Older generations show resistance to trans rights

[Inauthentic]

"Millennials and Gen Z tend to be overwhelmingly supportive of trans people, having grown up in a more inclusive environment, while older generations show far more resistance to trans rights, likely intimidated by the speed of social change."

Is this your experience?
There appears to be an overwhelming support for gender critical beliefs on Mumsnet.
Is it because it's mainly older generations engaging in this debate?

How old are you and what are your views?

I am 45yo and I mostly support trans rights (with the exception of trans athletes competing in woman's events and I agree puberty blockers is a grey area)

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/jun/16/britons-not-bitterly-polarised-over-trans-equality-research-finds

'support for trans women using women’s changing rooms doubled when it was specified they had undergone gender reassignment surgery, rising from 24% to 48%; the same pattern emerged for toilet use, rising from 29% to 53%.'

Again, lots of these questions are predicated on quite specific situations!

Typo in that last paragraph.

Lets not pretend that any pervert or predator hasn't effectively been handed a golden ticket to invade women's spaces without challenge.

Well, no. A man doesn't become female just because he loses his genitals.

https://wng.org/roundups/trans-advocates-add-new-gender-identity-the-eunuch-1666638882

Millennial here. Strongly gender critical. For my views, essentially see JK Rowling's latest lengthy twitter post.

Many of my similarly aged friends are also gender critical, though tended to be fairly quiet about it until they realised I was 'safe'.

I was fairly early to the party, being introduced around the time of the Forstater case and before JK Rowling "came out" and certain friends certainly originally thought that I was at the more extreme end (thinking that using chosen pronouns was quite problematic, though I'd probably just try to find a way to avoid using any, for example) but many have since adopted more or less the same views.

Sorry to disappoint the people who think that a declared womanly essence is all that's needed for any male to ignore women's boundaries in the places they're needed the most - prisons, rape crisis centres (baffled how sport could matter more tbh) - but I'm detecting that young people are less and less enamoured with this ideology. Source: young relatives and working with kids.

I think the major mistakes trans activism made for the youth vote were being a ginormous buzz-kill and appropriating suffering. Can you imagine being young in today's fucked up world? There is an enormous amount of genuine suffering worldwide to care about and campaign about. And when you've done that? You probably deserve some fun as you contemplate having to live with your parents for the next 3 decades.

I think we're going to end up with an awkward generation and their gen X parents who fell for it. Some will be brave enough to admit they were deceived, some will cling on to their belief til the bitter end.

Oh, I'm a bit younger than OP, if that makes my opinion more valid to those who are ageist?

or you discover they are in a women's prison and the women are required to take birth control as a result.

The male should be vasectomised if the prison authorities won't remove him. The women shouldn't have to quadruple their risk of stroke by being on the Pill because the authorities won't remove the male.

Sex is determined at conception, coded in to every single cell in the body and it is immutable.
If knowing this makes me a terrible, awful, bigoted old hag then frankly I don't give a shit.
Trans women are only women if you change the meaning of the word women to mean something other than adult human females. After many, many years of asking many, many posters no-one has yet provided a definition of women that includes some men, doesn't exclude some women who regard themselves as women and isn't dependent on including the word woman in the definition.
As you have said you won't engage I'll take it that you are in possession of this hallowed definition but refusing to share it rather than the more logical explanation that you, like all the rest of the TWAW'ers, can't actually provide a definition.

Edited to add:
Oh and I have 40+ years to go to hit the average life span of the woman# in my family so I'm not ready to shut up and shuffle off just yet.

#bloody hateful, bigoted biology giving women, on average longer lives than men.

To be fair - it is you who could do with a little more education. Removing your breasts and having your womb removed does not make you a man. I've met with detransitioners who have done this and they rapidly became aware that doing such radical things to your body does not magically transform you into a man/male person.

Likewise, there are tons of male detransitioners, some of whom have gone as far as surgical castration - only to realise that they are not really women at all.

Trans ideology is straight out of post modernistic queer theory - have you read much of that? If so, you'll know it is predicated on the denial of measurable truth and reality - in which only one's feelings and thoughts matter or have any validity. The idea that 'gender is a construct that one performs and plays around with. That is where the term 'identifying as' something comes from. When you identify as something - you are not that thing - you are performing it.

Gender performances are based on social stereotypes and presentations - and as such are totally social in nature. In that social context they also require validation from others even to exist as what they believe themselves to be.

