to be angry at the fact women MUST NOT BE FAT

[MagicMojito]

I'm just so pissed off with the double standards!

I went into primark and there is a whole wall dedicated to "hide your fat" type underware
and I dont just mean Spanx and the like, there were corset type tops, underware leggings to stop the wobble as you walk, a "no more back fat" vest - I shit you not, that's what it said on the label!! Rows and rows of the same type of fat hiding underware in all different styles and colours.

In comparison the men's underware department consisted of three rails, boxer shorts, briefs, socks and vests . Its the same in most shops now (although I was pretty shocked and impressed with such a vast range of products of this style)

In summer all over the tv/magazines its advertising how to get a great bikini body, fab abs, summer holiday slim down etc.

Winter its the little black dress diet for the office Xmas party!! -AIMED ONLY AT WOMEN

Aibu to just think FUCK OFF ALREADY?!
I realise this is nothing new BTW. I just had a realisation that things are only gonna get worse and I feel sad that this is the message that my dds are going to get brought up around

im 14 stone 2 with a small waist which is why I get into a 16 (I was 21 stone) I have big boobs (inherited from my gran when I lost 10 stone I only went down 2 cup sizes from a 46G to a 34F.
I also have mild lipodema (slightly lumpy lower legs also inherited from my gran She couldn't walk towards the end of her life, she shuffled) So no matter how much weight I lose the bottom half of my legs will still have a lumpy appearance. Which they did when I got down to 10 stone 12.

Oh and if you wouldn't tell an emotionally abused MNer to think herself lucky because Jane Doe down the road is being physically abused, then please don't use the Africa argument/analogy.

I think it's a fair analogy actually, given that obesity is a first world problem.

Of course, it doesn't remotely help those starving but it does help us to gain a little perspective. This is not something limited to eating and food, by the way, it is something of a mini-obsession of mine at the moment :) I have seen some tragic sights recently that make me feel grateful every time I stand up, unaided, myself.

I guess that's why I feel grateful for having a healthy body and determined not to abuse it in any way, and why I feel ashamed of my former self: ashamed of not exercising a self control which was there all along.

You can be a great person and fat. But you can't really be a healthy person and fat. And health is so, so, SO important.

I don't know about everyone else but I'd rather be mentally healthy and fat than physically healthy oh no wait I'm dead.

Not everyone has the same starting point for physical health.

And worra Im not disagreeing with you that women want these things, there is most definitely is a market for it out there. My issue is WHY there is such a market for it.

There is such a market for it because like it or not, women are way more interested in their looks and the looks of other women than men are.

You only have to read some of the 'sleb' threads on here to see what a lot of women think of other women and how they look.

People can blame industries/patriarchy/the media until the cows come home, but the fact is when you look around you...when did you ever see a Style and Beauty topic on a predominantly male forum? When do you ever see men starting threads about how male celebrities look at a ceremony or what they were wearing? When do you see a man on the train reading a gossip magazine?

Many women are far bigger critics of other women than many men are

This is why there is a market for these things, because women want them...and also because many people (male and female) would rather take the easy option and wear something that makes them look slim, than to go to the hassle of losing weight.

Men however, have nowhere near as much choice in 'slimming' clothing as women do...maybe because they're not as interested as we are or because they would rather hit the gym/change their diets...who knows?

So should an emotionally abused woman also "get some perspective" because Jane Doe 3 doors down is being physically abused..

"a mini obsession of yours....... oh well you said this yourself Your words not mine.

Tonga, the most obese country in the world, isn't a first world country.
Your other post about greed has given me so much to think about though.

gosh sorry its late and I'm tired so I may very well be confused but was that a snipe at me? You think I'm some disengenuous(sp?) Troll? Trolly type thread?

Definitely. And even those who have the same starting point can have something horrible happen just randomly, sporadically - I had a friend who was fit and well and then had a baby. Something went horrifically wrong, and she can't walk You just couldn't imagine a "normal" event like having a baby could do that but it did.

Just the same, I think it's worth remembering that firstly mental and physical health aren't the same exactly but they do link arms more than many people realise. Being fat made me depressed; being unable to exercise much added to it. So I self medicated with food which added to the problem of course. And taking self control and having a focus and eating a healthy diet and exercising all contribute not just to physical health, but mental health too. And I agree both are very important.

Men are allowed far more leniency with regards to their weight. A 14 - 16 stone man can still be seen as attractive, whereas with woman anything above a size 10 (10 stone approx) will be seen as fat by many and unattractive.

It's very easy to stay around 14 - 16 stone, you can still eat normal meals and snacks and not have to exercise much. You still get all the nutrients you need. Staying below 10 stone for most women is very difficult, especially as women get older. For lots of women it means constantly being on a diet. It often means starving your mind and body of vital nutrients. It's one of the many ways that women are controlled. I think it's time women woke up and stopped pandering to the wishes of men.

Darkest, you've misunderstood what I'm saying. A better analogy would be two ladies I visited tonight. Lady A is paralysed from the neck down, lady B from the waist down. Both are, bluntly, shit situations to be in and my heart goes out to them both. Lady B might be marginally better off than lady A but just the same, I'm so so grateful my legs work.

Abuse is just wrong and shouldn't happen. But I do think as we complain about unrealistic beauty ideals and shape underwear it is worth remembering how many people are starving.

