Kemi Badenoch to face Women & Equalities Committee’s questions on equalities issues - 13 December 2023

[IwantToRetire]

Sorry I am sure there was a thread started in preparation for this but cant find it.

Happy to delete this if someone can give me link as search hasn't.

Still happening I think,

https://committees.parliament.uk/event/19766

https://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/41208ebe-60ce-4f19-99d4-0edc4e99e384

It’s as if KO still thinks it is no debate (or exposure) time. As if the Tavistock haven’t been investigated. As if some clinicians haven’t wryly alluded to there being no gay people left (as they had all been transitioned as children due to being led along that path, or homophobic parents). As if the Cass Review never took place. As if we didn’t know the very basis is on shaky ground, put pushed through with lobbying and equivalence with sexual orientation. With a lack (or dodgy) evidence which would not be accepted for any other issue.

I just think her performance was awful.

Oh dear, seem the media doesn't quite see it the same way - surprise, surpise!

Kemi Badenoch calls Labour MP ‘liar’ in transgender children clash

Kemi Badenoch accused a Labour MP of being a “liar” in a heated clash over the language used to describe transgender children.

The equalities minister was warned about the use of “unparliamentary language” after she clashed with Kate Osborne, who she accused of lying.

During an appearance at the Women and Equalities Select Committee on Wednesday (13 December), the Cabinet minister became angry when Ms Osborne accused her of previously using “inflammatory language that likens children and young people coming out as trans to the spread of a disease”.

Ms Badenoch said: “That is a lie and I think you should withdraw that statement. That is a lie. You are lying.”

https://www.independent.co.uk/tv/news/kemi-badenoch-labour-transgender-clash-b2464006.html

Left leaning media makes stuff up.

It's becoming the hallmark of this ideology.

As a result of KB, I’ve become more interested in parliamentary tv and now interested to gauge if this lack of comprehension and understanding runs more deeply amongst our elected representatives.

Same here. It's gobsmacking. In the past there have been many politicians who I've disliked, hated even. People who seem to have no compassion or human decency, people who turn everything into a game of political point-scoring.

Until the past few years, though, the one thing I've never felt is what I feel now: contempt. Total and utter contempt for politicians like Kate Osborne, who don't know the simplest, most basic facts about the subject they're pontificating on, who are too lazy to do the minimum research and too dim to engage with the arguments, and who then have the nerve to patronise and insult people who are vastly better informed and more intelligent than they are.

And bear in mind, I'm actually a supporter of Kate Osborne's party. It's not even contempt for the political opposition, it's contempt for people who are supposed to be on the same side as you, but who are less use than a chocolate fireguard.

Staing facts: " You are lying", is not the same as name calling " You are a liar"

Roughly what was said re KO accusing KB of likening children and young people coming out as trans to a disease. Cannot say where or when it was said. Even what exactly was said.

————————-
KO: You’ve made this statement , using inflammatory language, that likens children and young people coming out as trans, to the spread of a disease.

KB: I’ve never said that. That is a lie. That is a lie and I think you should withdraw that statement. That is a lie. You are lying. You are lying.

KO: I’m not lying to you.

KB: You are lying. I’ve never, ever used the word disease. ….. . and I think this is exactly what I am talking about. You are making statements in the select Committee that are untrue.

KO: You just called me a liar.

(CN: re Unparliamentary language)

KB: What she has said is not true. It’s not true. We have to use facts in this room, we can’t just make stuff up. This is what I am talking about.

KO: Well I absolutely agree with you. I just don’t think your facts necessarily…..

KB: When was that statement made, and where?

KO tries to obfuscate and says this is the government’s own data.

KB: No, no. You said I said the word disease.

KO: I don’t know! Did you?

Of course I didn’t

KB: So you don’t even know where that came from. Where did you get that from? Where did you get that from?

KO: I’m not here to answer your questions.

KB: Because you don’t know. Because you don’t know. It is not true. You should not be saying that in this Committee when you don’t know where that thing/paper? came from.

KO: I’m not calling you a liar, you’re calling me a liar.

(CN: intervenes)

KB: I will not have my name maligned by people making false statements about me. That is not true.

Put it another way RoyalCorgi. I won't be alone in how in the past I've felt rage at Tory MPs fiddling with the rules to mean that their mates would pay less tax, and they themselves would be able to get something extra themselves.

But look now. We have MPs who are working to undermine safeguarding around women and girls that means there'll be loopholes for some bad people on "their side" and the MPs don't even get any cash, all they get is a pat on the head and an announcement to those round about that "look, this is a good person".

Sorry not trying to derail but interested in how the media had or has not covered this meeting given latest legal cases re gender id and on going media coverage of the "be kind" type.

So the Guardian, despite having a "Women's Page" has not coverd this, but rather has highlighted Badenoch in this way

Badenoch condemns London plague study after MP calls it ‘woke archaeology’
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/dec/13/badenoch-condemns-london-plague-study-after-mp-calls-it-woke-archaeology

MSN has reprinted Pink News analysis of the meeting!

Four most troubling moments from Kemi Badenoch’s Women and Equalities Committee scrutiny
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/other/four-most-troubling-moments-from-kemi-badenoch-s-women-and-equalities-committee-scrutiny/ar-AA1lvqVL

It is rather incredible that someone would go on a televised Committee and accuse someone else of saying something when they can give no source, timeline or even the content of the accusation.

Then when asked about their accusation, replied ‘I dunno. Did you [say it]?

DrBlackbird · Today 12:52

The whole accusation that a rise in hate crime against Trans people being due to politicians talking about the issue is so misleading and faulty. Deliberately missing a step in the argument?

I don't think that it's a mistake at all, rather, a purposeful propaganda strategy; they are pushing the line that trans are the most oppressed and discriminated against group in society.