I think some of it relates to the situation many of us found ourselves in as young women i.e. having to get a man to approve you opening a bank account, getting a CC, getting a mortgage, filing a tax return etc etc. And then being constantly misgendered as 'Sir' means we do actually understand the hurt and humiliation of being 'misgendered'. But we just rolled our eyes and got on with life. Few men at the time took this as a serious issue, so it smarts that there is so much more sympathy and support for trans now.

I have many trans friends, and have no problem with any until some transwomen (and it is always transwomen, not transmen in my experience) tries to force me to recognize them as actual women. They are perfectly ok to behave in a way they think is 'female', but they are not and never will be women and should NOT expect to be in spaces that are reserved for women. They do not have the same lived experience as women, nor (in the vast majority of cases) have the same physical experiences or capability.

PS. I didn't vote for Brexit so don't blame me!

I may have a slightly more sympathetic view due to my step son but I can appreciate what you are saying.
I personally think if I’m in a changing room and someone has a vagina and breast I wouldn’t question if they were trans.

#Trans women are women when they get rid of the cock.
Same as trans men are men when they can not longer have babies and get a cock.

What? So if a woman has a hysterectomy or is post-menopausal, she's a man? Nobody can change sex.

"I started a poll once and the overwhelming number of people (and there were a LOT of responses, because absolutely nothing gets people more fired up here than trans issues) said they did not believe that trans women are women."

Oh dear. I remember. You were quite upset that people didn't agree with your philosophical belief.

Even you agreed at the time that there are times when those male people should not be treated exactly the same as female people. Yet, here you are trying to portray anyone who doesn't comply with your believes as hateful.

If you cannot see the direct intolerance there and the hypocrisy of your post here, then that is ok. Those reading along will probably see it quite clearly.

Except for XX/XY chimerism. The fact that we can name XX/XY chimerism and describe its effects on reproductive organs in terms of XX and XY proves that XX and XY are real.

If you can see someone's vagina, you aren't in a changing room but a gynaecology clinic.

I know you have declined to engage, fair enough. But I do wish that you would tell me what exactly makes a TW a W.

Thats harsh! My SS is 31. He has been transitioning for 2 years and is still living as a man with his female genitalia. I highly doubt he will detransition.
What is it you want me to be more educated on?

And the third of women who didn't actually know what a cervix was when asked? How would they know this includes them?

Here is a paraphrase:

”#Trans women are women

I am unwilling to explain what I mean by this; I am unwilling to try to understand any different point of view; I won't engage at all.”

Is this not the epitome of bigotry?

Fuck no. A male without a cock is a male without a cock. Still not any type of woman.

People don't need 'education' to accept any male as magically becoming a female people with extreme body modifications. And how cruel is that to then have society make that demand of any person to have surgeries and treatment to be accepted as something they are materially not. This is why it is hard transitioning! Because people are being sold a lie that if they have extreme body modifications they will be accepted as they want to be.

What other group do we encourage to do this? Just no! No amount of treatment makes a person the opposite sex and many of those people after treatment have told the world just how they have finally understood that they can never achieve the dream being sold to them.

The man who abused my DD in her primary school has DBS clearance - all that tells you is that they haven't been caught yet

Would a trans woman need a gynaecologist? Forgive my ignorance and it is a genuine question. I would have thought wouldn’t.

Lets say your step son, for the purposes of this we'll call him Adam, wasn't transitioning but had a horrific work place accident and Adam's penis and testicles are sliced off in the salami slicing machine.

When he finally gets out of hospital would he return home to find all reference to him being a male of the human species had been removed? And that from now on he was no longer to be called Adam as that's a man's name, and as he's now missing his penis and testicles he's no longer a man but a woman called Eve?

Males do not have vaginas - a vagina is a fully functioning organ, not a cavity constructed from soft tissue with hair shafts. Might sound cruel, but truth is important. A cavity which requires daily dilation to stop it healing up.
I come across quite a few cross dressing men and men presenting as women where I live, and their maleness is always obvious.

Your stepchild is then still a female who has taken steps to live their life as they believe a male person lives their life??? It will never be that they will live their life as a male person (or vice versa), only their own concept, generally shaped by either stereotypes or the feeling that if they didn't feel like a woman then they must be a man.

You can doubt they will detransition, but the long term detransition rates are much higher than the misinformation of around 1% that gets thrown around. So you don't know. All you can do is support them but they will realise that they are never truly accepted as a male person, only as someone who presents themselves as they believe a male person looks, behaves etc.

Do you think that your stepchild should be always treated as a male if they have that very very dangerous addition of a fake penis added to their body? Do you know the failure rates for those operations? The failure rates are very high. And the long term damage is significant. Have you ever listened to Scott Newman?