Moira Deeming in Australia - thread 3

[TheSandgroper]

Following on from busy threads 1 and 2

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5167282-in-australia-moira-deeming-defamation-trial-now-on

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5172553-moira-deeming-defamation-trial-thread-2-from-australia

Keep on discussing, ladies. Change never happens in silence.

Vaxatious Litigant @ ExposingNV on Twitter is live tweeting today.

Lots of legal speak today that I didn’t understand. It was pretty much a different language. Chrysanthou spoke today doing her closing arguments. She didn’t finish. At least one more hour from her tomorrow and then Collins gets his turn. Court is back tomorrow at 10:15am AEDT Melbourne time.

Vaxatious Litigant lube tweeted the whole day. It should be up on Trubunal Tweets’ website later today. In the meantime here’s the link to Twitter:
https://x.com/ExposingNV/status/1848503681311981868

Searching the hashtag DeemingvPesutto on Twitter will bring up a lot of great tweets.

Deeming didn’t attend today. I’m assuming that Pesutto didn’t either because Victorian Parliament is back at work.

The judge agreed with a lot of things Chrysanthou said today, like that the neo Nazis didn’t have anything to do with the LWS rally, and that the women shouldn’t have had to stop their rally just because some noisy men turned up. Something like that anyway.

Why didn't pessutto try and avoid all this and apologise to Moira like he did with KJK? Does anyone know?

Handy chance to scupper a rival colleague?

My guesses are:

1. he knew KJK is like a dog with a bone and wouldn’t let it go so it was sensible to not let that get too far
2. in contrast, he thought Deeming would be a pushover
3. he wanted to demonstrate to a certain component of the Victorian electorate that his woke credentials were intact by coming down hard on a woman who in his view tainted his party’s stance on trans rights and thus help win over voters he needs to come over from Labor in order to win the election.

He did, she wouldn't accept.

She would only settle if he agreed to readmit her to the party room with no conditions. Which is a separate ask to an apology for any defamation.

https://www.skynews.com.au/australia-news/politics/john-pesutto-reveals-sticking-point-that-caused-mediation-talks-with-moira-deeming-to-break-down-but-exiled-liberal-mp-says-the-opposition-leader-cant-be-trusted/news-story/2405cbc90f81da235964a6b87a0d13d0?amp

If he lied about her, and if he ousted her from the parliamentary party on a manufactured basis, then why would she not be readmitted? If he lied, her ousting in the first place would have been based on a pack of lies.

Her re admittance would be necessary to make good an egregious harm caused by the particular alleged falsehoods.

Thank you. Very interesting.

Absolutely. An unwillingness to readmit just shows the lack of sincerity of the apology in a way that shouts ‘I don’t mean it! I still think I what I said was right!’

We’re back. Chrysanthou is continuing to deliver her closing arguments. Deeming is in court today. More legal speak and quoting of previous cases.

Collins is up and he’s being nasty and attacking right from the start.

That's all he's got FeralWoman. He's got weeks of evidence to undo of bluff, bluster, obfuscation, arrogance, pomposity, can't remembers, and but, but, but the extremely credible dossier that means we were riiiiiiiiiight, and no we won't acknowledge taking tweets and video footage completely out of context and cherry picking the few minutes of content that "proves" she's associated with people, who're associated with people who apparently know & allegedly consort with some people who are Nazis.

So burn the witch, time to move on, nothing to see here.... and hope it sticks.

https://www.theguardian.com/law/2024/oct/23/moira-deeming-defamation-trial-john-pesutto-neo-nazi-rally-ntwnfb

Beginning his closing arguments on Wednesday afternoon, Collins told the court there should no dispute that the neo-Nazis were there to “support” the headline speaker of the rally, the UK gender critical activist Kellie-Jay Keen. He said the rally was “anti-trans”, given Keen began by “provoking” the counter-protest.

It’s quite incredible that it’s gotten to the closing remarks stage and Collins is still repeating something that isn’t true.

If that is all that the team has, then I guess they have to double down on it. I suspect His Honour has seen the videos, and is unlikely to forget them, and his own reaction to attempts to twist the truth for the event and the dossier.

He’s just talking shit. Stuff that’s clearly not true. I know that he has to represent his client’s position but don’t lawyers, especially KCs, have some sort of requirement to not lie in court? He did a great job of grilling public servants and politicians during the Robodebt inquiry and now he’s perpetuating the lies of dodgy politician?

I admire Deeming’s self control in restraining herself from throwing her glass of water over him or swearing at him or something.

Look at the sneaky Guardian. They’ve changed the headline of the article despite the body of the article not changing at all. The first posting of the article had a headline you could consider favourable to Deeming, the update has one that is unfavourable to her. We see you, misogynistic Guardian subs:

'Cauterise the damage' of a woman who spoke at a womens rights event, the words of another woman, and who drank a glass of champagne afterwards.

The judge must be pulling his hair out over this nonsense.

Wow! 😯

Court is back in the morning at 10:15am Melbourne time. So a bit less than 11 hours from now. It should be the final day apart from the day the decision is handed down. Collins has to finish his closing arguments and then I think the judge will ask both Chrysanthou and Collins any questions that he has.

If looks could kill! Deeming is on camera right behind Collins’ left shoulder. Her facial expressions are no longer neutral and controlled. She’s been literally open mouthed at the false crap Collins is spinning, along with numerous WTF expressions. Pretty sure she’s rolled her eyes at least once.

This footage is gold. It’s such a shame it can’t be recorded and replayed in Australia.

The judge doesn’t appear to be believing Collins and his version of what happened.

I suspect that she’s on Twitter reading what everyone is posting. She tweeted while in court yesterday.

What the judge and Collins have said today has been extraordinary. Collins has gone full TRA and said something along the lines of TRAs (but pretty sure he meant trans) are a more vulnerable minority than children. The judge is 100% peaked. Collins was going on about terfs denying and hating the humanity and dignity of trans people and the judge asked but what about the humanity and dignity of little girls in change rooms. Collins dismissed that and went back to TRAs and trans. At one point he even said to the judge “so what?” when the judge asked him about something to do with sex based rights.

For anyone wanting to see it if you go to the livestream about 1hr 30 after it started you’ll catch it. The stream will be down within two hours from now. Afternoon session just started.

For some reason Collins is referencing a lot of UK cases as precedents. Guess he’s decided that there’s no Aus cases so UK cases are the next logical ones to reference seeing as we’re connected via the monarchy and Commonwealth.

Now he’s referencing a defamation case that Chrysanthou won. Heston Russell vs the ABC. She represented Russell.

Chrysanthou referenced a lot of UK cases in her summary on Tuesday.

I did fall asleep during part of it, lol. Guess that I missed it. I know that I heard her reference Australian cases, including Barilaro vs Shanks-Markovina.

Thanks @FeralWoman

Such a contrast between Collins and Crysthanthou.