HTH.

I just look at it like this : if Blair and Brown hadn't spent the nations money carpet bombing the Middle East we might have some money to support a great deal of infrastructure.

The NHS isn't underfunded at all, its is chronically mismanaged. One of its biggest drains on NHS monies is PFI mortgages, another Blair Esq brainchild.

Any more questions?

@Dietcokegirrrrl

I'm with you. If how Tory voters voted only affected them I'd say go for it but sadly it affects the rest of us too.

Maybe Tories don't take sick? Although tbh I'd think having their heads up their arses would make their immune systems weaker and more susceptible to infection.

No idea what an oppinion is

That's some impressive pedantry even for MN. Apppologies for the mistype :-)

The NHS isn't underfunded at all, its is chronically mismanaged.

So what's the better system that should replace/amend it?

For the first time ever i voted conservative at the last election. I have no love for the tories, but I felt labour under Corbyn would be a disaster for the country.

No party particularly aligns to my views.

I agree, the problems in the NHS are at least as much structural as they are about funding, but nobody is going to tackle the complete root and branch review required so no, I don’t want more money pouring in for no benefit.

Although tbh I'd think having their heads up their arses would make their immune systems weaker and more susceptible to infection.

Lots of alternative threads available to be rude about Tories- I would appreciate some more constructive argument on this one.

1. No, not in crisis, but we need to consider implementing models of healthcare delivery that are successful in other countries
2. No more so than other issues
3. Some element of private healthcare for those who can afford it - assuming that we want access to optimal care in certain disease areas (e.g. targeted therapies)
4. Absolutely, no question about it

Why just Tory voters?

Why not ask Labour voters if they are happy with the legacy of Blair and Brown's PFI contracts?

NewyearNewme18

Words fail me. That's rare.

And Cameron and Osbourne - they managed the finances well? I think yet again people are forgetting how we bailed out the banks - and it wasn't to benefit to working class either but middle class wannabes who felt one house wasn't enough.

We'd rather bash hardworking NHS staff instead. And be nursed by Indians - like the lady who looked after my in law last month who I couldn't understand and who got really pissed off when I asked an English speaking nurse to repeat what I just been told.

I couldn't care if only Tories were affected but it's the rest of us who suffer.

Wow. Goady much?

And OP you are quite right. Apologies. Just anything conservative makes me see red!

uk.businessinsider.com/pfi-report-private-companies-made-831m-from-the-nhs-in-7-charts-2017-8/#the-2015-database-shows-125-pfi-contracts-between-nhs-trusts-and-private-companies-these-buildings-have-a-combined-capital-value-of-124-billion-but-repayments-will-total-808-billion-to-date-fewer-than-half-of-these-repayments-have-been-made-1

So what's the better system that should replace/amend it?

One that doesn't involve very highly paid people sitting round in meetings for hours on end talking bollox and deferring to the next Assurance Group.

£46 an hour I was paying an agency for a Band 6 nurse. That's the equivalent of £89,500 per annum. A band 6 top end salary is £35.5K

Nurse Specialists. One I deal with spends all day, every fucking day saying how busy she is, whilst reading the online papers, doing radio phone ins, and ordering clothes on line. When she's not doing that she's doing her MS - the one she's supposed to do in her own time. Band 7, 40K per annum, hasn't seen a patient in 25 years.

Procurement. I had to wait 3 months and £500 to get an item from Germany - I could have gone to PC World and picked up the same thing for less than £100, but no, you have to go through procurement to get the best deal. Then to add insult to injury I had to wait another 3 months for a IT tech to turn up and connect the damned thing.

As an aside DH has had the district nurse visit. She left behind something like £300 of specialist wound dressings. Absolutely ridiculous waste of money.

OP, are you really so naive to think that nuLabour had no part to play in some of the problems the NHS has? Sometimes it takes years for a bad decision (like PFI) to come to fruition. I guess the whole point of Brown's disastrous policies was that he would be well out of office and some other sucker would be held accountable for his reign of terror. Still, at least he has his nice fat taxpayer funded pension, unlike so many overworked, underpaid junior doctors working in the NHS...

Disclaimer I'm not British so don't have the ingrained dislike of any party that is so common on here, but fuck me the finger pointing of just who is responsible for the cluster fuck that is the NHS astounds me.

None of the parties have done anything in particular to save it. They are all just hoping they can keep throwing the hot potato and it will be someone else who catches it as it finally explodes.

The NHS has some major flaws and does need an overhaul. We waste a lot of money on procedures that should have to be funded privately not to mention number of managers etc.

I'd vote Tory again if they continue with their current path. They are the closest fit out of all the parties for me.

1. Yes. No, funding is higher than it's ever been, wastage, PFI contracts, and the procurement side being pricegouged by every supplier are big problems. If you have a hole in a bucket you don't just keep topping it up with water, you fix the damn bucket.
2. No. I don't believe all the hyperbole that anyone other than labour are in it to dismatle the NHS.
3. Nothing, but I think it needs to change from a demand led service to a supply led service. When it was first envisioned and implemented I don't believe half the things that the NHS currently offer were ever on the radar. How that wpuld work, I don't know, I'm not paid to make those decisions.
4. Yes, I live in a die hard labour stronghold, who'd vote in a turnip if you stuck a red tie around it. Our MP does fuck all, and doesn't have to, because he'll never lose his seat, I vote Conservative as they poll 2nd highest, so best chance of getting rid of him, so will continue to vote for them.

What a goody fucker you are...

worldsworstcook Why are you speechless? the thought of voting for that bastard war criminal who signed the death warrant for hundreds of thousands of people upsetting you is it?

Suck it up buttercup, on your conscience, not mine.

Why just Tory voters? Because we get an alternative narrative a lot. I'll (probably) vote Labour at the next election and the NHS is a big factor. I wondered whether a lot of people feel the same way, but are 'holding their nose' while voting, or whether they want to see a radically different outcome for the NHS.

Why not ask Labour voters if they are happy with the legacy of Blair and Brown's PFI contracts? Couldn't agree more. From what I know of them there is no real long term up-side to most PFI contracts. Most PFI contracts were signed in the last 7 years, I think only one party currently wants to get rid of them (Do the Lib Dems have a policy?)

I guess the whole point of Brown's disastrous policies was that he would be well out of office and some other sucker would be held accountable for his reign of terror.

These arguments about the introduction of PFI are interesting. Do people feel that PFI is the main cause of the issues in the NHS?(Personally I think they are stupid, but things would be a mess without them) Do people feel that the Tories should be scrapping them then?

What a goody fucker you are... Thank you. You are a goody too.

1. Yes. No - it needs to be made fit for purpose before another penny is spent on it.
2. Yes
3. Not applicable
4. Yes. Yes. (No, I don't feel torn).

I voted Tory with a clear conscience & will do again if I feel they're the best people to run the country overall.

the finger pointing of just who is responsible for the cluster fuck that is the NHS astounds me.

I don't think the NHS is a cluster fuck (though PFI is). It scores well against many other nations for efficiency and outcomes. I do think it is currently trying to do far too much with too little.