Glinner calling women "handmaidens"

[ftmquestions]

Respect to glinner for speaking up but does anyone else consider his use of the term "handmaiden" grating? I don't like men calling women sexist names because they don't agree with him. Not one to criticise usually, cba with purity politics etc - and he can say what he likes - but I just wondered if I was alone in this making me bristle slightly

I want out Ted. Just because ya have one good idea , doesn't mean you have to have another one and another one and another one !
I'm sorry Ted!

Maybe Glinner will give me 1% for the title though 😂

I half remember Glinner saying on a podcast interview that it’s been suggested that he write about his experience but that he felt he can’t write about TRAs or that scene because it’s too strange and humourless and the politics is too awful and painful and wierd for comedy in a kind of ‘you couldn’t make it up’ kind of way (sorry if I misquote, was a while ago! If he’s on here, please correct the record)

I really love the idea of a comedy about the GC crowd as the resistance to that movement, and in the comedy you’d never quite get to see who they’re opposing but you’d get to represent some awesome funny women and a few good men. Write what you know and write what you see etc

Hope you get the 1%

Ha! 1% of 1% would do me.

Actually, in the event I win Euromillions , I would defo give GL a million for a small share of Fr.Ted the musical.

(Sorry if I "at" the wrong people to the wrong remarks here, just trying to reply to a couple of peoples' points in one go)

@BezMills Re Posie Parker's close working relationship with far-right individuals and organisations: her wikipedia page gives a few examples, but I'm going to post this arcticle as it lists a few more and in is in a more consensed format https://www.thenational.scot/news/23299549.posie-parker-anti-trans-founder-standing-women/. It mentions the time she was dropped by a terf group for islamaphobia, her support for Tommy Robinson, allegations of white nationalism (she has a habit of "accidentally" sharing her platform with neo-nazis over and over again, including just a few months ago in New Zealand) and a few other things.

@SerafinasGoose On the question of whether "Terf" is appropriate for someone who is not a "radical" feminist but does describe herself as a "woman's rights activist". Thank you for your summary of the origins of "radical" feminism, you clearly have some knowledge of that bit of history and I'm not going to quibble whether or not Posie Parker's activities fall within that "radical" tradition. However, I do think that terf is an appropriate term to use for her because it aligns with how the term is popularly used within discourse - which is to describe individuals who are transphobic or who promote trasphobic views or policies, and who justify their position in the name of feminism. There are sufficient commonalities between the beliefs and activities of JK Rowling and Posie Parker that having one term to describe them both (but which distinguishes them from non-feminist transphobes like Donald Trump) is useful, even if their beliefs are not exactly the same. After all, not everyone who calls themselves "Gender Critical" is "critical" of "gender" in the narrow sense.

@Trextet You're right! It was that he threatened to kill 3 fellow comedians (all women) rather than those protestors - Aisling Bea, Sara Pascoe and Cariad Lloyd. That was my first recollection of events, but I thought I must have been wrong since the sources I found online didn't corroborate that. Thanks for digging that out!

I try to give a bit of leeway on sources but...the National? Seriously? Nationally derided perhaps.

That's a lot of words to say nothing of value.

The National 😄

twitter.com/shiny02/status/1526571293759488001?s=20

What sort of twat tries to introduce us to Posie, as if we haven't known her for years?

I do think that men is an appropriate term to use for men because it aligns with how the term is popularly used within discourse - which is to describe individuals who are adult, human and male.

A mansplaining sort of twat.

@Waitwhat23 I thought that source was okay for a short summary of her (didn't want to post anything too long so as not to derail the thread) given that each point in that article has a link to an appropriate source, but I can certainly admire your desire for sources that are as credible as possible :)

To that end, I hope you don't mind if I go through here every point listed in detail (not that I don't think it's worthwhile but again, I don't want to derail) but to take one instance, here is the primary source for the claim in the article of the terf group that had to distance itself from Posie Parker when it discovered her islamaphobia https://womansplaceuk.org/2022/06/22/womans-place-and-posie-parker/

Oh no - we have another one with KJK living rent free in their head trying to convince us with fake news that she's the devil incarnate? 😂

This has been done to death on here and women are perfectly able to decide for ourselves who we admire and who we disagree with without transactivists moaning about their odd little purity spirals.

We were there mate. We are a primary source.

Wikifuckingpedia.

