NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #5

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 January 2025 and is expected to continue for 2 weeks. The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton started giving evidence on 6 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely can be obtained by sending an email request to [email protected] headed Public Access Request (Peggie v Fife Health Board) 4104864/2024 and requesting access.

The hearing is being live tweeted by https://x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.is/xkSxy.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: https://nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Thread 1: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5186317-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse

Thread 2: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5267591-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-thread-2

Thread 3: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268347-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-3

Thread 4: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268942-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-4

Yes, they generate lost of under article comments by using these tactics.

When we roll onto the new thread can the link be added in the opening post, please?

Sorry but it's a fundraising page and could get the whole thread pulled.

I think you have time to cook a full on mumsnet chicken at this point...

I’m off to the dentist. Do we think he might appear before I’m back? Possibly not.

There was a skip in one of the WFTCHTJs which made it sound like it was being said live. That reminded me of Father Ted and the nuns singing the on hold music

It's not fashion, it's to try and stop automatic face recognition to make the authorities job more difficult. Same reason antifa were known as the black bloc, not because it's intimidating but wearing clothes which are all basically the same makes it hard to pick people out of a crowd.

Who are the other witnesses that are going to be called?

Dr U named a few people yesterday (but I didn't think to check whether TT had listed any of them).

I wonder how many staff at the hospital are thinking "thank goodness I wasn't on shift...."

Depending on what type of device you've got, you can probably get little sticky covers for the camera that you can slide open when you want to use it. Amazon and eBay sell them.

They'll mostly be people working at NHS Fife called to explain the processes ijn place in the hospital and the disciplinary process.

I used to use black insulating tape on my work laptop, and spent years not having to use the camera by saying it was broken.

I just can't see how they could possibly even insinuate anything negative about it.

They be could of course set up a fundraiser for something and see how it goes...

NHS fife have no defence at all. It's a bit bizarre the strategy because you can argue Upton was deceived by the Trust about what is reasonable behaviour and the law but the Trust should know they're breaking the law on several fronts! So many people must be either brainwashed, delusional or so paralysed by the toxic workplace and fear of being suspended they won't point out the obvious for it to get here.

Although DUs behaviour does rather suggest they were actively looking for a confrontation/case against a "terf" I have been thinking for a while now generally in respect to trans that it is so dangerous for bodies with a duty of care, as DU's employer is, to fail to protect their employees from making a distressing and humiliating tit of themselves enduring a distressing and humiliating situation like this

Maybe take the opportunity to scream into the void at this insanity?

Tribunal Tweets:

We are now 30 minutes past the expected start time of today's proceedings. This is longer than the previous delays arising from difficulties with remote access or waiting for witnesses to enter. We will back when we have something to report.

After following the thread yesterday, I’ve requested access but only have a black screen and no WFTCHTJ message. Have tried both observer and video + audio.. different browser needed?

I'm spending my waiting time wisely by making mini clay ghosts with swooshy hemlines.

And israelis - without head coverings - including IDF - have been assasinated on "their turf". Hamas, like others who perceive themselves as subversives tend to cover their faces. It also makes them look intimidating. They think they can employ control by their anonymity. It represents a power imbalance. Nakedness versus being covered/disguised. All self identified rebel groups tend to employ this tactic.

Hurry up, it’s 8:30pm here.

I’ve now read up on the unicorn and lion on the Visit Scotland page. Makes sense now, kind of. Shame there’s no room for a haggis, like in the YouTube haggis documentaries. Cute little creatures.

different browser needed?

I'd try a different one. Not Firefox if you're having problems.

A friend of DHs has started to "affirm" her 11-year-old son in his preference to be "a girl". It's so troubling, a world of pain surely awaits this child. Clearly DU was a lot older when he adopted a female identity, but I wonder how emotionally mature he is?

I am also a Fife and have used mental health services for myself and a young teenager in my care. I can honestly say all of the staff in Kirkcaldy's Whytemans Brae have all been lovely and supportive, but hugely understaffed and funded. I would be deeply concerned to have left my God daughter in the presence of this individual who appears forceful of their own views irrespective of the impact on others, especially where this can be use to influence a vulnerable young female, or even male. I am so angry that Fife NHS are wasting funds on this person's choices, given the lack of resources currently available. A local GP surgery does not have a single permanent GP and on some days there are no GPs available at all, but they have money to throw at things like this!? Maddening!

I wish Sandie all the best and hope she wins her case. I and my colleagues (from another public service organisation) are watching with interest, and concern, at the prospect of being told that our opinions as women on being women are unimportant, irrelevant and hateful and punishable by those in power.

Difficult to catch though!

I did that yesterday morning! One of the many breaks nicely coincided with the ping from the oven announcing it was cooked! Twas excellent timing!

Oh come on, the suspense is killing me…

@JasmineAllen HNRTT but skimmed only. These references may not give you what you need but, if not, hopefully one of the literature and studies they cite might be more helpful? Good luck.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC3966425/

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC3966425/#R5