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Kemi Badenoch to face Women & Equalities Committee’s questions on equalities issues - 13 December 2023

257 replies

IwantToRetire · 13/12/2023 17:43

Sorry I am sure there was a thread started in preparation for this but cant find it.

Happy to delete this if someone can give me link as search hasn't.

Still happening I think,

https://committees.parliament.uk/event/19766

https://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/41208ebe-60ce-4f19-99d4-0edc4e99e384

Parliamentlive.tv

Women and Equalities Committee

https://parliamentlive.tv/event/index/41208ebe-60ce-4f19-99d4-0edc4e99e384

OP posts:
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13
Ereshkigalangcleg · 14/12/2023 16:20

I recall a tweet (X) boasting that a report was going to be issued that research had proved being trans was genetic.

It was TRA Steph Richards' (of endometriosis charity CEO notoriety) trans rights organisation "Translucent" who made that claim and quickly dropped it.

RoyalCorgi · 14/12/2023 16:20

Sisterpita · 14/12/2023 14:12

Kate Osbourne has doubled down and written to Kemi requesting a formal apology.
https://x.com/kateosbornemp/status/1735279557169590560?s=61&t=W8z-NdrPTYy21FuiQuezcw

This is painful. She is in the category of "so stupid, she doesn't even realise she's stupid".

How can she not see that she lost that argument with KB fair and square? Any normal person would want to move on and hope everyone forgets about the moment where you made a fool of yourself, not draw attention to it.

LizzieSiddal · 14/12/2023 16:21

PronounssheRa · 14/12/2023 15:01

What really worries me is, if labour win the next election, people like Kemi might lose their seat while people like Kate Osbourne could drive through laws without any meaningful challenge. That is genuinely terrifying.

It worries me too and that’s why the Tory’s must sort it out before the next election, if they really want to protect women and girls they can get on as do it ASAP.
But as I said above I really don’t think they will, Kemi will be shouting for action, but they’ll leave it for an election fight.

Kucinghitam · 14/12/2023 16:21

KO's letter may as well have said:

I am a Good People, and therefore everything I say/do is Good. You are a Bad People, and therefore everything you say/do is Bad. Therefore, you must apologise to me.

Would have had the exact same meaning, and taken everybody less time to parse.

rogdmum · 14/12/2023 16:24

Having a massive increase in numbers of children who are gender distressed/dysphoric is objectively A BAD THING. Kemi wasn’t calling those children a near epidemic, she was calling the increase in GD numbers where they didn’t exist before, an epidemic and it was completely appropriate to do so. An increase in suffering children, regardless of whether you think shunting them down the medical pathway is the right thing to do or not, is NOT GOOD.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 14/12/2023 16:26

Kate Osborne is awful. Here she is earlier this year (with replies turned off, obvs) clutching her pearls about Suella Braverman giving Helen Joyce as her MP summer reading recommendation:

"The Home Sec suggesting MPs read this book is a disgrace, it shows a lack of respect for equality laws in this country & is yet more evidence of this Govt desire to attack the trans community in a divisive culture war."

x.com/kateosbornemp/status/1682443975616077824?s=46&t=SPorwN-mokktL467rcZ57g

Cailleach1 · 14/12/2023 16:35

KO seems to currently insist that the use of ‘epidemic’ only means calling the related subject a disease. If KO really believes this, that makes her look awful as KO herself used the word epidemic in relation to children in poverty. According to her expressed view, that would mean that she was referring to those impoverished children themselves as a disease.

KB was using epidemic as the sudden great increase in something sense. KO doesn’t have that to fall back on in relation to her utterances, as she has made clear she only interprets it as meaning disease.

nauticant · 14/12/2023 16:36

This is the source of the "epidemic claim" by KO:

I would say almost an epidemic of young gay children young gay children being told that they are trans and being put on a medical pathway for irreversible decisions and they are regretting it that is what I'm doing for for for young LGBT children I am making sure I am making sure that young people do not find themselves sterilized because they are being because they are being exploited by people who do not understand what these issues are and I am saying this on the advice of clinicians I'm saying this on the advice of academics there are clinicians from the Tavistock who have been whistle going talking about what these talking about what these issues are.

Cailleach1 · 14/12/2023 16:42

Mind you, it is beyond belief when KO seems to disagree that biological sex exists. However, having heard her reading from her phone and speaking in that Committee, it is not hard to believe that KO finds many things difficult to understand.

ILikeDungs · 14/12/2023 16:54

This is painful. She is in the category of "so stupid, she doesn't even realise she's stupid".

That reminded me of the Ashley MacIssac song What an Idiot He Is

"He doesn't even know what an idiot he is
He says: "What's an idy idy?" Lord have pity!"

catduckgoose · 14/12/2023 16:57

I'm glad Kate Osbourne is on this committee, as she does a fantastic job of showing some of the idiocy that comes out of the transactivist side.

Kemi Badenoch did an excellent job in how she responded to Osbourne's nonsense.

GailBlancheViola · 14/12/2023 16:58

KB saying that the reaction and language from KO was the problem was absolutely spot on.

I thought KB's comment about policy was excellent, that the Legislative Chamber is there to legislate on facts and objectively and not on emotion.

Datun · 14/12/2023 17:00

This is where the sleight of hand is. If you have adult men identifying as women, the need is to create an adult child to justify it.

We hear, all the time, that these men knew when there were three, five, seven, etc.

So children showing up at gender clinics are the mini versions of those men.

They need the children to justify their adult choices.

