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15
StabiaGirl · 17/06/2026 17:53

LlynTegid · 17/06/2026 13:20

I would have a separate category of car licence. Which you could only get after a period of a clean licence for a standard size of car, and have to meet extra requirements such as regular re-take of the theory test, eyesight and perhaps other tests.

Another option which is not of help here would be to place the burden of proof in a crash where an SUV or high performance car is involved that it is not the fault of the driver of the vehicle.

Agree with all that, however I believe that the burden of proof should be on the driver no matter the size of the vehicle. A Harley Davidson motorcyclist who knocks a cyclist, for example.

NeverDropYourMooncup · 17/06/2026 18:56

MaturingCheeseball · 16/06/2026 18:32

This sounds like a crap defence. Has she been shopping, on holiday, to the dentist? Or is she a complete recluse due to the epilepsy? Hmmmmmm.

Is there a Law I missed somewhere where it's illegal for anybody with epilepsy to attend medical and dental appointments, buy food or go on holiday with their family lest they lose their diagnosis and medication/monitoring now? They're things that pretty much everybody has to do in order to live whether they have epilepsy, other conditions or not.

nomas · 17/06/2026 19:54

MaturingCheeseball · 14/04/2026 16:10

At the time I was ferociously attacked on MN because I felt the driver had evaded justice and I still stand by this. But received many messages from people saying they thought so too.

I don’t think the police have been racist - rather, weak in the face of someone clearly lawyered-up.

Yes, I remember that people who expressed dismay at the speed at which it was all brushed under the carpet were attacked on MN for being insensitive to the driver.

Those who were angry at the lack of culpability had given up hope on behalf of the victims and their families.

nomas · 17/06/2026 19:55

Allisnotlost1 · 17/06/2026 16:27

If you mean were they also allowed not to sit in the dock, then yes.

The defendant is currently innocent, why not treat her fairly?

Parents are not required to sit in the dock so your point is moot.

TestTickle · 17/06/2026 19:56

GingerBeverage · 17/06/2026 14:39

Heavy SUVs can actually breech current rules.

Because these SUVs are so heavy, drivers need to be mindful of gross vehicle weight limits. In the UK, a standard Category B driving licence only permits you to drive vehicles weighing up to 3,500 kg (3.5 tonnes). 1]

Surely then their insurance is invalid too if they don't have the right licence

Was her car caught by this?

TestTickle · 17/06/2026 19:58

Allisnotlost1 · 17/06/2026 16:27

If you mean were they also allowed not to sit in the dock, then yes.

The defendant is currently innocent, why not treat her fairly?

I bet that if she was poor /working class she'd have been sat in the dock

Oftenaddled · 17/06/2026 20:59

TestTickle · 17/06/2026 19:58

I bet that if she was poor /working class she'd have been sat in the dock

Yes, probably. I suppose any concession like this depends on having the confidence and knowledge to request it, and that's going to depend partly on the quality of your legal team and your general expectations in life. And people do unfortunately often make concessions to people they see as more like them than others, so judges etc could be affected by that.

I don't see why anyone who isn't being charged with violence should be in the dock at this stage though.

likelysuspect · 17/06/2026 21:03

TestTickle · 17/06/2026 19:58

I bet that if she was poor /working class she'd have been sat in the dock

Well no that isnt the case, the vast majority of people that I work with and support are poor/criminal classes and its not unusual that people dont have to be in the dock if there is a reason not to be.

Allisnotlost1 · 17/06/2026 21:27

Oftenaddled · 17/06/2026 20:59

Yes, probably. I suppose any concession like this depends on having the confidence and knowledge to request it, and that's going to depend partly on the quality of your legal team and your general expectations in life. And people do unfortunately often make concessions to people they see as more like them than others, so judges etc could be affected by that.

I don't see why anyone who isn't being charged with violence should be in the dock at this stage though.

Anyone in her position would have a KC, and any KC worth the title would request her not to sit on the dock at a pre-trial hearing. I agree that having money will/has probably helped in a number of ways, but this probably isn’t one of them.

Allisnotlost1 · 17/06/2026 21:28

likelysuspect · 17/06/2026 21:03

Well no that isnt the case, the vast majority of people that I work with and support are poor/criminal classes and its not unusual that people dont have to be in the dock if there is a reason not to be.

Who are the ‘criminal classes’? JFC.

Allisnotlost1 · 17/06/2026 21:28

nomas · 17/06/2026 19:55

Parents are not required to sit in the dock so your point is moot.

Correct - just as the question was moot.

MyNameIsErinQuin · 17/06/2026 21:33

ScaredButUnavoidable · 01/05/2026 21:36

Tongue biting happens with nearly all tonic-clonic seizures (unconscious and convulsive seizures) and other partial seizure types too.

It’s the myth of swallowing the tongue that is old school.

Edited

My son has tonic clonic seizures, never bitten his tongue. Epilepsy comes in many shapes and sizes. It’s unpredictable and unless you witness a seizures, person may not know they’ve had one.

