A little piece of insight

[Tandora]

Into a topic so woefully misunderstood.

This is exactly the point.

If the concept is rejected completely, then there is never a need to acknowledge the harm to female people that your personal position has contributed to. The person rejecting the concept can stay cosily within their chamber of righteous belief and never have to believe the words of the people they are directly contributing to being harmed.

I hadn’t seen it as clearly as on this thread before with Tandora. But it was always there.

Also still waiting to find out how Dr Upton would know which treatment protocol to give a child suffering from ALL? One based on the child’s gender identity or on their biology? And if he doesn’t know, he should not be allowed to practice as a doctor.

being noble and and virtuous, a morally excellent character

I understand what the word means, I was wondering what it was in my argument to inspire a perception that I might think, or someone might think, that it was "righteous".

Can you accept , however, the reality of trans experience as described in the OP. That's all I'm am asking you to do.

No.

For those who hadn’t realised, this thread was an opportunity to lecture and to shame people.

That was the insight that was offered. It was never going to be anything else. However, there are some cracking posts from women who fight for women and girls on this thread. It is never a waste to read them.

However, the cycle will just continue.

Plus ca change.

FOTTFSOFATFOSM

Thank you for your honesty. It is this kind of denial/ refusal which I think is essential to combat, before any remotely reasonable conversation can be had about how the appropriate boundaries of rights , services and facilities for trans people.

It’s an accurate description of what you did in response to Taztoys post. Maybe you should ask for that post to be removed.

this thread was an opportunity to lecture and to shame people

thats mightily rich.

nope I made one mildly sarcastic comment in a conversation about how to use language to request a female doctor and not risk receiving a trans woman.
I have been subject to the usual disgraceful pile on of bullying, wild insults and personal attacks.
But all it does is expose the true character of this movement.

it is my earnestly held belief that that’s exactly what you did.

and it causes me distress.

If you define helping as 'lying to, medicating and mutilating', it's turning confused children into a human shield - obviously these poor vulnerable kids were born in the wrong body and must use the facilities of their new gender, and after that you've no argument for keeping adult male fetishists out.

Done properly, helping confused children is telling them the truth, getting them proper therapy to explore their distress, and refusing to mutilate healthy bodies. And then men aren't helped to invade women's spaces. Win-win.

And this is the thing.

A poster wanted to have a lovely discussion about the theory and the philosophy about believing someone is what they say they are. While trying to avoid the practical application.

Women saying ‘no’ to male people is just so messy… it must be so nice to be able to live in the privilege of never having to deal with the realities that your wonderous belief in philosophical theory.

Thanks OP for showing us just how that is done.

Umm no. I disagree. You have belittled and dismissed women’s trauma, mocked rape survivors, pontificated and attempted to bully women into sharing your viewpoint and refused to listen to any other viewpoints. As I said, you may not mean to come across as a hectoring bully but that is what I am getting from your posts.

Yet that is exactly what you did.

So insightful.

Or perhaps this type of honesty needs to be considered for what it is - an immovable line that we will not cross. And one which the law supports and reinforces.

It is not us that need to change. It is people like you who need to understand that we will not compromise on this. That our belief in biological fact is immutable.

It’s the first time I’ve realized it. I’m still processing. It really is a stunning realization. So many things about why TRA think what they are doing is okay are starting to become clear.

well simply not true and completely outrageous. But it tracks with your other fantasies as expressed on this thread

Can you accept , however, the reality of trans experience as described in the OP. That's all I'm am asking you to do.

Can I accept a child can feel distress about their sex? Yes.

Job done.

But that was not what this thread was about.

Thinking about this - I believe everyone, women, men, children, is harmed when society decides to enshrine a lie about something as basic and universal as sex.

We all depend on truth if we are to place trust in any of the institutions of society. Destroying truth, and trust, is evil.

Is it though? As I said, that may not have been the impression you meant to give but it certainly what I have taken from your posts. You have however given me a great insight into the mind of a TRA so Thankyou.

An immovable line of denial of reality. It has to be crossed because reality is not going to change.

The problem is, you used a ridiculous quote. It wasnt insightful, it was the ramblings of someone who couldnt cope with the fact that their feeling dont change reality.

Its impossible to change sex, a man can never know what it is to be or feel female, and a woman doesnt know what it feels to be male.

A man can want to be a woman, but wanting isnt the same as being.

Thats the kindest way to interpret their feeling and demands. Tough, adults have to realise that they cant always get what they want.

You seem to think thats saying men truly believe they are women is meaningful. It isnt. Either these men dont know what women means, or they have decided they can change the definition of words.

That makes them a bit dim, or someone with a god complex. Why are you humouring these people?

To be far, it is usually a wheedling male poster who can never acknowledge the distress of female people. As I said, I understood it with the OP before, but it was never so clear. And in their own words.

Operation: Let them speak!

It was very apt today.