How to respond he/she?

[Manchesteruser]

Out with friends. One friend's son has a TIM friend. Obviously male but fake boobs and wearing a dress, about 25. Everyone refers to him 'as she'. I asked one, 'why do you refer to him as 'her/she' rather than 'he' and was told that that was what he prefers.

How would you have responded?

I’m a bit confused by this. Are you saying being gay is a lifestyle choice? (‘Isn’t an observable fact’ suggests that. Or being gay isn’t a lifestyle choice? (The comment about homophobia suggests that).
Anyway, same-sex attraction absolutely is observable. To take one of your phrases, maybe educate yourself about the science on that?

Names - I don't give a damn. Pronouns though - "she" for women and girls, "he" for men and boys. You know that right? And trans people know that. It's why they want people to use the opposite pronouns for them. If pronouns weren't important, if they didn't signify sex, then trans people wouldn't care what pronouns people used for them. They want other people to lie in order to prop up their self-image.

I think she was expressing her thoughts about this rather than actually demanding anything.

Being same sex attracted can be verified objectively and does not require society to affirm.
Feeling born in the wrong body is a belief just like a religion. Some genuinely believe they have changed sex but evidence shows that transwomen represent a very high % of sex offender. Which suggests that there is a sexual correlation or causation. Its a fetish for many.
I dont go along with the demands to use specific pronouns I DONT SHARE THEIR BELIEF and #being kind helps no-one. Reinforces beliefs that they are “passing” and inevitable problems when they are not affirmed.
I wont use pronouns because I don't believe its kind to woman/girls to support womanface. It reminds me of the Black and White Minstrel Show where it was OK to grossly insult Black people by wearing black make up.

You did want to be confrontational because why else would you ask? You can clearly see why they call him a she

False. Given Its legally considered discrimination & harassment to misgender at work according to the judgement in the Maya Forstater case shows that reproductive biology is irrelevant to pronoun iusage.

The judgement noted:[8][41]

Just as the legal recognition of civil partnerships does not negate the right of a person to believe that marriage should only apply to heterosexual couples, becoming the acquired gender 'for all purposes' within the meaning of GRA does not negate a person's right to believe, like the claimant, that as a matter of biology a trans person is still their natal sex. Both beliefs may well be profoundly offensive and even distressing to many others, but they are beliefs that are and must be tolerated in a pluralist society.

The summary went on to say:

This judgment does not mean that those with gender-critical beliefs can 'misgender' trans persons with impunity. The Claimant, like everyone else, will continue to be subject to the prohibitions on discrimination and harassment under the [Equality Act].

It's only harassment if you do it repeatedly after being asked not to.

Please read, I said a state AND a lifestyle. You also have conveniently ignored all the points that I have made, including my previous post, that you can't defend.

Oh and being accused of trans phobia has no effect on me, or I should imagine anyone else on this thread, anymore. It's completely meaningless.

Clearly the inference is biology is irrelevant however you need to twist it.

It really isn't. If you're inferring that, that's a you problem. The judge was merely saying that upsetting people repeatedly can be harassment, and i agree with that.

hence refusing to use pronouns at all for transpeople, just using the name, they have no legitimate right to get cross about that.

But you can't misgender trans people being the point. And why is that if biology reigns supreme over pronoun usage as you claim? Because it clearly doesn't.

Not harassment if you do it once. And totally permissible to not validate the identity as long as you do the necessary linguistic gymnastics. Now I don't think i should have to do that, but I have and will. It'll be a cold day in hell before I call a man 'she'.

You aren't (or can't) listening. Why is misgendering harassment & discrimination if biology is the only qualification for pronoun usage? Because it isn't.

Mate, I lived through the 80s. Right wingers complaining that gay people had "stolen that word" was the least of it.

Your objections to trans people using the pronouns which describe them aren't anything other than recycled bigotry.

his name.

Hope that made you feel better, hun. And that your life improves.

It seems you don't really understand.

But, well, I'm not really interested in swapping abuse. I did smile at "Try educating yourself". I'm sorry you feel so bitter.

"lovely" men don't go about pretending to be women

The pronouns that describes a man who says or thinks he is a woman are he, him and his.

Trans people can misgender themselves till the cows come home, but nobody else is obliged to play along.

Bigotry, which is defined as intolerance and prejudice, is equally applicable to all those demanding that everyone must act as though they believe humans can change sex.

Obviously they do. As some women dress as mine.

Complete nonsense

Pronouns have always been used to indicate sex.

To confuse that causes problems for women - are people incapable of thinking through second order consequences?

Take this example. Imagine a trans-identifying man who accesses the women's changing rooms. Two different ways of describing the same event

She went into the women's changing rooms and took her clothes off in front of the women present ('preferred' pronouns)

He went into the women's changing rooms and took his clothes off in front of the women present (correct sex pronouns).

If you came across those sentences in a news report, they'd evoke very different reactions, right?

Now tell me, which one actually conveys what's happening clearly? Which one is most useful for safeguarding the women in question?

@TransParentlyAnnoyed basically, you want society to be reorganised around the wishes of your child. That's not how life works.

Being gay is a sexuality which is widely agreed to be developed during childhood/ adolescence and unlikely to change (my daughter is a lesbian btw). Being 'trans' is an identity widely regarded as fluid (hence detransitioners and people changing their gender identity repeatedly). Being gay doesn't require hormones, surgery and society to rearrange itself around your belief system. Being trans is a mental illness/dysphoria which demands medical intervention to affirm the illness not psychological counselling to resolve the dysphoria. It has resulted in the mutilation of thousands of children and young adults over the past 10-15 years through the administration of powerful drugs and surgical alteration of their bodies. The outcomes are not good. It has been seized on by fetishistic men who enjoy violating women's boundaries. Transgenderism is a horror and the op has every right to not want to affirm someone's delusions.

Wow! Patronising much

Given that we don't really inhabit the world of 1984 Big Brother, (not quite anyway), I will not kowtow to lies and deceit, and I refuse to be an enabler or audience to male fetishes, given that they harm women and girls. I have never called a man "she" nor will i ever. Literally the hill i would die on.