DD banned from NYC trip

[Chickenwinger]

Morning

DF (15) has been a pain at school recently I don’t dispute this. Last summer she went to France with the school and had a fallout with some friends. She responded by not following staff instructions:m/ being rude and the teachers had to call me.

there’s NYC trip later this year that she had signed up for. The Headteacher said he’d allow her to still go if she demonstrates positive behaviour between now and then.

last week she attended a day trip- a geography field trip. She had an another argument and basically walked off in the middle of the city as she sas upset. Staff located her promptly and it was clear that she’d been provoked by the other girl.

yesterday I received a call from the deputy head to tell me that her place on the New York trip has been cancelled. Apparently they aren’t confident that she’ll behave and staff aren’t willing to be responsible. They’ve refunded me way I’ve paid so far.

ste’s devastated and has cried all night. I can’t help but feel the school have been heavy handed. DH disagrees and thinks it serves her right!!

do I need to pursue this with the school as a complaint?

Complain? Quite the opposite.

You should be thanking them for showing her what a clear disciplinary boundary looks like.

And thanking them again for being kind enough to return your deposit.

"she’s devastated and has cried all night. I can’t help but feel the school have been heavy handed. DH disagrees and thinks it serves her right!!

do I need to pursue this with the school as a complaint?"

WHY would you complain? What do you hope to achieve from doing so? I think you need to have a ponder on that. Do you -

1. Want the school to change their mind and take her?
2. Want your daughter to feel you will fight for her?

If you want the school to take her to NYC - why? Why would you put the responsibility for her safety on them? Why are you not concerned for her safety given that she has form for flouncing off at the drop of a hat? Why are you willing to put her in danger, because she wants it?

If you want your daughter to feel you will fight for her - why? Has she flounced off from you too and you feel your relationship with your daughter is fragile? You say she "has been a pain at school recently" - just at school? Is she a pain at home too? Two possibilities, she's a pain at home too, or she isn't a pain at home. If she's a pain at home too, are you worried you being OK with NYC being cancelled will make her worse? If she isn't a pain at home, why not? Do you pander to her, constantly smooth her path - infantilise her? Or are you congratulating yourself on being a 'good mother' and secretly blaming the school for her behaviour because it only happens there?

I think you need to step back from "she's devastated" and stop allowing your actions to be dictated by her emotions. You are the adult, she is the child. Look at your child dispassionately for a minute. She overreacts and puts herself in danger by flouncing off in unfamiliar surroundings. She is rude to and disobeys those responsible for her safety. She therefore cannot be trusted in such settings not to put herself in danger, so the best option is for her not to be placed into such settings until such time as she matures enough to not behave like this.

Why does she flounce? This is an action that screams 'look at me!', makes the whole group revolve around her whilst the teachers have to stop what they're doing, pay less attention to the rest of the group and search for her. It's more 'attention-seeking' than 'upset'. Which is why I asked if you pander to her. A child who reaches 15 without a sense of consequences for her own actions usually is pandered to. Never told no. And here you are, willing to attack the school for not giving your daughter what she wants, regardless of why they don't want to take her.

You should by now know why my answer to your question is no. No, you should not complain to the school. No. Absolutely not. Your daughter must bear the consequences of her own actions. In modern parlance, FAFO. She Fucked About, and now she's Finding Out. And it could be the making of her. A short sharp lesson. Our job as parents is not just to care for them when they are children but also to raise children into functional independent adults. Part of that is letting them make their own mistakes, and learning from the consequences of their mistakes. Better to learn the lesson now and amend their ways so they don't hit a bigger lesson when the consequences can be more far-reaching.

Do the right thing. Comfort her, but sadly inform her that she won't be going to NYC after all, and that that is the consequence of her own behaviour and that you hope she will now learn from that.

Regardless of why dd is storming off school are correct.
They can’t keep her safe on this trip and taking her woukd compromise her safety and the staff ratio, so that of others.
This is a classic case of play stupid games, win stupid prizes. Your dd needs to learn that her own wants and needs do not always trump those of others.
Please don’t complain to school, you would be embarrassing yourself and showing DD that you will always support her poor behaviour

No, your daughter is very immature and I don’t think teachers want to risk another full meltdown and her walking out on the trip to NY. This will teach your daughter a lesson. I would be happy with the decision and you should take for what it is.

