Support group for those affected by someone else's drinking - thread 4

[pointythings]

I'm about to head out for the morning routine and given how active our thread has been I felt I had better provide a new one.

Link to the previous thread: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/alcohol_support/5418536-support-group-for-those-affecteed-by-someone-elses-drinking-thread-3

Thank you all as always.
The therapists where he is seem very keen on letters.

I am thinking that I will write a letter to him stating clearly my boundaries and what I will and will not do to support him.
That way I can clarify to myself what I'm going
I can also use it as a check list to make sure I'm sticking to these things .

My mind was so scrambled by the time he was admitted that I can see how that could easily happen again so it might make me accountable to myself as well .

I think writing it down and sending it to him is a very good idea. TBH I haven't done that myself and DH seems to be able to either conveniently forget what I've said or he twists things around until I either can't remember exactly what I did say or it changes into something that suits his purposes. So I'm going to write them down myself! Not to send to him, we aren't 'there' yet. But just so I remember my 'exact words' myself!

I'd just review it carefully and find some way to say that you reserve the right to 'adjust the boundaries' if you find it isn't doing what you intended it to do or it simply doesn't work.

My DH is supposedly going home on Friday, but I haven't confirmed that 'officially'. But he's already discounting one of the main boundaries I've said regarding possible reconciliation; being 'reliably sober for a period of time'. He's twisting the words to the point where he can discount it as 'being unreasonable'. But he won't specify what is unreasonable about it nor will he make a 'counter proposal' as to how he intends to prove that he really is embracing sobriety. Which of course makes me doubt that he intends to be sober at all. But I think his main reason is to get me home 'now' rather than allowing time to see how he does. He also said something about how 'slipping up now and again' doesn't count as not being 'reliably sober'. Really? I counts with me!!!

I think the reason he's so desperate to have me move home right away is because of the difficulty and expense I had getting my things out when I decided to get my own place. I think he figures I don't want to go through that again. He's right. I don't. That's why I'm making no plans to move back. Ever. I've told him let's sell the house, I stay put and you get a flat nearby, and we take it from there. So now he's putting multiple objects in the way of selling and portraying them as 'mine'. In reality 95% of the crap in the house is his. I got most of mine out 6 months ago. But when I point that out, he completely blows it off and keeps trying to make his shit my problem.

Ugh! Sorry for the derail. I guess I needed to vent.

You do whatever you need to do to protect yourself emotionally and physically. WE MATTER!!!

How long is a timeframe for you for him to be sober?

Across the pond!!
So is he currently sober now ? If he is and he's still playing all those games I'm
Really sorry !
You are really amazing you've made the break and are sticking to your guns which is admirable.
I know exactly what you mean about becoming addled about what has and hadn't been agreed it is impossible to remain rational!!

Penguins i really hadn't thought about a time frame. I suppose seeing previous posters on here who have said things went wrong very quickly has really influenced me. Plus I spent a lot of time planning how to not repeat last year. I am in an extremely negative frame of mind

@AcrossthePond55 you really do have your head on straight! You (and all of us here) know he is not in any way sober. Sobriety does not just mean 'not drinking'. It means a complete change of life choices, a complete acceptance that you do not have the off switch most people have around alcohol. It also means addressing the reasons why you drink. Anything else is just white knuckling it. My late husband did that too (and was rubbish at it).

Bless you @wouldratgerbeunknown

if he’s testing/pushing boundaries now that’s not a good sign

I don’t feel Ex truly accepts that he can’t drink ever again. He says he does sometimes, usually in immediate post rehab weeks, but then in relapses there is a whole lot of - everyone else drinks, why can’t I have a few glasses of wine of an evening and still see my kids, I’ve had longer periods of sobriety than most people will dream of, examples of fellow addicts who are single parents and their kids still live with them, I like a drink with my mates. No you don’t like a drink with your mates you liar, you need a drink at 7am, 11am, 3pm, 7pm, 10pm, midnight and then still withdraw over night. Grrr.

White knuckling was a real feature with my Ex too. Got him nowhere. Best stretch was a week. Max

Oh that sounds like ex

whiney voice

but you drink. You have a drink every weekend.

one drink isn’t going to harm

it’s not like I drink every day

it’s not fair. Everyone else does

my replies

I don’t drink every weekend /night. I work

its not one drink is it. That’s the issue. You can’t stop at one. Or you mean one bottle

Well you do if you have money

everyone else doesn’t do it and no life isn’t fair

@Nogoodusername mine lasted the 6 weeks he was in rehab, but only because they urine tested them every day. Then he did 2 weeks after coming out (pretty sure he actually didn't drink then). And once he relapsed, it was straight down the black hole to rock bottom again.

