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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Is there any future you'd accept for trans people?

1000 replies

AYoungTransWoman · 17/03/2025 12:46

Hello, I'm a young trans person who transitioned in my teens. I've been on hormones my entire adult life, have a GRC and will have Gender Reassignment Surgery imminently.

Is there any future you would accept for people like me who have gone through everything?

OP posts:
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21
Wellee · 17/03/2025 23:24

Why are you scared about what has been and not looking forward?

Merrymouse · 17/03/2025 23:25

Helleofabore · 17/03/2025 23:16

And this argument:

'For example women and children are most at risk by a mile from their own partners and families (both in terms of murder, violence and rape). Trans women in toilets and strangers in bushes are red herrings to distract us from the very real danger that your own husband or partner (statistically & theoretically speaking) poses to you and your kids and other women and children around you.'

This argument above ignores the situation when that abusive husband or partner is one of the very people with a transgender identity that female people wish privacy and safety from when they go into a female single sex space.

Or have you forgotten about that intersecting group?

I know of at least a couple of women who have described having to have their ex-husbands or ex-partners just continue their abusive behaviour by being in the much needed single sex space with them. Or do you think that those female people's needs should be dismissed as unimportant too?

It's amazing how many women claim to have have been sexually assaulted/flashed/groped by complete strangers. Are the silly women just imagining it?

hihelenhi · 17/03/2025 23:25

For example women and children are most at risk by a mile from their own partners and families (both in terms of murder, violence and rape). Trans women in toilets and strangers in bushes are red herrings to distract us from the very real danger that your own husband or partner (statistically & theoretically speaking) poses to you and your kids and other women and children around you.

No, it is disingenuous of you to attempt to claim that the women here ONLY care about "trans women - aka men - in women's toilets" and don't notice or care about domestic violence or the higher prevalence of, as you say "the very real danger that your own husband or partner poses". We understand the statistics, you see.

Where we differ is that we see it ALL as the misogyny it is and don't make the silly exception YOU choose to for men who id as women. Who have been busily dismantling many of the rights women fought for to protect against ALL misogyny. It's just another branch of it. It's not 'minor'. You are making a false dichotomy here. It's a false narrative you're pushing. it's not either or.

Do you even know who we are and what we believe? Because it really doesn't sound like it.

You do realise, don't you, that some of the biggest "terves" are fighting against trans ideology BECAUSE they understand male violence far, FAR better than you do? These are women who have fought for DECADES against male violence. ALL male violence. These are women who were active in actually getting legislation against male violence. ALL of it. Why are you making the false claim that we "only" care about "trans women in toilets and not domestic violence, rape, and all the male violence against women" you are talking about?

You don't know who you're talking to, do you? Again. You've been misinformed.

lifeturnsonadime · 17/03/2025 23:26

Wellee · 17/03/2025 23:24

Why are you scared about what has been and not looking forward?

Men's right's activism is the future?

Men with gender identities get to be where they want and us 'old fashioned' women wanting single sex spaces are 'has been'? Is that what you mean?

Is that what you think is progress?

Helleofabore · 17/03/2025 23:27

Merrymouse · 17/03/2025 23:25

It's amazing how many women claim to have have been sexually assaulted/flashed/groped by complete strangers. Are the silly women just imagining it?

That is the ridiculousness of the argument, isn't it MerryM?

hihelenhi · 17/03/2025 23:28

lifeturnsonadime · 17/03/2025 23:26

Men's right's activism is the future?

Men with gender identities get to be where they want and us 'old fashioned' women wanting single sex spaces are 'has been'? Is that what you mean?

Is that what you think is progress?

Yes. Because they're stupid and misinformed. Often a bit sheltered and elitist also.

Wellee · 17/03/2025 23:29

👏

MarieDeGournay · 17/03/2025 23:30

I've just returned to this thread after a few hours away, and I see it has followed a predictable pattern:
no matter now reasonable, sensitive, sensible, polite, kind, tactful or carefully-worded posts are [re-read the first pages of replies to the OP to see what I mean - there were so many good wishes for a good life] it somehow ends up with the usual 'this debate is toxic' 'I just can't be bothered arguing with you' 'I've no time to argue about this' 'I have zero interest in debating with anyone' 'frothing at the mouth' 'shouting down and jeering at trans people' and so on.

It's like there this pent-up mass of words like 'toxic' and 'transphobic', which just have to be deployed in any discussion like this, regardless of what is actually said.

Wellee · 17/03/2025 23:31

SpidersAreShitheads · 17/03/2025 17:08

Can I ask you OP, have all of your mental health problems completely disappeared since you transitioned? I know you've said you're happier, but has transitioning solved all of the issues you were previously experiencing?

Also, can I ask, are you autistic or otherwise neurodivergent?

I think the very aggressive stance that some TRAs have taken has made women need to defend ourselves and our rights quite robustly. In reality, most women don't really care about trans-identified individuals - lots of us are very happy and willing to accept anyone living their life in a way that makes them happy. What we're not happy about is TW being nominated for "woman of the year" type awards, taking the sole allocated spot for women in male-dominated environments, and most importantly, TW in female-only spaces such as bathrooms, hospitals, prisons, etc. Trans-identifying individuals have been given far more care and concern than women have ever had, and the erosion of our language, our rights, and our spaces - all of which have been very hard-fought - are what we're so upset about.