@NeedmoresleepVery few! Certainly few state schools.

Maybe. But i knew girls at my daughter's primary school who were generally considered to be a pain, who were diagnosed asd much later on. It's harder to spot in girls. I would at least be looking to support her as it's an extreme response.

Not gone well for the OP has this.

Would you want to be responsible for someone else’s children in a foreign city with unknown dangers - I would not. Add to the mix a teenager who won’t follow instructions and has a propensity to run off in a huff. No way. Why do you think other people should accept your DD ruining their trip because you haven’t taught her how to control her emotions? Absolutely right that she learns now people don’t want to spend time with unpredictable and untrustworthy people. Grow up and teach your daughter that she is responsible for her own behaviour and the consequences it brings.

Absolutely do not complain, no.
She has shown she can’t be trusted not to wander off and this could put herself in potential danger, and obviously mean staff could get in a lot of trouble if she were to wander off in another country. Even if someone provoked her on this occasion, she could have dealt with it there, not by wandering off.

I can’t help but think the school have been heavy handed

You’ve ruined her if this is genuinely what you think

The school and your dh are correct.

suspect this thread will be deleted as it’s not gone OP’s way, or this is a wind up

She knew the rules. She didn't follow them. This is the consequence. And OK, she was upset and she cried. So what? We're all upset and cry at some time in our life. Especially if we have done somethinge we regret.

The need to keep your emotions in check and to resist reckless and impulsive behaviour that breaks the rules is a fundamental life skill. She is going to need ir if she is going to succeed at almost anything. You need to help her with by supporting the school and showing a united front with your husband. And complaining? I can't even believe you suggested it!

I think a better way to approach it would be for her to think about how she could demonstrate she had learned the lesson to see if she can negotiate a reprieve due to a complete turnaround in attitude and behaviour.

😆👍

This isn't even a punishment. This is the school saying they cannot keep her safe which is 100% correct. Having worked on such trips previously, I would have simply refused to go if she was on the roster as my risk assessment would be that she would be a danger to herself. Imagine the outcomes for the teachers and the school if something happened to her. They could be struck off!

I don't think I ever had to call a parent about trip behaviour even for some very tricky kids. I know of a girl at another school who did a similar thing (running off then refusing to get on the bus when found) and the teachers were still talking about it years later as one of the worst things they ever had to deal with on a trip.

Her punishment for her terrible behaviour should come separately and maybe she will learn something.

Hopefully she will.learn from this. Behave or suffer the consequences.

Consequences have actions. Your husband is right and it sounds like you need to set firmer boundaries with your daughter.

Therapy for your daughter sounds like it would be beneficial and help her process her emotions.

Of course she's crying as she now facing the consequences of misbehaving on previous trips. If she is falling out with friends she needs to move away from them or tell a teacher not flounce off away from the entire group causing the trip to need to pause for the entire group whilst the teachers frantically search for her. No way they want to risk that in foreign city and they don't have to.

No, not heavy handed, huge risk for them and she's not shown any change

No! The teachers on this trip ( a long way from home) are responsible for a lot of kids, away from their parents and in a large city. Your DD has demonstrated that she is not responsible, starts arguments with other children and ignores warnings. If I was one of the staff on that trip I would not risk taking her. They have a duty of care to all the children.

Tell us exactly what you’d complain about, OP?

She is a liability and the school have done the right thing! Actions have consequences im afraid. Tough titty.

The apple doesn't fall far from the tree ? 😉

A teen with a propensity to walk off is a nightmare in the UK, let alone on a foreign trip to NY.

If you’re so desperate for her to go, YOU take her to NY.

I've run international school trips as well as day trips (secondary school) and this is absolutely not how they are run. The paperwork and risk assessments is significant and no one is ever 'having a wander' or texting teachers their location. There might be some free time built into a city trip, but it's built into the structure and an utterly crucial part of that is that the students go within certain parameters at a set time - never just going off as the fancy takes them. As a teacher you're responsible for their safety, and you have to know they will follow instructions at all times.

I went abroad with school back in the 90s and same thing - we were never given free rein. These days, with more stringent paperwork, it's even more ridiculous to expect this.