Could we ban "transvestigating" threads on here?

[Christinapple]

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5225715-ilona-maher

This one for example. Transvestigating is an informal term given to when people play detective and try to determine if a given person (usually a woman) is transgender or not from how they look e.g. photos.

I've seen it more than a few times on Twitter anytime a woman who is tall or muscular or "masculine looking" appears. Quite often, women are wrongly mistaken for being trans.

As well as being transphobic, IMO this harms all women and reinforces stereotypes of what men/women should look like. And the idea of obsessing over people's appearances like this just doesn't sit well with me.

What?! That's so mean. Yup it's just bullying of you're saying someone is transvestite when they're not.

What a display of DARVO. At a time when no women's meeting can happen without the usual ragbag of homophobes, misogynists and women silencers bawling threats of violence and sexual abuse at women, we've someone on here claiming that women insistent on safeguarding children and protecting women's rights are guilty of "stochastic terrorism" 😂

The lack of insight and empathy into women's lives along with endless narcissistic narratives is quite tedious - but extremely revealing.

Funny how transactivists never seem to capture the moment isn’t it?

The same poster who last week was insisting that the rape by deception law was transphobic and that trans people should be free to commit rape by deception

I find the term Cis offensive.

Well, I'm just glad that my own stunning natural beauty and inner radiance means that I've never experienced all that nasty body shaming some other women seem to bang on about.

The first time I disclosed after nearly a decade of complete and repeatedly demonstrable invisibility, I did so exclusively to a group of other (misogyny-subject) feminists I had spent years carefully scrutinising and slowly learning to trust. They had no idea and some initially thought I was joking because it was so out of nowhere. There was a lot of 'You didn't need to tell me and I'm kind of sad that you were scared, but thankyou for sharing. Also...I know trans people and had absolutely no idea that was even possible, what the hell?'. I did ask if there was any advice and offered to remove myself if it was a problem for anyone and got a unanimous 'don't you fucking dare imply you have any less right to be here than any of us' scolding which rather set the tone for the future.

These sound like the type of ‘feminists’ we see being roped in to ‘protect’ men at TRA protests.

Remember: fight, flight and fawn

Weirdly, though, they never once targeted me. I've walked right through groups of anti-trans activists hurling abuse at any visible trans people they see over the last few years; I even had to stop and ask them to please get out of the way so I could get to my train once. Nothing.

Not even everyone clapping you?

Yes. Apparently socialisation …..

You were recognised as male at birth. You were treated as a male child. Your socialisation and the resultant self image, even as a gender non conforming male, is light years away from ours.

Given the number of cis female friends who have been driven off by the way they have been treated while trying to engage with threads on this board - the most common form of which has been to accuse them of being secretly male or mentally ill - I think you might want to examine your own prejudices and blindspots.

You can believe what you want and are welcome to play pretend if it affirms your beliefs

Like you do when you say you are a woman?

Given the number of cis female friends who have been driven off by the way they have been treated while trying to engage with threads on this board

Been driven off = not able to put up a decent argument for why men are women and should be treated as such, and flouncing due to their cognitive dissonance being too much to handle

stochastic terrorism = female people declaring their valid and legitimate needs.

Just two of these are female single sex spaces to exclude all male people above age needing care and the female sports category to be protected.

But stochastic terrorism, innit?

The intent behind showing top surgery scars, and the reason why there are active initiatives to do so, is to create an environment where trans masc people don't feel they have to be ashamed or hide themselves away if they do end up with visible surgery scars.

I have two (close) transmen friends. They would rather die than emphasise any physical difference between themselves and anyone born male. If you really do think of yourself as a man, why would you want to do that?

Also, what is a "transmasc"? What's the difference between that and a transman?

Do not use the term "cis female" please, it's offensive.

The markers I can spot in your writing have nothing to do with any "prejudices and blindspots", whatever they may be.

Do you have a response to my earlier question of what you mean by "visibly trans"? You may have missed the question so I'll raise it again. Can you clarify what you mean by "visibly trans"?

Yeah. Likely they might be the posters who make statements about their ‘lovely’ male friends who they personally don’t have a problem with using female single sex spaces with and who tell their male friends that their, the poster’s, permission is all that is needed consent-wise for society.

Whereas what those posters can’t admit is that they have contributed to the harm of female people in the name of so called ‘kindness.’

But no evidence to support any of their assertions, just more emotional manipulation. And from other posts and threads, we know most of those manipulations very well now.

Butters, you are prejudiced against women. You feel that we shouldn't have the right to name ourselves, have the right to privacy, dignity and respect unless we put men like you front and centre. You will never know what it feels like to be a woman as that feeling is simply being born in a female body. It's not what we do, what we wear, our preferences etc,it's simply the reality of being female.

You have an experience different to most men as you don't think you are one but no matter how much you wish it to be true, you have more in common with all men than you do with any woman.

It's this wanting to be but deep down knowing that you can never be which massively affects why you won't see women as human. We are there to prop up your skewed image of yourself. If you truly thought women as human beings worthy if respect, you would listen to us and stay out if our spaces. Transwomen use the gents daily without problem, we know because they tell us. Try respecting women and leave our spaces, you may be surprised what being a decent person feels like

Yep.

I remember a thread where it was disputed that female people have this reaction to male people’s presence. Whether the harm is potentially physical or mental.

You can see the fawning whenever there is an MTF on a women's Facebook group or similar.

Why would any random female presenting person be expected to be headed towards maternity at a hospital and not elsewhere?

Everything has been explained to butters a gazillion times. Butters just likes the attention they get from coming on here and pretending to argue

We have seen it right here on FWR on occasion.

Quite!