The vast, vast majority of us wish trans-identifying individuals the very best. We would support you in fighting for third spaces and would be opposed to any discrimination, but in return we need to see our sex-based rights respected too - which they very rarely are. I'm not referring to you specifically OP as you seem open to third spaces and identifying as a trans woman rather than just "woman".

Women that insist trans-identifying males should be allowed into women's single sex spaces typically speak from a point of privilege, Emma Watson being the perfect example. Women who have been sexually assaulted, raped, or otherwise violated and abused by a man often have a different viewpoint - a viewpoint which is supposed to be protected by the law allowing single-sex spaces.

What is the relevance of asking about autism or neurodivergence status?
highly offensive!!

murasaki · 17/03/2025 23:32

Wellee · 17/03/2025 23:29

👏

Edited

There's a pretty high correlation with teenage girls wanting to be boys whonalso have autism and to be fair, with the pornification culture, I can see why they want to identify out of being female. The thing is, they can't.

lifeturnsonadime · 17/03/2025 23:32

Wellee · 17/03/2025 23:29

👏

Edited

I have two autistic kids. One is a young adult and the other is a teenager who thought she might be trans when she was younger.

There is a high co-morbidity between neurodiversity and trans identification.

It is not offensive to point this link out. The NHS does so in the Cass review.

If a young person identifies as trans it is actually very likely that they are also neurodiverse. That's not offensive, it's factual.

EDIT - why did Wellee edit their post at the last minute? Did they realise that they were the one who was being offensive when they stated that it was offensive to suggest that a trans person might be autistic when statistically that is proven. Do they think it is a bad thing to be associated with being neurodiverse?

131104E · 17/03/2025 23:33

You are not a woman and never will be a woman

Wellee · 17/03/2025 23:34

murasaki · 17/03/2025 23:32

There's a pretty high correlation with teenage girls wanting to be boys whonalso have autism and to be fair, with the pornification culture, I can see why they want to identify out of being female. The thing is, they can't.

High correlation? Please provide some statistics as I think that’s nonsense

lifeturnsonadime · 17/03/2025 23:35

Wellee · 17/03/2025 23:34

High correlation? Please provide some statistics as I think that’s nonsense

I would strongly suggest you look at the Cass review as a starting point, HTH.

StarStay · 17/03/2025 23:36

OP, please be careful with asking your questions on a forum like this. Not everyone has the same views as a lot of people on this site. Keep in mind the opinions on trans woman on this forum sway much more in a negative direction than typical.

I support you and also include trans women in my feminism. I do not see you as a threat in my spaces. I wish you all the best ❤️

Helleofabore · 17/03/2025 23:39

Wellee · 17/03/2025 23:34

High correlation? Please provide some statistics as I think that’s nonsense

Here is the Cass Review. Dr Cass wrote about it in both the interim and the final reports.

https://cass.independent-review.uk/home/publications/final-report/

Final Report – Cass Review

https://cass.independent-review.uk/home/publications/final-report/

Helleofabore · 17/03/2025 23:39

Cross post. Grin

murasaki · 17/03/2025 23:41

Wellee · 17/03/2025 23:29

👏

Edited

Also, you do know that we can see your pre edited post, right?

StartEngine · 17/03/2025 23:41

Bunny44 · 17/03/2025 21:52

I don't see trans people as privileged. Their lives are often very hard. I know trans women. I also know Muslim women who do not share your views either so don't dress it up for views to protecting 'vulnerable women' as tbh I think she'd find what you just said as incredibly patronising. They can speak for themselves too.

Oh goodness, what a reach! I didn’t say all Muslim women. Certainly some. I didn’t say trans people are privileged. It’s me that would be if I assumed that my comfort level with males having rights to enter women’s spaces was the default one. But I’m sure that was quite clear.

Wellee · 17/03/2025 23:42

lifeturnsonadime · 17/03/2025 23:35

I would strongly suggest you look at the Cass review as a starting point, HTH.

I would strongly suggest if you are going to make a statement like it is fact that you can back it up, I’m not chasing up your comments for fact checking especially as you can’t provide statistics.

Greyskybluesky · 17/03/2025 23:42

I agree @MarieDeGournay. So predictable. I just think a lot of people simply can't be bothered to read posts. They plop down their opinion and that's it. It's quite arrogant really.

hihelenhi · 17/03/2025 23:43

Wellee · 17/03/2025 23:42

I would strongly suggest if you are going to make a statement like it is fact that you can back it up, I’m not chasing up your comments for fact checking especially as you can’t provide statistics.

The Cass Review IS factual, you fool.

What statistics are you using? Can you provide them?

lifeturnsonadime · 17/03/2025 23:43

StarStay · 17/03/2025 23:36

OP, please be careful with asking your questions on a forum like this. Not everyone has the same views as a lot of people on this site. Keep in mind the opinions on trans woman on this forum sway much more in a negative direction than typical.

I support you and also include trans women in my feminism. I do not see you as a threat in my spaces. I wish you all the best ❤️

You are not a feminist.

No feminist ignores the fact that women are harmed by the inclusion of males in female single sex spaces in favour of the male's wish to be there.

murasaki · 17/03/2025 23:43

Wellee · 17/03/2025 23:42

I would strongly suggest if you are going to make a statement like it is fact that you can back it up, I’m not chasing up your comments for fact checking especially as you can’t provide statistics.

But she provided them, in the form of the Cass report....

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