Anyone else worried Trump’s advocacy of gender-critical views taints and discredits them?

[PotteringPondering]

I’m gender-critical, and was pleased when Trump issued his early Executive Orders on Protecting Children from Chemical and Surgical Mutilation, and Keeping Men Out of Women’s Sports.

But now… everything else. The sickening bullying of Zelensky and support for Putin, the threats to invade allies, the insults, lies, laziness, lawbreaking, cruelty and incompetence.

I’m concerned the fact Trump is an advocate of gender-critical views taints and discredits them in the eyes of thinking people. The verdict of history may be harsh because of the Trump connection.

I’m a resident of Terf Island, and still passionately hold GC views. But the support of Trump and Vance is starting to feel less like a blessing, more like a kiss of death.

Which includes being misrepresented by plenty of so-called feminists. I honestly don't know what the word feminist means any more. I'm definitely not a feminist if it involves falling over backwards to give away women's rights to men and massive safeguarding fails wrt children

This is a perfect post. The argument always seems to be we should just give up the fight and return to the loving embrace of the 'progressives'. We are the sane ones here and poll after poll in the UK show that the public, including pluralities of lib dem and labour voters and young voters, agree with us.

What is your definition of transphobic? What is your definition of Nazism? JK Rowling has been accused many, many times of being both, yet she is neither, just because people make accusations about you it doesn’t make it true.

I don’t believe anyone is born in the wrong body, I don’t believe that there are any trans children, I don’t believe people can change sex, and I definitely don’t believe that TWAW because they are MEN, am I transphobic?

I don’t want men in women’s spaces, refuges, sports or prisons, I don’t want children to be prescribed life changing and irreversible medication or for ND teenage girls to have their healthy breasts removed, am I transphobic? People call others all sorts of things when they refuse to comply with their wishes, especially women, it’s as old as time and I couldn’t care less what people think.

‘One way of doing this is to acknowledge that Trump holds his views but that doesn't mean that we agree with the majority of his other policies.’

I may be wrong but that is EXACTLY what the majority of us on this thread have been doing!!

https://deadwildroses.com/2019/10/07/handy-venn-diagrams-the-radical-feminist-position-on-gender/

The Trump administration loves gender stereotypes just as much as gender ideology believers love gender stereotypes.

It's so tiring having to repeatedly point out that it's not simply a choice between the misogyny of the right or the misogyny of the left. It's feminist board FFS. Surely our aim is no fucking misogyny at all?

I agree. I made the original comment at the top of the thread.

The diagram doesn't show how these beliefs translate.

For example, conservatives may believe in physical sex which cannot change. Some think that the sporting issue doesn't matter because they think that sport is unfeminine and shouldn't be encouraged. Trans ideologies also think that the sporting issue doesn't matter, but not because of the physical sex issue.

You basically have layers and layers of outcomes on top of the belief layer, and if you created a diagram to intersect them, you wouldn't have the three ideologies stacked on top of each other - they would be all over the place.

And so there is plenty of space for feminists, or at least people who consider themselves to be feminists, to take up positions that don't seem reason to other feminists.

I think that there are still some people on social media and in real life who will continue to try to undermine the efforts of women regardless of the tone, the actions and the words that women say. All because they, personally, tend towards tribalism even when they will flat out deny that they do.

They will be affronted at the suggestion, yet the outcome of what they say, do and post themselves does reflect that tribalism.

Telling women's groups that they should also 'denounce' Trump while still trying to work with Trump's team seems to me to be an overly simplistic view on how campaigning works. And women shouldn't have to be constantly justifying their stance in fear that some groups that already have misrepresented our political alignment may continue to do so. Particularly since we are also confident that this issue negatively impacts all families and women across the political spectrum and this is reflected in the opinion polls.

Edit: Of course, I agree with you.

Some people can’t function without a tribe of some sort. People who are tribal find it extremely frustrating having conversations with people who think critically and don’t need a tribe, I had it in my family growing up, especially with my father and two of my older brothers, because I didn’t comply with their rigidity of thinking, and had my own opinions, I was called stupid or awkward or difficult. The plain fact was I didn’t agree with them, and their failure to make me comply made them very angry. The fact that I was female didn’t help!

14. Women have all the rights they need: The right to remain silent.

Yeah, I am actually unsure of what people mean when they say MAGA types, or conservatives, are transphobic, I a way that GC people are not.

Of course individuals vary, there are surely MAGA types that are fundamentally haters. But then, I've occasionally met GC people who were misandrists too - both seem more of an individual thing to me.

Even people like Matt Walsh, who is supposedly the epitome of the transphobic type, as far as I can see has the same fundamental issues with gender ideology:

It is scientific nonsense
It is dangerous for women and undermines women's rights
It is dangerous to children, psychologically and physically
It involves medical malpractice
It is being used as a vehicle for anti-social sexual behaviours
And even - it is bad for the people who have bought into it and identify as transgendered.

I'm really not seeing a fundamental difference here. I think that does, in fact, make people on the left who believe "being good" is inherently left wing, and that people on the right must be evil in some way, very, very uncomfortable. And that's the origin of a lot of these threads.

Okay, I'm American, lesbian and a lifelong libertarian-conservative.
The obsession here is Trump's personality. No one cares, we're not dating him. He just gave back women's rights and sports and isn't afraid to withhold Federal dollars to make states, like Maine fall in line.
He's shut the border and shipped out illegal hard-core gang members and now the foreign students on visas who were running and participating in university shut downs and anti-Semitism. He's cutting government fraud and waste.
All of which the Democrats oppose. Their popularity has sunk to 26%. Lowest ever recorded.
In the US Trump is very popular.

Their popularity has sunk to 26%.

This is just wild.

12. Women’s ability to recognize male behavior patterns is misandry.

And what's a woman's ability to recognize female behavior, then?

Nobody cares because it's just about women😂

Quite

"men are afraid of hurt feelings, women are afraid of men killing them"

A lot of what UK/Europe/rest of world worry about with Trump are behaviours a lot of Americans would view as positive for America. Whether such blinkered American-centric policies work out for America in the longer term remains to be seen but they produce winning rhetoric at the moment.

So why did you bring it up? Are you implying that there are no women like that? Or that it isn't an example of an individual belief rather than something intrinsically connected to being GC?

Not at all.

The extraordinary thing is not that Trump is a sex realist.

The extraordinary thing is that the Democrats are not.

Because women are not allowed to defend themselves. You are perfectly demonstrating Bewilderness's rules of misogyny on this subject.

Women not being allowed to name themselves. They are not allowed to name males patterns of abuse which have evidence to back up the fact they are sex based. Instead they are smeared for doing so as unreasonable and nasty.

Women have legitimate reasons to be concerned on these issues.

This 👆💯

I was talking about the reason people on the political right have a problem with gender ideology.

I don't know what you are talking about because it seems to have zero to do with my post.

Wow. I hadn’t been following the trend for support polls. That 25% is a remarkable drop!!

Yes! I like the way you put this. I was trying to figure out what exactly irks me about the Elon Musk’s son story that just came out. Why should I even care? But it does bother me so I guess that’s it. It’s that he is a dude. A guy! But I’m being asked to pretend he’s a young woman. And I just don’t want to. I don’t know exactly why I don’t want to but bottom line is, I don’t. It’s probably something primal to do with self preservation as men are so inherently dangerous for women and we need to be able to pick them out of a line up. And the trans brigade wants to tell me I’m a bad person because of that. So yes, I think for many people it’s the minor irritation even if it doesn’t massively impact them in everyday life, that’s enough to make this issue count politically.