To feel free to use other children's toys in the sandpit?

[HarderToKidnap]

We go to lots of parks with our 2.4yo DS. He loves the sandpit and often we take our own spades etc, although sometimes we forget and sometimes go somewhere adhoc and don't have things with us, or go to a new place where we don't realise there is a sandpit.

Now, often in communal sandpits there are various buckets and spades lying around looking abandoned. I always feel free to give these to DS to use, having had a quick peek round for the owner. If after I pick up the spade I can't see anyone looking territorial, I will just give it to him to use. I keep an eye out for anyone coming near us spadeless, so I can quickly check with them whether the spade is theirs, and leave the stuff where i found it when we're ready to go. If I abandon my spade whilst DS toddles off to another attraction and I see someone else using it, I never mind. Just part of being at the park.

Anyway, got a mouthful off someone the other day for using a bucket they'd left in the pit. They'd stuck some paper pictures onto the bucket and one had come off. I'd noticed this before picking up the bucket, which had been laid there a good twenty minutes before DS picked it up. I stashed the paper pic safely and was intending to leave it in the bucket when we left. To reiterate pic had already come off bucket and was next to it. They were REALLY cross about the use of the bucket and obv thought we'd caused the pic to come off.

Discussing with friends today, there seems to be an even split between those who thought I was hideous for using someone else's toys, and those who thought mouthy mother was a lunatic. MN Jury, what say ye?

P.S., I'm not intending to change my behaviour at all, btw, regardless of MN consensus. I love the give and take in the sandpit and have had nothing but positive interactions with other mums and kids re the sharing of toys, save this one incident. This AIBU is purely for information gathering purposes!

Here's how it works.

Child A dumps their bucket in the sandpit and goes off to do something else
Child B toddles up 5 minutes later and plays with the bucket for a bit
Child A's mum comes back some time later to collect up all the discarded toys they brought. Asks Child B for the bucket back. Goes home.
World keeps turning.

Agh, sandpit toys are fraught with issues. I think the way you borrow stuff is fine op. Other parents are not nearly as observant or considerate. A child (usually small) will approach and grab spade/bucket. Scream if you dare ask for it back, toddle off across the large park, no hope of retrieval without child having a meltdown. Cue evil glares from parents, my own child upset etc. If they are stealthy they will nick it while no one is looking and even take it home with them.

When I am trying to escape the park I have to enlist dd to look for the toys (not 'abandoned' but cunningly procured by stealthy toddlers and older kids who should know better). By this time it's like a Where's Wally scene and all buckets and spades look the same.

Just bring your own sand toys, people! If you forget, be creative - use paper cups, plastic spoons, little bottles, whatever.

Alternatively........

Child A dumps their bucket in the sandpit and goes off to do something else
Child B toddles up 5 minutes later and plays with the bucket for a bit Child B's Mother asks him or her to put the bucket back as it doesn't belong to him/her
Child A's mum comes back some time later to collect up all the discarded toys they brought. and has no need to Asks Child B for the bucket back. Goes home.

World keeps turning.

Why make Child B sad for no reason? I'm not so mean.

I'm not mean. But that's life. It's not Child A's parents fault that Child B's parent hasn't bothered to bring stuff is it?

At what age to you actually instil in your children that there are boundaries and you can't always have/take or borrow every single thing you want in life? It's a lesson better learned earlier imo.

I just can't compute that people think it's okay to use someone else's stuff without asking or is it the fact that it belongs to a small child make it okay? Why is it right that someone has to go and ask for their stuff back when they haven't allowed someone to borrow it in the first place?

What happens if Child B snaps the spade while using it without permission? I'm sure that will make Child A sad.

What if you are sitting in a pub and have put your umbrella and jacket on the coat stand so as to not drag in wet stuff into the pub. Is it okay for someone else to see it there unattended for 20 minutes and then think since it is cold and wet outside, they'll use it to nip out to their car to collect something or to walk up to the shop to get a newspaper?

For me it is HardertoKidnap's saying she 'feels free' to let her child play with unattended toys in the sandpit that is grating somewhat. It sounds awfully like 'My child is ENTITLED to play with other children's toys if they aren't'!

On the other hand, encouraging children to share is a good thing - but doesn't that have to come from the parent of the child whose toy is being shared? Shouldn't they have at least some say in this process, rather than having some strange mum decide to teach their child a lesson by letting her child play with the toy?

I think you should make some effort to ask if it's ok for your child to play with the other child's toy. And I don't think it is right to believe you are entitled to do what you want with someone else's property. There has to be give and take, not just take.

Why make Child B sad for no reason? I'm not so mean.

I know, poor child B. If only mummy and daddy;
A) had the manners to ask, then child B would be happy
Or
B) Bring their own toys if they really can't ask

Then child B would be happy and smile like this

amicissimma - There is a difference between children all playing together and sharing, and a situation where either the parent/child has had to step away from the sandpit or the child has put the toy down for a short time whilst still in the sandpit.