Eye-roll to the mansplaining of feminism: the women on this board need to be educated and schooled into the correct way of thinking. Obvs.
The usual lazy grouping of Jk Rowling, Posie Parker with Trump and Tommy Robinson. Far right..Literal Nazis….Terfs..transphobes… Yawn Yawn.
This newbie to the board needs to stick around to learn a thing or too. The women on this board has seen worse off,
handmaidens, dick panderers and self-posturing men, amongst them all.
The sunshine proved too much for some, and they flee to Twitter to moan about the irredeemable terfs on this board. Waaaah waaah. Except now, post Elon Musk, Twittersphere is also eye rolling and yawning too.

I hope one day Glinner does write about this madness when it is all over. Still in the fray, and still too raw. But one day.

Just a few things if you want to use The National as a credible source. One of the 'appropriate source' links in that article is a tweet by Picklebee. 'I did it all for Beth' Picklebee. The one who made various violent threats against women. Picklebee links to the horrifically misogynist and aggressive Cabaret against Hate in that tweet. The 'series of counter protests' to 'protest facism' which were planned for the Glasgow Let Women Speak event failed to attend an actual fascist event taking place that same day in Glasgow. Much easier to shout at a bunch of women instead who hold views which are 'worthy of respect in a democratic society', right?

I would genuinely trust a newspaper written by sixth years than that embarrassment of a paper.

And have you actually read the Women's Place statement? Many of us here have differing views of PP. A quick peruse of the many, many threads on here will inform you of that. Have you read any? There are many differing views, as acknowledged by the Women's Place statement. Some people don't agree with Women's Place's approach either. It's not a monolith.

Posie is a worldwide phenomenon.

A woman's place, not so much.

They are the losers there, in my opinion.

I didn't notice any clear "Islamophobia" in those tweets, rather than just controversial opinion.

The comment about girls wearing the hijab, well some people may view it as sexist if girls are required to cover themselves in that way.

Obviously the burka is a more extreme example, and in that case, it would be widely recognised as oppressive to women.

The hijab isn't seen as being as bad, but it could be viewed as part of a culture that imposes such and such sexist requirements on women.

So does she have an "irrational fear" of Islam if she doesn't like the hijab? I don't see that this is proven.

There are people like that, but I don't think they are most people. Partly just based on people I know, but I suppose also because I think most people try to do more or less what they think is right. And the "never scribe to evil what can be explained through stupidity" principle, too.

I was thinking about all this today, and the closest comparison I can make is the way black conservatives in the US get called Uncle Toms, which is to say, race traitors.

I don't like it when it's used by anyone, but it is particularly inappropriate when white people say it to black people.

Those who defend use of the term would say exactly the same thing people here are - black conservatives are betraying other black people, they should be called out, etc.

@DemiColon, "Uncle Tom" and "Coconut" were the first things I thought of when being asked to consider "Handmaiden" as a sexist insult.

I judge it as not sexist, and the other two aren't racist. They're all epithets used to label traitors to their own kind, like "Collaborator" as mentioned upthread. They may be mislabelled on occasion, and surely don't always see themselves as traitors. But the words aren't sexist or racist, any more than Collaborateur/trice was anti-French.

I disagree with your view that people outside the demographic in question shouldn't use the term. You don't have to be French to talk about collaborators in occupied France.

Yes, but MJ used a great deal of surgery in attempts to turn himself into a version of what the surgeons had made of La Toya and Janet.
Women who have their bodies and features handed to them on a cisgender plate are clearly viewed by some as less worthy.

@TongueTwistr, what? You thought that comment was alluding to Jackson's cosmetic treatments?

I rather thought it was an observation that theatreland abhors the work of someone who defends women & children against erasure and medical abuse, yet celebrates the work of a paedophile.

The misogyny directed at women seeking to preserve penis-free spaces appears (to me at least) to view those who have changed their gender as superior to those who remain their birth-assigned sex.
Jackson's attempts to transform himself with his sisters' features seem to have similarities with others seeking to change their gender.
Like De Niro gaining 60 pounds for Raging Bull or Christian Bale losing 60 pounds for The Machinist, the transformational effort seems to confer a special status - often enough for paedophilia or other abuse to be ignored - and for the rights of others to be trampled.
Otherwise Rachel McKinnon, Lia Thomas, Athena Ryan and others wouldn't be lauded for smashing Women's records.

It was about sexualising little girls. Grown men who need little girls to cover up other wise they might not be able to control themselves.

It is all part of men being the problem that women and girls have to change their lives to facilitate.