Cat and I really really mean those sincerely. I hated battling with my weight, it was rubbish xx

Interestingly, it was the opposite for me. Being depressed made me fat. I was a teeny tiny size 6/8 before mental health problems including depression hit. The only thing I had worth looking forward to was the next meal and I got fat fat fat. It's taken me years to get as well as I am now mentally and I wouldn't jeopardise it even for the chance of perfect physical health at the moment. That's how physical and mental health link for me right now.

It's very easy to say eat better and you'll feel better but it doesn't apply to everybody. That's the main problem with former fatties doling out the advice. They think because they did it, that means everyone has the resources to do so. It's like the empathy gets switched off.

pickle, that's a ridiculous analogy. You wouldn't go in to Lady B and say "well at least you aren't like lady A!".

AND it IS the wishes of men

Take a read of the Everyday Sexism website for the many comments and calls in the street men pass on womens looks.

Two threads on the Relationships board last week alone about men commenting on women and weight.

"Should I lose weight for my husband"

FIL and DDs shape.

The DD is THREE years old!!!

EXACTLY Captain That's why I used the analogy of the emotionally and physically abused woman.

Yet its ok to trot out the Africa analogy whenever weight., food , poverty or foodbanks are mentioned.

No, I wouldn't.

But I do say to myself 'thank goodness my legs work.'

Being paralysed is awful. Being in an abusive relationship is awful. You wouldn't say to someone paralysed 'well at least your arms work!' because that would be so crass and insensitive and you wouldn't say to a woman suffering awful emotional abuse 'well at least he doesn't hit you' for the same reasons.

But you might remind yourself how fortunate you are that you can stand, walk and run freely and can wipe your own bottom and brush your own teeth. You might think your DH is annoying at times but at least he isn't abusive or cruel.

When I used to go to the 24 hour Tesco to buy crisps and cake I might really have thought how people were starving and stopped whingeing to myself about how hard my life on a diet was. When I moaned and groaned about going to the gym, maybe I should have reminded myself how lucky I was that I could afford to go, that I was physically able to go, that my loved ones needed me to be fit, active and alert - that I need me to be fit, active and alert.

I really do think I'm worth that. I think everyone is.

Again I'm not disagreeing with the fact women do exactly as you say. This is why there is a market for it...

this is SO frustrating!!

I wish I was articulate enough to make the point I'm desperate to make! Gah!!

Abuse is just wrong and shouldn't happen. But I do think as we complain about unrealistic beauty ideals and shape underwear it is worth remembering how many people are starving

"But I do think as we complain about how many women are being emotionally abused its worth remembering how many are being physically abused"

See ......its not really on is it.

Can you really not see how offensive you are being.

If someone working for Womens Aid tried saying what ive put in the second paragragh of this post I would consider them to have the wrong attitude for the job.

I think I've explained clearly enough the point I'm making, Darkesteyes, and as the thread isn't about abuse I don't think it's helpful to keep going on about it.

Greed, which is usually what leads to obesity, can be defined really by taking an excess of what you need - people can be greedy about lots of things, not just food - and yes I do think that is a distasteful thing to do. It's also an easy thing to do, and I am certainly not immune to it but it helps to recognise it for what it is.

And the effects of that greed are in turn harmful and so it doesn't do anybody any good, does it?

But you might remind yourself how fortunate you are that you can stand, walk and run freely and can wipe your own bottom and brush your own teeth. You might think your DH is annoying at times grin but at least he isn't abusive or cruel.

My DH has to use a mobility scooter because of emphesema because he smoked.

So I know what you mean.

And he STILL has never got as hard a time and shitty comments like I have in the past simply for being overweight.

The thread wasn't about Africa either!!!

No, it wasn't, but then I did mention it only once in passing

The point was about perspective and certainly no one would (I hope!) say that emotional abuse was okay because physical abuse was worse, as they are BOTH wrong.

But someone in an otherwise happy relationship who was complaining about something silly like their partners bad taste in music for example might benefit from a gentle reminder they were lucky with their DP, if you see what I mean.

Personally I wouldn't. I'm not normally in favour of comparisons as they're not helpful. But in this one specific case I make an exception. I guess when there are problems - really tough, awful problems, the "problem" of a plethora of food just doesn't seem that bad.

So women should be grateful that their DH isn't abusive or cruel????

JESUS that should be a given surely.

No what happened was you used the Africa analogy for emotional blackmail purposes on this thread and you didn't like it when you got called on it.

And I guess that my point was, I do personally see being overweight as something to be ashamed of.

That doesn't mean wear a sackcloth, say three Hail Marys or anything. But for instance I have a tendency to be a bit snappish when I'm stressed or pressured. I don't intend to get like that and I do apologise afterwards but just the same it isn't my nicest quality. I recognise it as part of myself and try to avoid it, and mostly succeed.

Same with greed. It's part of me, I will always enjoy food and I can eat far too much of it. This is not one of my better qualities: I try not to succumb to it, sometimes I do.

That's it :) I'm not going to best myself up over it but nor am I going to say to myself it's okay, acceptable, and get obese again as it isn't. It isn't acceptable for ME as I need to be healthy and happy.

You're not in favour of comparisons? Your previous post suggests you use other people's misfortunes daily to feel better about your life.

People who do that are far more distasteful than someone who is greedy. I'm sure people do that about me. Hey at least you aren't mental like captain. Hey at least you aren't fat like captain.