to not understand the fuss over halal meat?

[StuckInTheMiddleWithYou]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1317312/Waitrose-forced-ditch-halal-lamb-Duchy-range.html

Why on earth are people objecting so much? Do they really think that the standard method of killing an animal is any less cruel?

Quite mad.

Not really. I'm not religious and don't want to eat meat killed in the name of a god any more than religious people wanting to not eat meat that hasn't.

Its noting about cruelty to me just that I'm not a religious fuckwit.

Ok, if you don't believe in God, why on earth would you care about someone muttering a few meaningless words over your steak?

It isn't catching.

YANBU.

I'm not religious, which is why I couldn't give a flying dutchman whether it's killed in the name of a god or not. A non existant god cannot spoil my meat.

I understand what you are saying but there is a difference between the standard slaughter of animals and what is done for religious purposes eg. halal.

I can't say anymore as am v nauseous at the moment and even thinking about it is making me gag!!

However I do take your point as it is standard Daily Mail fodder.

Because the Daily Mail likes to make a fuss.

"Ok, if you don't believe in God, why on earth would you care about someone muttering a few meaningless words over your steak?"

Because we live in a country where I can make the choice. I'm an Atheist. I'd prefer it if religion was outlawed. That's why.

Some people just like to have something to complain about. It doesn't bother me if I buy halal or not, killing is killing. I think it should be labelled as such, and people can make up their own minds.

Seeyou, I'm also an anthiest and you cannot outlaw ideas. That's draconian.

The RSPCA believe the current way of killing animals is less cruel and that the animals suffer less.

You want to outlaw religion?

halal slaughter isn't any less humane than non-halal slaughter. The carotid artery is severed, leading to loss of consciousness within a couple of seconds because of massive blood loss. It might not look pretty, but then neither does firing a bolt between a cow's eyes or a chicken being dipped head first into an electrical bath.

I'm intrigued as well, is it because it's attached to a religion or is it the manner in which it's killed?

FWIW, as far as I know the slaughter in halal butchery is with a very sharp knife, and the animal effectively dies from blood loss.

There would be no pain, the animal merely loses consciousness. Nearly bled to death myself once, admittedly without a cut mark to the neck, but it's just like slipping into sleep.

Traditional methods are - AFAIK - to stun with an electrical prod and then shoot with a bolt gun into the brain. Is this method 100% accurate all the time, I think I have heard that it's not.

Meat is meat, it has to be killed to be eaten.

If meat served for consumption can be eaten by all faiths, kosher and muslim is the same method, and christian or other can eat either without any compromise to anything, then I too really do fail to see the problem.

The RSPCA say it is less humane Emma. You say yourself they "consciousness within a couple of seconds". Isn't it better they lost conciousness BEFORE having their throats cut?

I think people object so much because we have animal welfare standards that are set for slaughter houses. Animals are knocked out before having their necks cut, so they are not suposed to suffer. halal method does not allow stunning, so an animal is fully conscious when its neck is cut, and stays alive and conscious for a while, in terror.

The fact that this is done routinely, while supermarkets promote animal welfare standards, is a con.

If food is to be produced with religious ceremonies, and negating animal welfare standards, they should be labled as such so that consumers have a choice.

I've recently lost a lot of respect for the RSPCA due to personally dealing with them.

What would people here prefer, having your throat cut or your brain electrecuted?

Can't imagine that either is much fun myself.

cattle can take up to two minutes to bleed to death - amounting to an abuse of the animals.

What about all this animal welfare we are supposed to have in this country?

If halal/kosher meat is seen as causing suffering to the animals it should be banned

I don't mind the shelves being full of the stuff as long as it us clearly labelled so the consumer can choose.

I'm with the RSPCA view as cited above, and also have grave concerns about any slaughter in an abbatoir where the aminals are not stunned (general cruelty concerns plus effect on waiting animals).

Very, very concerned about imported meat as abbatoir regulations vary internationally, and EU food packaging seems designed to obfuscate not enlighten.

Also interested in the concept that UK law can/should be amended on religious grounds, but I think that would be a whole separate thread.

"cattle can take up to two minutes to bleed to death - amounting to an abuse of the animals. "

Severing the carotid artery removes the blood supply to the brain - resulting in loss of consciousness within a couple of seconds. After that, the heart will keep beating for a time, but the animal is no longer aware of anything and does not feel any pain.

I'm a vegetarian so don't eat meat whether it's halal or not, but if you're bothered about animal welfare abuses, then halal is the least of your worries.

LittlemissHissy what on earth happened to you!? I know I'm hijacking.

I have a problem with it as I think it compromises the workplace for non-muslims in food production. It effectively forces prayer in the workplace.

Doesn't 'Halal' mean that the meat is sprinkled with AIDS by illegal immigrants?

I think taxpayers should be told.

EmmaBemma

Its all about freedom of choice,people should be told that its halal

Actually, I've been talking rubbish - just checked out the RSPCA and Viva websites and cows can take a minute to lose consciousness, calves twice that, because of occlusion of the carotid arteries (they shut themselves when severed, maintaining blood pressure in the brain for a time). So - apologies for that.

However! Both sites state that over 90% of animals slaughtered for halal in the UK are already pre-stunned, and that by law, halal slaughter has to take place within a registered slaughterhouse.