If they can con people into believing that and that they're mostly harmless, it's easier for them to claim access all areas. It's easier for them to push the lie that, without affirmation and access to women's resources, half of them will commit suicide, because who would want that?

As KO has amply demonstrated in this case, the trans side has very little in the way of facts, to support their condition, let alone logic. They say it's not a mental condition, but if affirmation is not given rapidly and unconditionally, then suicide is almost inevitable.

Resilient people with sound mental health are very unlikely to choose that route.

The result is performative righteous indigestion, blustering and shouting, in order to bully opponents into silence, or embarrassing them into making false admissions of being wrong, in order to calm the social media storm which results.

This article is ridiculous. They're trying to say that Kemi said "woke archeology", which she didn't. She was answering a question:

Q: A Museum of London report has bizarrely concluded that black people were more likely to die from medieval plague. Will the Minister for Women and Equalities ensure that such sensationalist research findings and woke archaeology have no impact at all on current health and pandemic policy?

A: I do agree. I am not even sure whether we can call it just sensationalist or woke. The research apparently was based on phrenology, which is a completely discredited type of science. I agree with my hon. Friend that this type of research is damaging to trust, to social cohesion and even to trust in health services. I have written to the director of the Museum of London to express my concern.

hansard.parliament.uk/commons/2023-12-13/debates/1989F4B6-7F48-464D-B2F2-415CE6C15F1C/OralAnswersToQuestions

And yes, phrenology is very, very far from reliable!!!

This article, her appearance at the despatch box, and now the WESC. Why are there so many people, so invested in trying to pin words and phrases on Kemi which she has never said? Oh, and that time Nokes tried to trip her up over boys identifying into staying on the girls' dorm in boarding schools.

Do none of her Parliamentary colleagues or the media actually listen to what she says?

What is this fixation of some parts of the progressive media that a particular politician, Kemi Badenoch, needs to be undermined for expressing views that are different to what they'd like to hear? Is there something special about KB that means that her expressing these views is especially unacceptable?

Sadly that she should be the property of the left is likely to be playing a part. If you want to see this ideology at its ugliest have a gay person, a T person, or someone of any other minority, not say what it wants them to say: it's vicious.

In essence this witch must be punished and burnt because there's a major danger that she will make people think in ways that does not suit the ideology.

The Independent is totally captured.

At around 16:54:50 KO starts to talk about the increase in reported hate crime towards trans people.

KO describes an 11% increase in reported crime as 'staggering'.

As a visual aid, would it be reasonable to describe the difference between one pile of 10 Tunnocks tea cakes and a second of 11 as staggering?

An 11% increase does not seem staggering especially given the general increase in reporting of hate crime in recent years.

Using 'staggering' in this context seems to show KO choosing words to deliberately inflame the debate - precisely what KB is talking about.

Is there something special about KB that means that her expressing these views is especially unacceptable?

Well yes, of course. Because she speaks in a straightforward manner and is believable.

ie she is the one most likely to undermine their stance and how they frame the issue.

eg No LGB without the T. Whereas she is blatantly saying they should be separate!

I know many commenting here dont see it that way (and I dont) but I have a terrible feeling that some people watching this (which I have only just had time to do) will think KO is such a nice quietly spoken woman, being dilligent, checking her facts through her previous research (actually spoonfed Stonewall "facts") and this horrid assertive women is just being too hard on her. ie its all KB's fault for being so confident and self assured, and is intimidating poor nervous KO!

CheckingTheNumbers · Today 21:24

As a visual aid, would it be reasonable to describe the difference between one pile of 10 Tunnocks tea cakes and a second of 11 as staggering? An 11% increase does not seem staggering especially given the general increase in reporting of hate crime in recent years.

Reporting an incident isn't the same as the incident actually being a crime, nor even that it actually happened. See these pages going back years for the sort of harassment carried out, by bad faith bullies! KO has picked her position and no amount of hard facts and reasoning are going to budge her from her righteous (as she sees it) position.

KB: No, no. You said I said the word disease.
**
KO: I don’t know! Did you?
**
Of course I didn’t
**
KB: So you don’t even know where that came from. Where did you get that from? Where did you get that from?
**
KO: I’m not here to answer your questions.

I wondered what she was doing with her phone, looking at it, clearly referring to it. Not sure how this could happen, but at the very least, whatever she’’s reading seems to be feeding her words that she doesn’t seem wholly aware that she’s making.

A 11% increase is staggering and yet a 4000% increase seems not to trouble KO.

Yes: Kemi is Black and female. @Froodwithatowel summarised it well. As a Black woman, Kemi is expected to be aligned with the left. She refuses to be, so she must be punished and discredited.

The only thing the left (with the notable exception of some of the communist groups) hate more than a minoritised person with rightist political beliefs is a doubly-minoritised person with rightist political beliefs, such as Kemi. When minoritised people reject identity politics, it undermines the modern left because identity politics has replaced economic and reproductive class politics for the left. TERF-bashing is a subset of this hatred, notable only by its vitriol. Why do you think they go after lesbians and Black women the hardest?

I think it's a form of entitlement to think that someone "belongs" to you or "your side" and should parrot your beliefs because they aren't white, aren't male, or both. I also think it's racist and sexist and an instructive example of the left's hypocrisy in that they tell us to call out racism and sexism but indulge in it themselves "for the cause".

nauticant · Today 21:48

A 11% increase is staggering and yet a 4000% increase seems not to trouble KO.

"Yeah yeah, blah blah, something something, but that's different, because..."

Just catching up on this, I can’t believe Noakes called out KB on using the word explosion in the numbers of natal girls being referred to gender clinics but not providing any ‘data’. Isn’t that massive % hike, and known fact, part of the reason the Cass review was started??

And we are still told to vote Labour because of the "bigger picture".