Is anyone else surprised that so-called feminists still think that TWAW?

[AnnaQuayInTheUk]

Several friends who have been quite pro TWAW in the past are today posting all over social media that they are devastated by yesterday's ruling, that they are Trans Allies, that TERFs should be truly ashamed etc etc.

These are women who also describe themselves as feminists. I thought they'd be lying low today, or maybe even giving a measured response to the ruling, but it seems to have triggered them into an extreme of Trans allyship.

I'm having to hold myself back from.descending into a slanging match with them.

Is it possible to be a feminist and believe that TWAW or should you stop claiming that title if you won't accept the SC ruling?

Does the ruling now mean that trans men must use the female bathrooms? Or is it just trans women that need to change?
Can any man now enter a female space and say he’s a trans man?

Men are just men. There's no difference.

At least you seem to be acknowledging they are men now - which is the point of the Supreme Court ruling.

Laws are not made or interpreted solely on the basis of the experiences of you and your friends. Although given your zealotry on this subject who knows if women you know would even tell you if they had a bad experience with a trans identified man. Would you even acknowledge it?

Because transmen are women.

It seems Micaela had to edit the post because even the subconscious of deeply committed trans activists knows that they are men in reality.

I've checked out my SM today and interestingly just the one post about being a trans ally, which has only had a couple of likes. And as an aside of all my TWAW lesbian friends not one of them has dated a TW. Just saying.

Oh. Micaela must have edited it really quickly.

My fault, I bit too soon and she had time to edit. But to her credit, she did say she'd edited. Although we can see that anyway by pressing the edited button under the post, I think people forget that.

I've had to bring out my bingo card on a couple of threads now but I think this is the fastest it's filled up. It's actually quite impressive in a bizarre way.

well said. I’ve been thinking about the seal clapping hand maidens and their next move. Genuinely believe as companies desert trans & the money drains away, the screamers will be less and less interested and eventually abandon ship. Also Gen Z - the younger trans community are growing up and likely growing out of the social contagion. I think the no of trans identifying youth will fall, and so will the cringey allyship.

still, no body should ever forget how far they got and what they achieved -

men in elite womens sport
a rapist in female prison
kids having surgeries
decimation of lesbian identities and spaces

everyone should be cautious forever

PMSL at that telling error. Funniest point of the thread.

A few friends have been allysplurging all over their social media today. Loudly and colourfully and dramatically. But the thing is ... It's very few. Pretty much the usual suspects. The vast majority have not mentioned it. I reckon that vast majority agree with the ruling, but don't feel safe saying so. I sure as hell don't. Only one friend has done so and she was hounded off Twitter a few years back.

Hmm, an old American study, based in America and not at all representative of the situation in the UK. Mind you, as getting a double take as they get on the bus is considered a violent hate crime by tansw....

Transwomen have:

• attacked lesbians for saying they won’t sleep with male-bodied penis-havers, no matter how they identify in their heads. These attacks are sometimes physical, such as punching, rushing at or pushing lesbians marching in Pride marches around the world. Plenty of video evidence.
• Coerced and intimidated lesbians by invading OLD and physical spaces and demanding that they be included in dating pools. No, your ‘Ladydique‘ is not a female organ, it’s a run of the mill cock and balls. No, it doesn’t have a different mouthfeel because you ‘feel’ like a woman. These and a lot worse are said to lesbians a lot. Plenty of evidence again.
• attacked women of any sexuality for saying biological sex (not gender) is important in medical, legal and social contexts.
• these attacks include doxxing, rape and death threats, bullying and mobbing in the workplace. Plenty of evidence.

Who’s been doing the bullying?

I think you might be right.

I haven't put anything on social media about the ruling as I value my job too much. Several of my colleagues have posted about how outraged they are by the ruling but they haven't had much engagement from others.

Iit will be very interesting to see if anything changes at work. My employer is always pushing the TWAW agenda. One of my former colleagues was bullied out of her job for refusing to toe the line.

I’ve seen a few posts on social media but mostly silence., and what I’ve seen has been from the usual suspects. Including the woman who peaked me in the first place back in 2015 by drawing my attention to Germaine Greer’s ‘horrifying’ comments that TWAM.

As someone said earlier, if you haven’t got it by now, and understood that this is a men’s rights movement that disadvantages and endangers women, then you never will.

I think it’s only a matter of time -days, probably- before we move on to the predictable posts claiming ‘It’s started. I/my friend/my neighbour’s granny’s third cousin twice removed/ was thrown out of a female toilet yesterday by evil t**fs because of short hair/tallness/masculine clothing. See! We told you this ruling would hurt ALL women!’

This is not true. 2-3 women are murdered by a man EVERY WEEK in the UK.

And even if it were true that trans women are just as much at risk, so what? It doesn't make women and trans women a coherent grouping.

Funnily enough since the ruling I spotted a couple of transwomen on public transport and thought to myself, “Oh, a transwoman.” Then I got on with my day glad that the law meant I didn’t spend the rest of the day gaslighting myself over wrong thinking. Did I rush up to yell abuse at them? Did I do that before the ruling? Nope. Hyperbole gets short shrift here. We were discussing the recognition of women’s rights having parity under the EA as it always intended.

Sure, but he'd be much less likely to get away with it than before, when he could enter any female space and say he's a trans woman.

My feeds are mostly full of men explaining why
the SC ruling is “devastating “.
iIn fairness to them, they do acknowledge that we should probably still have conversations about women’s spaces and safety but are clear this comes secondary to the rights of men. Or trans women, if using their preferred language.

I do not want to have a conversation with men about my rights, I just want those men to STFU and respect them.

@MsBette I'd be tempted to say something like, "Now the Supreme Court has confirmed that it is both reasonable and legal for women to have single sex spaces, the conversation needs to move on to how to accommodate trans people without interfering with women's rights. Perhaps you can be part of that conversation."

@MissScarletInTheBallroom it’s certainly brought into sharp focus where, on their list of priorities, they see women’s rights. Important, but not that important.

And you’re right. Being part of that conversation hasn’t occurred to them.

My DP plays tabletop war games and is in a lot of groups which attract mostly men. On his feed he’s had some men discussing this and he pointed out that one person had attracted a lot of comments back and forth and all 60-odd people were men. Only female name, and was a TW.

But he was quick to point out the irony of all these men pontificating over women’s spaces and talking about ‘trans inclusion’ without any women’s voices involved.

I honestly don’t know how you put up with your Facebook friends and their patronising ‘look how Trump influences the world’ outlook @Delphinium20and I hope you know you have my sympathies, but I hope you pointed out to them that Mumsnet feminists were already on to this when Trump was still a reality show host.

A lot of this going on in a women & girls Facebook group I'm in (am I allowed to mention the group name?). It sure has quickly turned into being all about TWAW on there this week. The mention of bio women is increasingly getting shit down already. It's so exhausting!