TestTickle · 17/06/2026 21:39

Allisnotlost1 · 17/06/2026 21:28

Who are the ‘criminal classes’? JFC.

I expect @likelysuspect was referring to Boris "lockdown parties" Johnson/Michelle "COVID entrepreneur" Mone / Andrew "sex trafficking " Windsor .....

Trampoline · 17/06/2026 22:09

MyNameIsErinQuin · 17/06/2026 21:33

My son has tonic clonic seizures, never bitten his tongue. Epilepsy comes in many shapes and sizes. It’s unpredictable and unless you witness a seizures, person may not know they’ve had one.

In this case, perhaps those witness statements will be interesting.

likelysuspect · 17/06/2026 22:22

Allisnotlost1 · 17/06/2026 21:28

Who are the ‘criminal classes’? JFC.

Well recidivists really, in and out of courts a lot. Most are very vulnerable so have lots of concessions in court when needed.

Allisnotlost1 · 17/06/2026 22:32

likelysuspect · 17/06/2026 22:22

Well recidivists really, in and out of courts a lot. Most are very vulnerable so have lots of concessions in court when needed.

Crumbs, what do you do?

Superhansrantowindsor · 17/06/2026 22:42

Im sure I read at the time she had suffered a medical episode that hadn’t happened before or since. But it seems she does have epilepsy so that does change things.

Oftenaddled · 17/06/2026 23:22

Allisnotlost1 · 17/06/2026 21:27

Anyone in her position would have a KC, and any KC worth the title would request her not to sit on the dock at a pre-trial hearing. I agree that having money will/has probably helped in a number of ways, but this probably isn’t one of them.

Glad to hear it - thanks for that information

MaturingCheeseball · 18/06/2026 09:09

NeverDropYourMooncup · 17/06/2026 18:56

Is there a Law I missed somewhere where it's illegal for anybody with epilepsy to attend medical and dental appointments, buy food or go on holiday with their family lest they lose their diagnosis and medication/monitoring now? They're things that pretty much everybody has to do in order to live whether they have epilepsy, other conditions or not.

You missed my point. Which was I assume that she has been to the dentist/doctor/day out whatever - but suddenly and rather conveniently her epilepsy precludes her from doing something….

Maybe she is a completely wronged person. But the “medical episode” defence is a bit handy and seems to be the go-to defence in a lot of cases now. See The Crash documentary; methinks that young lady may have had an easier ride in the UK with the medical defence.

likelysuspect · 18/06/2026 09:25

Allisnotlost1 · 17/06/2026 22:32

Crumbs, what do you do?

Frontline statutory work with families so there are high levels of criminality, parents in and out of criminal proceedings, not always incarcerated, but in and out of courts, breaching their probation a lot, more crime, round and round it goes. You cant keep up with it sometimes.

Oftenaddled · 18/06/2026 10:17

MaturingCheeseball · 18/06/2026 09:09

You missed my point. Which was I assume that she has been to the dentist/doctor/day out whatever - but suddenly and rather conveniently her epilepsy precludes her from doing something….

Maybe she is a completely wronged person. But the “medical episode” defence is a bit handy and seems to be the go-to defence in a lot of cases now. See The Crash documentary; methinks that young lady may have had an easier ride in the UK with the medical defence.

If stress triggers her epilepsy, which isn't unusual, she will have tried to do these things in ways that don't cause stress, or avoided them if she can't do that and they're not essential. Being in the dock in a case where there is such intense media interest would certainly be very stressful, probably more so than a visit to a GP or the shops for most people.

Allisnotlost1 · 18/06/2026 10:27

likelysuspect · 18/06/2026 09:25

Frontline statutory work with families so there are high levels of criminality, parents in and out of criminal proceedings, not always incarcerated, but in and out of courts, breaching their probation a lot, more crime, round and round it goes. You cant keep up with it sometimes.

And you refer to the people you work with as ‘criminal classes’. Good to know.

Allisnotlost1 · 18/06/2026 10:30

MaturingCheeseball · 18/06/2026 09:09

You missed my point. Which was I assume that she has been to the dentist/doctor/day out whatever - but suddenly and rather conveniently her epilepsy precludes her from doing something….

Maybe she is a completely wronged person. But the “medical episode” defence is a bit handy and seems to be the go-to defence in a lot of cases now. See The Crash documentary; methinks that young lady may have had an easier ride in the UK with the medical defence.

The purpose of the trial is to test the defence. The prosecution didn’t object to CF not sitting in the dock (which they can and do), so there must be some reasonable basis for the request, and no doubt they are also acting tactically.

youlooklikeaclown · 18/06/2026 16:16

BridgetJonesV2 · 17/06/2026 12:19

I would hope that this lady isn't on the roads still if her health is that fragile....

If CF had a seizure three weeks ago, and drove to Court she would not be driving legally. Agree with a PP, the defence should have a copy of her present epilepsy medication

Trampoline · 18/06/2026 19:01

It was reported that the driver voluntarily surrendered her license and cannot reapply for one until she is free of seizures for a year - that was back in 2024.

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