What should trans people actually do?

[BTT]

I'm making the assumption that gender identity exists and that there can be a mismatch between it and sex which will likely cause distress and a desire for trans people to find a safer and more comfortable place in society somehow.

I'm talking about practical measures to minimize problems for trans and non-trans people. Please respond only if you have some reasonable ideas.

Trans identified men are not all gay, plenty of them are attracted to women and call themselves lesbians

They should seek help for their mental health disorder... thinking your body is wrong is a mental health issue. Like anorexia.

I would ask what is meant by ‘reasonable’. TP are not some mass of people who all think the same. There are obviously some who want to be treated as if they are the opposite sex in all circumstances and won’t accept anything less, whilst others who don’t.

Without assuming gender identity is real, just as I am not required to believe God/Allah etc are real, trans people are perfectly entitled to live their lives precisely as they have done for decades: living, working, using single-use/unisex facilities in public or employment spaces, accepting that if anyone misgenders them it is not a capital crime but a person who has no interest in their personal movement or private lives - much in the same way that a muslim or jew or vegan has to navigate the world.

Ie understand that their private beliefs and opinions about themselves are of no interest and concern to other people, have no place [like politics] to be centred into every social or workplace interaction; and that religious preferences, cultural preference for halal/kosher/vegan foods is for them to police and monitor and no one else’s responsibility; and, yes, refrain from being abusive to - or threaten violence towards - people who do not share the same their perspective.

I think the majority of trans people are just trying to quietly go about their life and should continue to do so.

Absolutely. As long as they use the single sex provisions for their actual sex, and not their gender identity, whatever that is.

Also, they could try calling out some of the violent TRAs and say you don't stand for us.

And not to campaign to remove single sex services?

It would be helpful if these people made it very clear that they are not seeking to dismantle women’s sex based rights.

I am not hearing that from very many of them.

Don’t really care it’s nothing to do with me just don’t want men in women and girls spaces - that’s not a fix that should be available .

No response from the OP I see - how disappointing, given the importance of the topic.

I don't think you're "in a cult".

I DO think that your increasingly ludicrous, clearly untrue** contributions to MN are probably affected by your not actually believing that a person can change sex and that your child is "trans".

Otherwise who are you trying to convince as it isn't likely that it'll be anyone on FWR?

**".....horrific, often daily violence trans people - especially trans children - are forced to endure....."

It would be nice if they could stop threatening women who say no to them with death and rape.
It would also be nice if they could drop the perpetual victimhood claims that we all know are false.
Also it would be nice if they could accept that very few people will believe in their cult and that not seeing them as the opposite sex and objecting to the use of cis or non trans isn't denying their existence we just dont believe in their cultist beliefs.
However I very much doubt that they will do any of the above so why dont you ask them what they would be willing to do

If you relate to/ want to live with the clothes typically worn by either a woman or a man. Then wear them, they are all clothes. If you prefer long or short hair, or prefer to look androgynous, I’m 100% behind you.
If the dressing up is sexual / a fetish, keep it private.

If you don’t want the body you have and it distresses you. You want to make it look like a body of the other gender, I’d suggest specialised counselling over a period of time.
If you really can’t improve and are aware of the risks, have surgery/take hormones. However you have to know this is a body dysmorphia and you haven’t changed your biological sex.
I’m sorry you have struggled, I hope people are kind to you. Hopefully you can just live your life.

I really feel sorry for people, and mainly the parents, who bought into the ridiculous ideology that activists pushed relentlessly for a decade or so that it was possible, normal, desirable for people to be told they could transition or chnage sex. Someone really ought to be accountable. Those activists have done so much damage to famillies.

And now the realist majority are saying no, I'm sorry, this is ridiculous, we have the sad spectacle of parents who cant row it back, cant admit they were duped and can't admit their children have been damaged more. Sad, and cruel all round.

You haven’t changed sex, that is impossible.

Women are actual human beings with opinions and rights.

Disagreement does not equal hatred or wishing you dead or denying your existence. You are not Tinkerbell. Don’t listen to anyone who says it does because believing this will damage your mental health.

Respect others people’s rights.

You can solve your own problems

To add to that:

No one is "blaming" transwomen for male violence 🙄

All anyone is saying is that transwomen should be included on the "man" side in the mechanisms society currently has in place to protect women from men.

Yes these mechanisms are paltry and do not cover where women are arguably most at risk ie their own (fucking) home. That is a valid topic. But it's a different topic.

To the degree protections and mitigations do exist, transwomen should not be exempt from them simply because these men happen to call themselves women.

Well, in the case of natal males they could do with a change in attitude. For instance, they need to realise that their many formative years of male socialisation don’t magically disappear when they embrace their new gender identity, in fact they seem to cling to it quite enthusiastically, and it gives them a sense of undeserving entitlement that is very male coded. They also need to learn that demanding endless empathy from others is pretty bloody rich when they’re so shockingly poor at displaying empathy themselves (see my previous point about entitlement).
They may think they ‘feel like a woman’, and sometimes go to great lengths to look like one (with very mixed results), but their personalities certainly don’t pass.

"How can Christians and Muslims co exist?
I'm making the assumption that the Bible is the one true gospel ..."

"How can we cater to vegetarians? I'm making the assumption that a nutritious diet must contain meat..."

"How can we increase female participation? I'm making the assumption men care more about...."

My advice?
Stop making assumptions, be more curious, try and understand other people's view points. It's best to have these discussions in plain language with agreed terms.

Many of us provided possible solutions 10, 15+ years ago. We were vilified, some of us doxxed, costing a fucking fortune, all called the usual words

So now I, like many other women, have absolutely no interest whatsoever in being part of a solution.

Other than the issue raised by @BackToLurk about not allocating toilets by sexual orientation, you really should take a look at the men who claim they're lesbians (or 'transbians'). It's hideous.

Wear whatever they want, have their hair how they like it, do whichever jobs and hobbies most appeal to them, love and have sex with whoever they fancy, and who fancies them back.

Stay in spaces that align with their biological reality.

It’s not hard.

Therapy

I am certainly finding it difficult to understand the point of your post.

This is a very resonable post.

I do however think there is a nuance in that trans people are not just "being themselves", they are expressing themselves through inhabiting their idea of a group of people of whom they are not a member.

So when society accepts that as reasonable, it is saying something about how it sees those people as well.

To elaborate - wearing dresses as a man is totally fine. Wearing dresses as a man, stuffing the breast area to approximate a female shape and asking to be called a woman because you feel "like a woman" even if you don't use female-only spaces (and the female to male equivalent for transmen) is IMO problematic because validating that is validating that the transwomen's idea of "womanness" is a meaningful thing that has a connection to the actual lived existence of women.

It's kind of like if someone feels they express themslves best by adopting a persona as a "red indian*", giving themselves an "Indian" name and wearing "Indian" clothes. It's not that they themselves are necessarily anything but genuinely expressing how they see themselves, but the thing they feel is still a made up, reductive cultural represention of a diverse group of people, and those people have every right to object to society accomodating other people adopting an offensive and reductive version of them they thought had been long rejected.

*- I use that offensive phrase deliberately and precisely as a clear analogy. "Red Indians" never existed. "Red Indian" is a trivialising cultural construct imposed onto what was actually a diverse group of culture indigenous to North America. One can no more dress as or name oneself as "A Red Indian" than one can dress up as or name oneself as "A Woman"

I dont know OP, what did them men suggest when you posted this on a male centric forum? I mean I'm assuming you have, and you're not so sexist that you think solving societies problems is for the "woman gender" to provide on demand?