Glinner calling women "handmaidens"

[ftmquestions]

Respect to glinner for speaking up but does anyone else consider his use of the term "handmaiden" grating? I don't like men calling women sexist names because they don't agree with him. Not one to criticise usually, cba with purity politics etc - and he can say what he likes - but I just wondered if I was alone in this making me bristle slightly

@FriendlyNeighbourhoodTrans There are sufficient commonalities between the beliefs and activities of JK Rowling and Posie Parker that having one term to describe them both (but which distinguishes them from non-feminist transphobes like Donald Trump) is useful...

I think "woman" is the main commonality. You know how "Terf" is used in the abuse of women. You know it's misogynistic hate speech, part of the MVAWG spectrum. Here you are, using it.

Says it all, really. Misogyny writ large.

There's an interesting chapter in Brendan O'Neill's new book about the hijab.
He points out that while Iranian women are protesting against being forced to wear the hijab, risking their lives and dying because of it, western women are being called Islamophobes when we stand with our sisters and point out the problems with it.
That's not Islamophobia. It's the same old shit of men casting around for an excuse to condemn women who speak up against misogyny.

It was that he threatened to kill 3 fellow comedians (all women) rather than those protestors - Aisling Bea, Sara Pascoe and Cariad Lloyd.
So... I went and looked this up since you didn't give any evidence and same as fucking usual, his comments were obviously sarcasm based on what he was quote tweeting and the rest of the tweet. The 'Durr' made that bloody obvious. It was a flippant sarcastic response. Anyone thinking it was remotely serious is either seriously hard of thinking or taking it in extremely bad faith.
There are actual death threats being aimed at women out there. Plenty to choose from too. Why not condemn those instead of practically dislocating your arm with such an incredible reach?

Why not condemn those instead of practically dislocating your arm with such an incredible reach?

Where's the fun in that when @FriendlyNeighbourhoodTrans can berate women and demonise Glinner?

If memory serves, the gist of the message sequence started with him saying Bea and Pascoe would 'have to' consider something or other, and a bloke tweeted, absurdly, 'or else what will you do to them'?'

It was that absurdity he was mocking.

Can this be the subtitle of the board please?

If @FriendlyNeighbourhoodTrans posts a single transphobic thing JKR has ever written, I'll donate a tenner to any UK charity of their choice.

I'm aware. I've read Dworkin before, but thanks for the recommendation.

I was speaking of individuals, not an entire movement. In the context of Keen's thread I was referring to that brand of second-waver who viewed any emotional, sexual or financial connection with males as some form of sell-out - the likes of Valerie Solanas who were in a niche minority - given these were the kinds of silly accusations they'd levelled at her.

This isn't to suggest radical feminism is reducible to that attitude, nor to dismiss the whole body of its complex philosophies, debates and ideas. I'd have thought my post made that clear.

As for feminists I happen to disagree with, if we are talking in generalities, the second-wave radicals were not only relevant and necessary in the context of women's lives in the 60s and 70s, but were very prescient as to what's now happening in the 21st century. If anything, I find far more in common with those earlier feminists than the 'liberals' or various facets of the third-wave who insist the job of 'feminism' is to tackle all gendered ills, or even world-ills beyond those, whilst (yet again) leaving women at the bottom of the scrap-heap.

Women who sell out women, and then cry 'you're a misogynist' if you point out that unpalatable fact, are part of the problem Glinner is referring to here. And I agree with him.

If it doesn't centre women, then it isn't feminism.

What could be the collective name for women who cheerfully allow predatory men in to women and girls spaces and who center men's feelings over the rights of vulnerable women and girls?

Traitors?
Brainwashed idiots?
Dangerous.
Safeguarding risks.

These women work in service to men and mens fetishes in a bid for male approval and a rainbow badge.

Dworkin of course lived with John Stoltenberg, a gay man who has told the world on her behalf that her radical interrogation of gender would have put her closer to team TRA (TIRF?) than team TERF. Kathleen MacKinnon has said similar.

Dworkin did very explicitly assert that transcending gender stereotypes would mean the end of transsexuality. I think she also made some comment to the effect that a mtf 'transsexual' (she assumed maximum surgery rather than mere assertion) was an epitome of the femininity construct that she so opposed.

I always marvel at the cheek of the TRAs calling KLK islamophobic when the real problem for Muslim women is the invasion of women's private spaces by so-called transwomen.

This thread was enlightening. Thank you to those explaining the meaning and origins of the word handmaiden. I learnt a lot.

I think gliner just had a harsh manner. He swears a lot. Calls people stupid a lot in his videos etc. I don't object to his use of the word.

I don't think there is a more appropriate word. Collaborators for example implies intent and while many handmaidens have intent to erode the rights and protections of women and children some are just swept up with "be kind"

Side note I just watched that video of glinner linked earlier in this thread and he said lia Thomas had (think it was twitter) one account that's all nice we just want to play sports just want to live and a second secret account that came out recently where he's been admitting to being AGP. If anyone knows anything about this I would be interested to learn more on it.

Collaborator at least has a very objective assertion of involvement with an clear enemy, usually a military invasion of some kind.

I don't think I've ever heard Uncle Tom used in a way that was similar. It's not impossible, though it's difficult to imagine a scenario like that in most western countries as there is no real equivalent to that kind of invading army.

It's pretty much exclusively used like TERF, to accuse people who have political views someone doesn't like and try and shame them into toeing the what some person asserts is the right viewpoint for members of said group (if you don't vote for me you ain't really black."

I don't think I've ever heard Uncle Tom used in a way that was similar. It's not impossible, though it's difficult to imagine a scenario like that in most western countries as there is no real equivalent to that kind of invading army.

You're displaying a surprising ignorance of American apartheid and the Civil Rights movement there, @DemiColon. I wouldn't brag about it if I were you.

Just catching up on this thread. It seems this past week we have had two male people post who show us that despite the labels they attach to themselves, what they write is misogynistic. I believe they are likely to be so in real life too.

Why wouldn’t they be, just because they also may self describe as being wonderfully balanced, respected and ever so womanly? When they come to MN, the posts are so loud in the misogynistic thinking and attitude.

And all the time we are told by some people that some male people pass completely. They are so offended when you point out their misogynistic attitudes will be very clear on occasion. It is a reliable cue. Or maybe they lie in real life and let it all hang out to see for us.

Either way, it is there. How can it not be considering the demands of any trans activism where transitioned males are expected to be treated as if they were female?

Side note I just watched that video of glinner linked earlier in this thread and he said lia Thomas had (think it was twitter) one account that's all nice we just want to play sports just want to live and a second secret account that came out recently where he's been admitting to being AGP. If anyone knows anything about this I would be interested to learn more on it.

Someone who interviewed Riley Gaines did some research.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4743853-riley-gainesjake-crain-lia-thomas-exposed

https://twitter.com/JakeCrain_/status/1625866875149090817?s=09

And a link to Barry/EDIJester's bit on it, which was the key to track down the above...

@NecessaryScene

Thank you!