Little surprise that they don't want anyone, least of all a government minister, saying that the increase in these children is a bad thing that needs addressing. And not only that, that some of the reasons for them claiming they are trans, are to be removed, like social contagion and genderbread bollocks being taught in school.

Which is why it also gets likened to section 28.

Trying to claim that teaching an unevidenced ideology, (which, in my opinion, is designed purely to uphold late transitioning men), is the same as not teaching children about homosexuality.

it's straightforward, very basic, TRA speak.

And Kemi is totally wised up to it.

Hydrahelix · 14/12/2023 17:03

I wonder who prepared her for that committee meeting. Was it Stonewall? I assume she didn't go in unbriefed. I wonder where her allegations against KB came from? I would suggest that a) Stonewall choose their ambassadors more carefully in future if they don't want to shoot themselves in the foot again and that b) anyone being briefed by Stonewall double checks and verifies everything they're told and their own research. When you make a serious allegation you need to be able to back it up confidently, preferably by brandishing a printout as evidence.

PronounssheRa · 14/12/2023 17:04

Just a little reminder, which helps explain Osbornes position

I look forward to working with them in the future

Kemi Badenoch to face Women & Equalities Committee’s questions on equalities issues - 13 December 2023
catduckgoose · 14/12/2023 17:07

I disagree with KB on the predators versus trans framing she used as an argument to protect single-sex spaces. The issue is male versus female. No male should be in female-only spaces, whether he's a predator or not a predator or trans-identifying or not trans-identifying. Perhaps it was necessary political rhetoric but it still gives these men a foot in the door.

GoudaThunkIt · 14/12/2023 17:08

There was a selfie with Jane Ozanne prior to the meeting. Maybe it’s me, but I found it odd she was reading questions off her phone, like they had been sent to her and not considered by her. Like I say, I could be barking up the wrong tree with this.

catduckgoose · 14/12/2023 17:09

Hydrahelix · 14/12/2023 17:03

I wonder who prepared her for that committee meeting. Was it Stonewall? I assume she didn't go in unbriefed. I wonder where her allegations against KB came from? I would suggest that a) Stonewall choose their ambassadors more carefully in future if they don't want to shoot themselves in the foot again and that b) anyone being briefed by Stonewall double checks and verifies everything they're told and their own research. When you make a serious allegation you need to be able to back it up confidently, preferably by brandishing a printout as evidence.

It looked like she was reading questions off her phone, I wouldn't be surprised if it was a document sent to her from one of those transactivist charities.

RebelliousCow · 14/12/2023 17:09

It's quite clear that nobody on that committee with any interest in Gender identity had actually read the Cass Review nor had they taken any trouble to look at the mounting evidence and testimonies of those working in GIDS, especially at the Tavistock. This information has been available for years,
but, clearly, if you a true believer you simply must refuse to countenance any evidence that points out the structural defects in your belief system.

RebelliousCow · 14/12/2023 17:11

RebelliousCow · 14/12/2023 17:09

It's quite clear that nobody on that committee with any interest in Gender identity had actually read the Cass Review nor had they taken any trouble to look at the mounting evidence and testimonies of those working in GIDS, especially at the Tavistock. This information has been available for years,
but, clearly, if you a true believer you simply must refuse to countenance any evidence that points out the structural defects in your belief system.

Edited

That many of the gay clinicians, for one, in the Tavistock felt deeply uncomfortable about what they were witnessing regarding the 'transing' of gay children.

Helleofabore · 14/12/2023 17:17

Ereshkigalangcleg · 14/12/2023 16:20

I recall a tweet (X) boasting that a report was going to be issued that research had proved being trans was genetic.

It was TRA Steph Richards' (of endometriosis charity CEO notoriety) trans rights organisation "Translucent" who made that claim and quickly dropped it.

I remember. That was hilarious. It was supposedly peer reviewed and everything. It just disappeared.

There was so much discussion about if it was 'genetic' then it would be very easy to make future diagnosis. After that, crickets were heard everywhere! And tumbleweeds rolled.

ResisterRex · 14/12/2023 17:17

RebelliousCow · 14/12/2023 17:09

It's quite clear that nobody on that committee with any interest in Gender identity had actually read the Cass Review nor had they taken any trouble to look at the mounting evidence and testimonies of those working in GIDS, especially at the Tavistock. This information has been available for years,
but, clearly, if you a true believer you simply must refuse to countenance any evidence that points out the structural defects in your belief system.

Edited

It seems like people don't want to. Eg Bryant having to listen to Kemi talk about this very issue

DrBlackbird · 14/12/2023 17:26

Crouton19 · 14/12/2023 16:00

Having watched the whole thing through, I am really quite shocked at how unintelligent many of the MPs on that committee appear to be. KB must have spent about half of the session saying "that's for another department, not this one". Do these MPs really not know who does what? KB even had to explain the protected characteristics at one point.

This was my exact same thought. Along the lines of ‘oh my god, I cannot believe that these people are the ones making decisions on running the country’. As a result of KB, I’ve become more interested in parliamentary tv and now interested to gauge if this lack of comprehension and understanding runs more deeply amongst our elected representatives. Plus, watching the likes of KO confirms that I cannot, in good conscience, vote Labour.

Hydrahelix · 14/12/2023 17:27

GoudaThunkIt · 14/12/2023 17:08

There was a selfie with Jane Ozanne prior to the meeting. Maybe it’s me, but I found it odd she was reading questions off her phone, like they had been sent to her and not considered by her. Like I say, I could be barking up the wrong tree with this.

I didn't notice that. I'm going to have to go back and watch again.

And Mermaids.... No wonder KO came across like a complete idiot.