Glinner calling women "handmaidens"

[ftmquestions]

Respect to glinner for speaking up but does anyone else consider his use of the term "handmaiden" grating? I don't like men calling women sexist names because they don't agree with him. Not one to criticise usually, cba with purity politics etc - and he can say what he likes - but I just wondered if I was alone in this making me bristle slightly

What was the context?

I’ve heard a few people using it to describe women who support TRAs. Personally I’d stop all the name calling and be more Michelle Obama ie. When they go low, you go high.

It's one of the most beloved insults on here for anyone who doesn't toe the party line...

Sadly FWR left "when they go low, we go high" years ago. I remember when that was the mantra though.

That's a lie

I would normally agree but in this case the women who are cheerfully handing over women’s protections and calling anyone who objects a bigot, are fair game for insults.

I think Glinner is brilliant

If a woman supports a woman-hating ideology then she's a handmaid/handmaiden.

I don't have a problem calling it out when I see it.

The most annoying thing of all is that Margaret Atwood herself actually supports the TRA line because her privileged status makes her completely unaffected by the reality of the ideology..
My opinion of her has tanked.
That's the only reason I have to avoid the term "handmaid".

I'm with Glinner and I called these male appeasers 'handmaidens' a long time ago.
But then it was just us Lesbians who were being sacrificed..

Namecalling? You mean like Terf, or witch or hag - the things we are routinely called by the TRAs? Yes indeed, ladies - don't forget to alway 'beeee kind', even when people are shitting all over you.

The time for be nice is over, when laws and language and policy is being changed that threatens our single sex spaces, and when children are being indoctrinated into this crap I don't give a shit about being kind anymore.

And it's usually used, by myself and others to describe women who debase themselves and other women in the service of mens rights activists.

I really don’t like the term and think it’s completely counterproductive in this debate. Insulting people (particularly an insult which suggests they don’t truly hold their own views) will never change their minds and is more likely to entrench them. So I’m against its use by Glinner or anyone else.

Handmaiden is a metaphorical term for something whose essential function is to serve or assist.

Seems fair enough to apply to those women who are hell bent on allowing males into female spaces.

Fuck em.

First post! Trans person here - having seen a little of what he's posted on Twitter and his blog thing (not too much, as I find his mental decline quite depressing to watch), it does seem like he feels entitled to the support of women in a way that he doesn't with men, and as such when any women falls on the wrong side of his Us vs Them dynamic he more often speaks in terms of "betrayal". Which sounds very patriarchal if you ask me...

In a similar vein, does it not bother Mumsnet that Linehan's last ban was for making death threats towards a group of women? Doesn't that puncture the illusion that he's in this for any reason other than it gives him a license to hate?

Because it's not just "handmaiden" he uses - he frequently accuses complete strangers of being groomers, paedophiles or some other form of irredeemable evil that means he doesn't have to treat them as people.

Take it up with him then. First rule of misogyny - women are responsible for what men do.

@FriendlyNeighbourhoodTrans
Glinner's behaviour is his own, if you don't like it, speak to him.
We merely comment on it. Mumsnet posters aren't a monolith, and each poster is responsible for their own opinion, as you are for yours. There's no collective responsibility, as I'm sure you are not here to speak for all trans women either.
As for handmaidens, I'm not sure who they're trying to please, as more will always be asked of them, and one wrong move and they're condemned to wear the scarlett GC anyway.

Is 'I remember when this was all fields' the new 'I'm as GC as they come but...'?

Interesting. Not what I predicted.

Let’s not get precious about language on here of all places. They ARE handmaids and anyone male or female can call them just that as it’s exactly what they are.

I think handmaiden sums it up nicely, and I don’t think we should police Graham
Lineham, he’s done amazing work for women

I think the total opposite. It’s the perfect term to describe exactly what they are - perfect little obliging servants who will happily sell their sisters down the river to please their misogynist masters. It’s not about ‘going low’, it’s about calling out.

@BigMaggieShoes @RoseslnTheHospital Believe me I'd love to if I could, but attempting dialogue with Linehan has repeatedly been shown to be pointless as he refuses to in any way engage with the arguments of anyone who disagrees with him. And how could he? His entire business model now relies on him being the terfiest terf to ever terf, so he can be a leader of a community and extract subscriptions from his followers. The prospect of a renewed comedy career or his musical are entirely unavailable to him now, so he's economically trapped himself in his present mode of existence. Also, he literally blocks everyone on his substack from commenting who does not pay him money :/

Was more just curious (since this thread seemed to be a discussion about his conduct) where the line was for different members of this forum when it came to the man and the various things he does.

Ugh. I hate it when men are said to speak for women. We can speak for ourselves, thanks. I can't understand why this dude gets so much attention on here. The it crowd was outright sexist. I haven't seen his other stuff. He's not a feminist icon ffs.

I’ve seen a few attempts to stop the use of the word ‘handmaiden’. Perhaps that’s because it perfectly describes some women

Nah. It's because we already live in a world full of gendered insults. We shouldn't perpetrate them. Also as a PP said, what's the advantage?

More deeply, everyone buys into the patriarchy to some extent. It's impossible not to, so it's unreasonable to blame individuals, just notice and see it as part of the problem. It's always been like this.

I always think the actual handmaidens were victims in the story. It was the Aunts who did the dirty work, they were the real misogynists. Aunt Lydia had this great line where she explained the 2 types of freedom, the freedom to and the freedom from. It gave me the shivers. Lydia and the other aunts were so sinister, because they were women. I am also baffled by M Attwood's stance. She predicted so much as a sort of horrible science fiction dystopia, but now that much of it has become reality she thinks it's fine? And we should all budge up and be kind?? It doesn't make any sense.
As for Glinner, I have no real opinion. I'm always suspicious of men claiming to be feminists. Maybe that's just my problem.

@FriendlyNeighbourhoodTrans I'm not particularly interested in him and quite obviously he doesn't speak for me, he speaks for himself only. I don't care if other people are interested in him and like what he says, I also don't care if they don't like what he says.

attempting dialogue with Linehan has repeatedly been shown to be pointless as he refuses to in any way engage with the arguments of anyone who disagrees with him
Gosh imagine that. The cheek of him.

no debate