First one completely fine. Second one the child (or parent if the child is too little) should ask before using. I doubt they would say no but it is simple manners surely to ask.

I honestly don't mind if Child B uses a toy that DS isn't playing with. If he wants it back it is no problem to just ask for it. If I really cared about other kids not touching our super special spade I would just pick it up or make DS pick it up and bring it to me when he's finished with it.

What's the chances that the people saying YABU were the uptight ones at school. You know the type, they didn't like others touching their pencil case, the ones that never shared their sweeties, the ones that guarded their books like their lives depended on it.

Whereas those saying YANBU and I do exactly the same, were the relaxed children at school about their belongings. Laughed if someone lobbed their pencil case across the room, shared their sweets, loaned their books if someone had left theirs at home.

It will get those in the former camp all twitchy, but my guess is that its bang on the money.

Whereas those saying YANBU and I do exactly the same, were the relaxed children at school about their belongings. Laughed if someone lobbed their pencil case across the room, shared their sweets, loaned their books if someone had left theirs at home.

And the ones who "borrowed" and broke/damaged other people's equipment or clothes and then told them not to be so uptight. And refused to pay for the damage they caused. And were very unpopular.

Enjoyingmycoffee

Really? I haven't seen anyone saying they wouldn't be happy to share if asked or wouldn't offer to share with a child who didn't have something if the opportunity arose, it's the entitlement of people thinking it's okay to use other peoples things without asking that's the problem. Maybe you were the type of child that had loads of stuff and parents willing to replace things that other children broke. I wasn't.

OP do you also think if your child breaks something its fine just to walk off if the parent isn't there because it only costs a couple of £?

Manners cost nothing.

Seriously though, if you are at the park thinking "I really hate it when all these toddlers keep touching the toys we've left lying around in the sandpit", why don't you just pick up all the toys you've brought and keep hold of them?

A bucket and spade in a sandpit.

Left as the owner plays elsewhere.

Yes, my children would play with them and I would be 100% fine vice versa.

As soon as owner returns, it is returned to them. No hesitation.

If harm comes to the bucket and spade whilst under my children's use (God forbid), I would reimburse.

All good.

The images I have as a result of this thread is some mothers stand on the sidelines, fists clenched, jaw clenched, buttocks clenched, just about ready to blow because a child has had the audacity to play with their child's bucket (who ran off twenty mins ago to go on the swings)

Next time I go to the beach I'm hoping some of the shares are near me, if you leave your book on your towel whilst you go to the loo or to dip your feet in the water.

I'm reading your book

exactly science, seems very odd to leave them in a public place, then expect small children to ignore them

just take them with you weirdos

Ridiculous needs. Because a child's book or towel, absolutely no sharing.

Bucket and spade is different.

Your bucket and spade, hell yeah, I'd have a go.

My playing at the park days are long gone and yes, when we were finished playing with the toys we did pick them up and put them away - after my boys had happily shared with other children in the sand pit. However, as has been said, the parent may not have had the opportunity to grab back all their stuff before something requiring their attention happened. Or maybe they were sharing toys with someone, left them playing with them while they went on the swings or something and the other child got fed up and left the toys in the sand pit. Why they left them there isn't the point, if the toys don't belong to you and there is no-one to ask or you are not playing with the owning child, then you leave them alone. That's really not that hard is it?

As for your book, I'm guessing we have different tastes.

I used to take floats and dive toys to the swimming pools with the kids.
It used to really annoy me when other people just picked them up to play with!
It's incredibly rude. No you can't just play with other people's stuff just because they're not using it.
You can't do it with a football, a scooter, a bike, a float or a bucket and spade - nothing is fair game!

exactly science, seems very odd to leave them in a public place, then expect small children to ignore them

No, I don't expect the toddler to ignore them, I expect the parent to tell them they don't belong to them and stop them playing with them.

...and if the parent is standing by the sidelines fists clenched then surely there is someone there to ask if you can borrow them from?

just take them with you weirdos

Or just keep your light fingers off if you can't bring yourself to ask.

...and was going to say that too, if you go in for a swim and leave your towel or rubber ring or whatever on the beach is it okay for someone else to use it? Of course it isn't, same applies to all property.

And the ones who "borrowed" and broke/damaged other people's equipment or clothes and then told them not to be so uptight. And refused to pay for the damage they caused. And were very unpopular

I think you hit the nail on the head here.

I think the two sides of this argument (take your super special spade with you if you don't want children playing with it it vs. it's my right to leave my bucket anywhere I want without your thieving toddler touching it) are never going to agree

Luckily most people in practice seem to agree that discarded sand toys are fine to play with until the owner wants it back, or at least the don't-touchers mostly manage to swallow their rage.