NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #39

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence will be 28 July and then there will be 2 days of submissions from counsel meaning that the hearing will end on 30 July.

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.
Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions were provided here:

drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Links to previous threads #1 to #29 can be found in the header of thread #30.

Thread 30: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5375337-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-30
Thread 31: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5375819-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-31
Thread 32: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5376072-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-32
Thread 33: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5376608-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-33
Thread 34: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5377387-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-34
Thread 35: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5377598-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-35
Thread 36 mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5378031-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-36
Thread 37: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5378200-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-37
Thread 38: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5378463-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-38

Honestly if my emails deleted after 30 days I wouldn't even have answered some of them

Is it just me or have BBC avoided use of pronouns?
They say Dr Searle and She but its Dr Upton, Dr Upton, Dr Upton!

My NHS emails never permanently delete either. And as PP's, I have to manually delete them from the deleted fiolder.

A line from one of the HR emails:

"Let's see what is documented in the risk assessment."

😆😆😆😆

Poor deluded fools...

Ex-NHS Fife here, and definitely no automatic deletion of emails during my time.

Emails SHOULD be deleted according to retention policy (which varies depending on what the email is about) but it's not forced through any automated process, or certainly wasn't when I worked there.

Also possible for M365 administrator to recover deleted emails. https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/exchange/recipients-in-exchange-online/manage-user-mailboxes/recover-deleted-messages

And going back to the 'Re:' email subject discussion, it's usually possible to see if an email is a reply by looking at the email headers. Was there not talk of an IT forensics type person being questioned at some point?

As NC herself pointed out, at the mention of the name Rhianna KS looked shocked. Then cried.

The BBC story headlined "Consultant spoke to trans row witness despite warnings" is on the UK page of BBC News for me, below the Features and Analysis section, under the More from the UK header
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk

Sorry not a hope in hell on getting fully caught up on yesterday or today, I've had to dip in and out and have missed pages and pages. Has anyone with bundle access transcribed the foot in mouth email? If so can anyone tell me where it can be found.

Haven’t seen it myself yet and I’ve been keenly watching out for it.

Thought 7 years was the commercial "norm" for any records.
Would have thought it would be longer where medical records are essential to the care of the individuals.

That’s for financial records. medical records are kept separately from emails ie emails aren’t part of that record. If anything arises in emails it would been to be written in a report and added to the patient file.

My read is that what KS was referring to was that emails in the waste bin are automatically deleted after 30 days - not from your inbox — which implies she tries to delete it.

@Appalonia thank you

no wayyyy! She's nowhere near cunning or quick enough. All that talk about how kind and brave she thinks she is...I'm afraid she might be a Gryffindor (but one of the rubbish ones like Percy when he betrayed everyone then came crawling back with his tail between his legs)

The Times reporting very clearly that, based on testimonies, SP's crimes are leaving the changing room when Upton entered. Let that sink in - women are required to remain in a workplace changing room when a man enters or they'll be sanctioned:

www.thetimes.com/uk/scotland/article/sandie-peggie-trans-row-nurse-6vmvz6wd6

Self-IDing Hufflepuff, surely?

Thanks. It sounds like it will be a very interesting read so I hope someone will be hunting for it in the bundle and copying it out. I didn't go into KS day thinking the 'smoking gun' email would be eclipsed by the 'dripping with blood, covered in finger prints' email. They really should have thought of a better hiding place than down the back of the sofa.

good shout.

Haikus for the sensible HR Department at NHS Fife

We've seen doctors lie
Under oath and hide emails.
Unedifying.

The only people
With seemingly any sense
Are those in HR

Yeah my experience is in local authority/ central gov. I'm a bit out of step now but a 30 day auto deletion would be utterly insane.

Archive. https://archive.ph/eza8Y

For KS-

‘your worst sin is that you have destroyed and betrayed yourself for nothing.

Fyodor Dostoevsky

She's ageing backwards as the truth comes out, I swear.

I honestly think they have given up on winning they know there is no chance of that, now they are just out to smear SP as much as possible so even when they lose they can point the finger and say ‘LOOK SHE’S A BAD PERSON’ !

That’s exactly what I was just thinking.

I've used speech to text as well and it also messed up unless I spoke very clearly and slowly (which people don't always do) so I can see why they still use stenographers.

I would have thought they would have access better tech than the apps I use though. The transcription app on my phone is quite impressive but it still makes mistakes.