Prof Jo Phoenix vs The OU - Employment Tribunal Thread 6

[ickky]

Started on 2nd October at Watford Employment Tribunal (Radius House, 51 Clarendon Rd, Watford WD17 1HP 01923 281750)

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URGENT CURRENT CASE - Public Access Request - J Phoenix - The Open University - 3322700/2021

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Abbreviations

JP - Jo Phoenix, Claimant (C)
OU - The Open University, Respondent (R)
J - Regional Employment Judge Young
P - Panel or panel member
BC - Ben Cooper KC, Counsel for C
JM - Jane Mulcahy KC, Counsel for R
OU Departments & Networks:
HWSRA - Health & Wellbeing Strategic Research Area
FASS - Faculty of Arts and Social Sciences
SPC - Dept of Social Policy & Criminology
KMi - Knowledge Media Institute
GCRN - Gender Critical Research Network

OU witnesses

PB - Dr Paraskevi Boukli, Former Senior Lecturer Criminology, Deputy Head SPC 2021-22
IF - Prof Ian Fribbance Dean of FASS
MW - Prof Marcia Wilson, Dean EDI, 2020-23
CM - Caragh Molloy, Group People Director 2019-23
LD - Dr Leigh Downes, Senior Lecturer in Criminology (in SPC), Academic Lead for EDI FASS 2019-21
PK - Peter Keogh, Professor Health & Society, Member RSSH
CW - Dr Christopher Williams, Senior Lecturer History
KS - Kevin Shakesheff. PVC for Research and Innovation
DD - Dr Deborah Drake, Senior Lecturer Criminology, Head of SPC 2018-21
CT - Catherine Tomlinson, Senior Student Advisor
LW - Louise Westmarland, Prof of Criminology, Co-Deputy Head SPC, 2018-21, Current Head SPC
JD - John Domingue, Prof of Computing Science, Director KMi, 2015-22
SD - Shaun Daley, Head OU’s Resourcing Hub. Head Strategic Resources, Co-Chair OU’s LGBT+ Staff Network
HBC - Helen Bowes-Catton, Lecturer Social Research Methods
NS - Nicola Snarey, Assoc Lecturer Eng Language
NatS - Natalie Starkey, Outreach & Public Engagement Officer Sch Physical Sciences, 2019-22
CT - Cath Tomlinson, Senior Student Advisor
SJ - Samantha Jacobson, Employee Relations Case Manager
RH - Richard Holliman, Prof Engaged Research, Head School Environment, Earth & Ecosystem Sciences, 2019-22. Member of Investigation Panel investigating the C’s grievance

Witness for JP:

SE - Sarah Earle, Professor Modern History Uni of Oxford, Founding member GCRN

Tribunal Tweets - twitter.com/tribunaltweets

TT coverage so far - https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/professor-jo-phoenix-v-the-open-university

Prof Jo Phoenix Witness Statement (scroll to bottom of page and download)

jophoenix.substack.com/p/phoenix-v-open-university?sd=pf

Thread 1 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4905118-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-2nd-october-whispers-ben-cooper?page=1

Thread 2 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4913946-prof-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-thread-2?page=1

Thread 3 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4917480-prof-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-thread-3

Thread 4 www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4918479-prof-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-thread-4

Thread 5 https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4919223-prof-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-thread-5

JP had tried to talk to people by setting up the network and letting anyone join FFS.

Fact is nothing she could say at this point would be right other than full bowing down before the temple of Gender Ideology and refuting all previous utterances

Bloody hell

LM: (I'm paraphrasing) I didn't say she should get counselling but 'career coaching'.

Would that be coaching to not focus on biology?

BC: That is not true, that is you dissembling
LM: it is true
BC: Look at your own notes....." I suggested she use the confidential 'counselling' hotline"

Oooh she's denying it even though it's written down!

These people are unbelievable.

Also, how do TT do it I can't type fast enough.

BC: I don't understand why you're not telling the truth about this.

Ah, I see 'counselling' is self identifying as 'career counselling now' or something

BC: That is not true Prof W. You are dissembling. Reads - I suggested she use the counselling hotline

LM: In mtg I suggested JP find a career coach

BC: but she was expressing upset re her relations in dept.

LM: JP said she thought it was her dream job, hadn't turned out as she thought, taken a pay cut, was unhappy [said in a couldn't care less, hard-cheese-her kind of way]

yes.

So, three of this witnesses real friends complained and asked her to have a 'friendly word' about Jo's opinion. But.... did this witness ever say this to her apparent real friends who expressed so much distress?

Ahh... the racist uncle is now mentioned.

Seems like a really clear open and shut case of workplace bullying to me (however IANtheJudge or Panel)

LW hotly denies that she said racist uncle
BC did she hallucinate it?

BC: you drew racist uncle analogy

LM: absolutely not

BC: So when JP told others about it then she was hallucinating or making it up

The hero worship of the HoD seems really unprofessional. I feel sorry for the students.

Justin is being pretty unprofessional, in the comments, actually, and he's not being truthful that new participants disturb the Judge.

Well they would if he didn't mute them as they enter. It is in no way disturbing, it is just an excuse.

This is so horrible to hear, these are supposed academics, but the sort of people who liked to give you kicking behind the sixth form block when they were at school.

I wonder if LW will be rewarded for her loyalty.

Either (a) It would make me look bad or (b) I wouldn't know what the truth was if it stood in front of me waving a neon sign saying I am the truth or (c) both

This witness is a lying horror.

<wonders if Justin is angling for a transfer to the OU and demonstrating his 'randomly vile to women' credentials....>

BC is drawing out how they are unwilling to accept anything Jo has said as true.

So if JP said 'would you like a cup of tea' with their level of double think they could quite easily 'remember' (make up for the purposes of burning the witch) that as 'I hate all transpeople'. I really think that was how bad it was.

Funny how LM can be categorical about 'how those words never passed my lips' but can't remember so much else. Lack of credibility.

BC: reads c LM no recollection of saying racist uncle. That's more accurate. May not recall

LM: those words have never passed my lips. I hadn't heard that expression before . I believe it's a Americanism

Oh that nice LM was going to make sure JP had a ticket for the Christmas lunch

Probably there will be a special medal minted. Stalin was very fond of medals for loyalty.

I'm confused about who is being questioned at the moment - who is LM?

LW - ( re racist uncle)Those words have never passed my lips. An American expression I believe. I deffo, deffo didn't say it.

Wow, this bit comes across as ridiculously snide and dismissive -

'BC: she was crying
LW: sniffling into a tissue that I gave her'

Sorry LW not LM

Ah! Was a bewildered there! Thanks.