Would you vote Tory if Kemi Badenoch was Tory the party leader and the election was tomorrow?

[lechiffre55]

Just curious to see what the answers here might be.
Would you vote Tory if Kemi Badenoch was the Tory party leader and the election was tomorrow?
Feel free to answer any way you like, and I don't care about derailing. The question is quite tongue in cheek, don't take it too seriously, and have fun with it if you want, rant if you want. I'm trying to get a picture of the MN mood.

Well it’s been comprehensively swallowed by the centre left now

The UK is pushing back a bit which is good

Whether that will last is concerning

They were taken over some time ago by right-wing fanatics from the Brexit party/UKIP and got rid of many decent, honourable MPs.
They haven't been Conservative for some time.
Margaret Thatcher would treat most of the current shower with contempt.

Odd to think that they'd regard her as left wing and wet.

Of course you don't have to justify yourself. It would be interesting to hear your reasons, especially since so many people wouldn't vote for. And especially since we know she actually isn't very honest (see trade deals for an example).

I don't like Kemi Badenoch policies or her voting record, and wouldn't vote for her based on that. But I don't fear her because she seems to be an honest politician. I think she could be persuaded to change her mind on many issues, if you could present her with a factual argument.

Penny Mordaunt and other fair weather politicians scare me in a way I find difficult to explain. I can't trust politicians who don't do politics based on facts or their political beliefs, and are prepared to use the HOC in the way she did - to be popular with the other officers in her mess.

Since this is in the feminist section I remember hearing a female politician say it would be good when women have a range of views from left to right in the same way as men do

It’s good they differ, we start to get women across the board

Versus Starmer et al? Yes, absolutely

Here's Alicia Kearns writing about it.
https://conservativehome.com/2021/12/07/alicia-kearns-lets-interrogate-the-attacks-on-the-conversion-therapy-ban/

N O W A Y

Still looking at Canada and Australia (also see Spain, Scotland & Wales) as models of what happens when a socialist gender-supporting gov gets power. Don’t love the tories, but I’d put up with quite a lot of shit to keep my children safe from that.

As said up thread, I was more bemused by the comments in the Chat survey, because despite many thinking the policies she supports are good, it was the comments about her being a liar etc., that made me wonder.

Because on FWR, even those who in principle dont support her because she is a Tory, I got the feeling most thought her honest and straighforward.

But in the world outside of the FWR she is apparently seen as a liar.

Wouldn't want to vote Labour or Tory (whoever is in charge).

However, I don't want women's rights decimated so have to vote Tory (this time only hopefully) to stop the crackpots in Labour (lunatics, asylum etc.) setting us back over 100 years.

I can't see the comments. Did anyone mention Kneecap @IwantToRetire?

You have to do the survey to see the comments (you can just answer dont know throughout)

And cant remember much of comments but that at the time thought it odd many agreed in the survey section with her view points, but the acutal comments were all about her being a liar.

It is an argument, but I don't think a very persuasive one.

There are undoubtedly certain individuals who are in it wholly for themselves, narcissists and grifters. But those people jump on any movement that seems like it could give them power, whatever the political stripe.

But I've seen very little push around gender ideology among libertarians. SOme will argue that adults should have very free access to medical transition - provided they pay for it themselves. But few will argue the other parts about socially provided care, transition for kids, or the "gender feelings" bit. They also tend to be strong supporters of free speech and belief so that works against a lot of GI.

Have YouGov got rid of the daily poll?

It seems to be chat now which isn’t my thing

Yes.

Identity politics, of which this is an offshoot, is a longstanding target of criticism from Marxists. And some of the more left-wing organisations, individuals & publications have taken a GC position. I imagine they'd argue that 'the left' now isn't really very 'left' at all and also that right-of-centre critiques come from a much wider position of 'traditional family values', rather than a concern for women (& possibly a cynical way to try and maintain power).

There are libertarian pro-trans positions, although a lot is US, they won't all consider themselves on the left (they may reject left/right as a concept) & they may use different definitions of libertarianism. I'd agree that they wouldn't expect the government to be funding or pushing GI, but only because they don't think it should be doing anything.

https://www.libertarianism.org/columns/condition-transgender-women-libertarian-perspectives

https://www.queermajority.com/essays-all/the-libertarian-case-for-lgbt-rights

https://www.lp.org/gender-self-determination-is-not-governments-business/
https://www.transadvocate.com/5-questions-libertarian-feminism-and-trans-people_n_10038.htm

Anyway, I'm going to continue to annoy TRAs on SM by telling them they are a triumph of Thatcherite individualism 😁

They also tend to be strong supporters of free speech and belief so that works against a lot of GI.

Badenoch may oppose GI, but she's no fan of free speech.

Anyway, I'm going to continue to annoy TRAs on SM by telling them they are a triumph of Thatcherite individualism.

That's my tactic when political parties come a knocking. I open with "Have you heard what the Tories are doing to women's rights?" They've all engaged and I take it from there. It's a useful strategy.

Thatcher left the door open for these lunatics. There is no such thing as society yadda yadda. Well now there isn't. Enjoy.

Identity politics is criticized by classical Marxists, sure, but that does not mean it's either right wing, or conservative, or even libertarian.

It represents a split within Marxism. Classical Marxists can yell at supporters of gender ideology, or antiracist BLM type movements, or even the id pol contingents of feminism all they like that they aren't real Marxists, (though mostly they seem to say it about GI, Marxist criticisms of antiracist id pol and feminist id pol are think on the ground,) but it's a bit like Catholics yelling at Mormons that they aren't real Christians. Maybe they are right and the most important bits have been lost or turned on their heads, but there is no question there is a significant familial relation there.

The left includes other economic and political perspectives besides Marxism, too, so even if id pol isn't a kind of Marxism, it doesn't mean it comes from the right.

Have YouGov got rid of the daily poll?
It seems to be chat now which isn’t my thing

They do have a daily poll sometimes for more light hearted surveys.

But as i said upthread, before you get to the comment section which you dont have to bother with other than to see what others are saying, is a survey and as you answers questions you see % of how others have answered.

Exactly.
Actually worried by the numbers who cannot see this.

I'm not worried.🤷‍♀️ Most people will be voting for a better future in the next GE. Its only here that people claim to be "single issue" voters but somehow find themselves unable or unwilling to vote for parties like Reform or GG's party.

This is not a 'single issue' anyway. Women's rights and children's safeguarding are human rights issues that intersect in politically significant ways with social policy, education, the health service, the law, employment rights, the media, and more. Pretty broad and deep, really.

Yes