I assume they can’t buy or get booz smuggled in rehab @pointythings

You know, I haven't really even allowed myself to believe it's a real possibility. My son suggested 5 months without any 'slips'. I think at that point I'd be ready to talk about any possible future, but I don't know if I'll ever really trust him again. There's more than just his sobriety. After this time on my own I'm seeing that there were things that I accepted as part of our marriage that I wouldn't accept going forward. Those would need to be addressed too.

Thanks. I've been telling him pretty much that: being 'sober' (as in not having consumed alcohol) is not the same as 'sobriety' (acknowledging the addiction and waking up determined to not drink every. single. day).

White knuckling it is a very good way of putting it. It's unsustainable.

Oh, and I've told him that when you're in rehab/hospital with no access to alcohol, that doesn't count as 'sober'. That's forced sobriety not willingly chosen sobriety.

Nope, it was tight - and also twice daily urinalysis and if they were positive, they were out with no refunds.

Didn't do a damn bit of good for him though. But then he was still in that river in Egypt.

That's the problem with rehabs when the alcoholic really isn't 10000% committed and willing to do the follow through OR if they have unrealistic expectations of being 'cured' and never having to fight the urges again. If they walk out or if they relapse soon after release you've just wasted a tens of thousands (here in the US at least). You may as well have stacked those bills up and lit a match to them.

I reckon Ex spend about £50K on various rehab stints. Sober 3 weeks after one, same day after another, not sure the rage quit one even counts, and 7 ish weeks after another. The last one broke me. I had begun to hope.

My DH came back early from a one week NHS rehab, very pleased with himself that he'd got one over on the staff and somehow managed to smuggle in drink. I wasn't pleased that he'd come home in as bad a state as he'd gone in, but I was all out of hope by that time.

How did the ones who faked the urine test , get the booze

£50k

thud

@wouldratgerbeunknown crossing my fingers for you that Monday goes well. I am a great believer in letters. Even if they're not read, writing them can be cathartic.

That is so shit. My Ex left hospital where he was being detoxed while having other medical treatment, went out to smoke with a friend, and went and bought cider from the petrol station next door. While still on the damn benzos. I drove back to the hospital when the ‘friend’ told me and declared to the ward staff that he had been drinking while on the withdrawal meds bawling my eyes out. Doctor came out to see me etc. The pity on the nurses face as I retold the story bawling by the desk, honestly, like ‘why is this relatively sane woman putting up with this’ . I didn’t leave him then. wtf. I then didn’t leave him after he rage quit a rehab detox a couple of months later. Etc. he was on coke as well then too.

I know. He was financially well off when I met him. He and his ex wife were mortgage free from inheritance and so they divided the family home proceeds. He has burnt through so much of that on coke, booze, fags, writing off a car or two, legal fees, and all the rehab and other programmes. Bloody hell

Just for shits and giggles;

https://seasonsmalibu.com base $55k/mo more for a 'tailored program'

https://passagesmalibu.com base $80k/mo or more 'depending on your needs'

https://riseinmalibu.com base $90k/mo

www.hazeldenbettyford.org/rehab-treatment/inpatient-treatment $32k/mo

So you can see the 'range' in prices here in the US. Some can be as low as $15k for 30 days, but frankly you get what you pay for.

I'd say the average is 30-60k for a 30 day stay. And despite the website saying "We take insurance" there aren't many insurances out there that pay for rehab.

not that I have anywhere near £60k or even £6k

but I would be very pissed off if that was spent and then drank

Yes this is really important. I recently heard someone refer to a recovered alcoholic. Like that happens. Have worked hard here to hammer home that being in recovery is a lifelong thing. Hopefully it gets easier but we know here that a single night out would be life threatening. I would not stop the next day. It wouldn’t stop until all money was gone or there was a medical condition requiring emergency treatment.

That isn’t something you recover from. You can’t just test the waters. It’s a daily decision.

The other people in there were serious about getting clean and sober. It was a small local facility that took 10 people max, and my husband was the only one who didn't want to be there. I couldn't tell you what happens in other facilities.